The PAC 10 expansion groundswell

[ERCougar]

Lots of college football soothsayers (and there sure are a lot of those these days) say the MWC doesn't get AQ status without Utah in it. Now, if Kansas and some other Big 12 leftovers join, I think it would get AQ status.

Whatever. No one knows. Not even you, you warthog-faced buffoon.

I know cynicism regarding the BCS runs high around here and some of it is justified, but let's walk through this again:
BSU and TCU both go undefeated. Both of them make BCS games, BSU starts the season highly ranked (this should happen) and squeezes into the national championship game.

Then the new BCS rules come out at the end of the season and they completely ignore ignore the conference that placed two BCS teams, one of whom was in the BCS championship. The press (plenty of whom are anti-BCS) would have a field day. The timing is terrible and it would be a PR disaster. One that would be easily dispelled by throwing them the bone of an autobid.

(Note the lack of Utah anywhere in this scenario. We were on the cusp of a BCS autobid before, and BSU more than replaces them.)

[SeattleUte]

I know cynicism regarding the BCS runs high around here and some of it is justified, but let's walk through this again:
BSU and TCU both go undefeated. Both of them make BCS games, BSU starts the season highly ranked (this should happen) and squeezes into the national championship game.

Then the new BCS rules come out at the end of the season and they completely ignore ignore the conference that placed two BCS teams, one of whom was in the BCS championship. The press (plenty of whom are anti-BCS) would have a field day. The timing is terrible and it would be a PR disaster. One that would be easily dispelled by throwing them the bone of an autobid.

(Note the lack of Utah anywhere in this scenario. We were on the cusp of a BCS autobid before, and BSU more than replaces them.)

lol. ER=one man Cougarboard

[ERCougar]

I'm not disputing that. Utah will be in a much better position as a result of this. But from the PAC-10s perspective, how much more is it? Did they really score a home-run with the addition of Utah and Colorado? They get their conference championship game, what else? If the Big-12 survives I can't imagine a combined PAC-12/Big-12 TV network is still in play.

This is why I'd still be nervous as a Ute fan. Larry Scott is coming home with his tail between his legs, with everyone seeing him as being played by Texas and the B12, who even managed to dump on him some of their deadwood (CU). I don't think it's terribly clear that Utah brings any more than CU, TV-set wise, and it adds the pride-swallowing aspect of adding a mid major (part of the reason I'm skeptical BYU gets a B12 invite). Why add a 12th? Just make a championship game. I know it's neat and tidy and all to add Utah and Colorado, Scott has already shown he doesn't care much about neat and tidy.

[SeattleUte]

This is why I'd still be nervous as a Ute fan. Larry Scott is coming home with his tail between his legs, with everyone seeing him as being played by Texas and the B12, who even managed to dump on him some of their deadwood (CU). I don't think it's terribly clear that Utah brings any more than CU, TV-set wise, and it adds the pride-swallowing aspect of adding a mid major (part of the reason I'm skeptical BYU gets a B12 invite). Why add a 12th? Just make a championship game. I know it's neat and tidy and all to add Utah and Colorado, Scott has already shown he doesn't care much about neat and tidy.

SCOREBOARD

http://twitter.com/schadjoe

[Babs]

Didn't Shakespeare write a comedy about this?

[ERCougar]

lol. ER=one man Cougarboard

I hate to dispute the cougarboard aficionado ("I just read it for the tweets!"), but that's not smack. BSU has just as many BCS bowls and a better record. Numbers-wise, BSU substitutes for Utah well.

[KillerDog]

That wasn't your original argument. You talked about fighting for recruits and prestige. Also, Kansas' football program puts more butts in seats than Utah's and Kansas is in a bigger tv market. Neither Utah nor Kansas are natural rivals of Colordao but they are both about the same distance from Boulder with Utah getting the edge by being closer to other PAC 10 teams.

The only real issue is travel, well and the fact that Kansas is uglier than Oklahoma.....

Actually it was a component of my original argument. Kansas adds little except basketball prestige and that comes at a cost. The benefit of basketball prestige is not large compared to the benefit of football prestige. Therefore, the cost can be the same and yet still too large in one and not in the other.

[ERCougar]

SCOREBOARD

http://twitter.com/schadjoe

To continue in the Princess Bride vein,
"I do not think that means what you think it means."

[SeattleUte]

To continue in the Princess Bride vein,
"I do not think that means what you think it means."

So are you saying Pac stays at 11? Just making sure it's clear and we all understand what you're saying.

I know you always look at this Utah/BYU thing with such clear eyed objectivity, so it's important we get down what you're saying. It's especially interesting since NO ONE on the face of the earth is saying what you're saying. NOBODY.

[Babs]

I know you always look at this Utah/BYU thing with such clear eyed objectivity...

He's not unlike yourself in that regard.

[SeattleUte]

I hate to dispute the cougarboard aficionado ("I just read it for the tweets!"), but that's not smack. BSU has just as many BCS bowls and a better record. Numbers-wise, BSU substitutes for Utah well.

Then I wonder why the Pac is considering Utah but not Boise. Then again, I recognize that have scooped the entire planet in announcing Larry Scott will stay at 11.

[SeattleUte]

He's not unlike yourself in that regard.

Unlike him I don't deny the sun is shining when it is. He has written thousands of words claiming 2008 TCU was better than 2008 Utah and 2009 TCU is the best MWC team ever. There's a difference between what he does and addressing an adversary's chinks or even advocacy.

[Moliere]

Actually it was a component of my original argument. Kansas adds little except basketball prestige and that comes at a cost. The benefit of basketball prestige is not large compared to the benefit of football prestige. Therefore, the cost can be the same and yet still too large in one and not in the other.

Kansas' football program is in a larger market than Utah's and their average attendance is higher. Kansas has a BCS bowl win and is currently performing pretty well in the Big 12 north. If it were me, I'd take the bigger tv market, the higher average football attendance, and the better (top tier) basketball program. But that's just me and I'm pretty sure I'm biased but still the facts stack up in Kansas' favor.

[ERCougar]

So are you saying Pac stays at 11? Just making sure it's clear and we all understand what you're saying.

I know you always look at this Utah/BYU thing with such clear eyed objectivity, so it's important we get down what you're saying. It's especially interesting since NO ONE on the face of the earth is saying what you're saying. NOBODY.

I got the idea they may stay at 11 off an article linked here (sorry, I can't remember which), so yes, there is at least one person on the face of the earth saying this. I'm not saying they'll stay at 11, but your invite's not in hand either. Why not?

[tooblue]

I have a sinking feeling in the pit of my gut. I'm starting to think my initial prediction of Utah going to a PAC 12 isn't going to happen. It looks like the Big 12 will stay together with ten members and I fear the PAC 10 will bide their time and hold at eleven.