Wah-hoo-wah! BYU @ Virginia

[UVACoug]

Hey this one will hit close to JL but I've also heard alumni parents who aren't enthused because they don't think the quality of the faculty has kept pace with the quality of the students. It's an opinion but are they wrong?


Say you're a minimum qualifier LDS kid who has done a bit of partying in high school and likes to have a good time. This kid wants to do better in college but doesn't really value academics over other lifestyle issues. He shows up at BYU for his visit, gets a good idea of the student population, gets beat over the head with the honor code, Factors in a challenging academic environment that he may or may not be able to handle, and wonders why a majority of the hot chicks in the area go to UVU. Then the kid takes his visit to ASU and has a completely different experience. The LDS chicks are hot, most of the students are more like his friends in high school, and he's not going to get tossed out of school if he happens to slip up.

I get that you guys think BYU can do no wrong. I happen to disagree. I think it's changed into a place where high school Shaka (who cared far more about dating hot chicks, playing sports, and having great experiences with his friends that he did about academics) would have reservations about attending.

If you care about hot chicks and partying more than a good education, why go to school at all?


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[MarkGrace]

I was simply tossing out reasons as well which led us down the current rabbit hole. Personally I think that quality linemen are harder to find than a couple of inside linebackers. Part of the problem is the line takes up five of the eleven positions on the offense. You simply need more of them.

Then again, getting more granular, why does this seem to be a problem now more than ever? BYU doesn't seem like it's struggled historically on the o-line, at least not to the extent it has the last few years. As also noted last night, just five years ago the group was really good. Yet it's seen a drop off none of the other positions have seemed to experienced

[UVACoug]

Then again, getting more granular, why does this seem to be a problem now more than ever? BYU doesn't seem like it's struggled historically on the o-line, at least not to the extent it has the last few years. As also noted last night, just five years ago the group was really godd. Yet it's seen a drop off none of the other positions have seemed to experienced

It's coaching.

[All-American]

I noticed that Stanford has especially struggled lately with athletics due to their geekiness.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/col...rn-vanderbilt/

[lambdacoug]

I noticed that Stanford has especially struggled lately with athletics due to their geekiness.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/col...rn-vanderbilt/

Yeah, I hate geeks.

[MarkGrace]

It's coaching.

I think that has to be a big part of it. Sizzle said kids weren't high on Grimes. I think that's a resonable explanation. Is it a combination of Grimes just wasn't a good evaluator, recruiter, and then didn't do a good job coaching them up? Seems plausible. The tone regarding o-line recruiting seemed to shift pretty noticeably once Anae and 2J took over. Hopefully that yields some dividends.

[Shaka]

I placed value on education. I also placed value on other things. I guess I got to have my cake and eat it too.

[MarkGrace]

I noticed that Stanford has especially struggled lately with athletics due to their geekiness.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/col...rn-vanderbilt/

I find the entire premise that BYU was ever anything other than extremely geeky and non-diverse funny. That place has been insanely geeky since my parents went there.

[Shaka]

I noticed that Stanford has especially struggled lately with athletics due to their geekiness.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/col...rn-vanderbilt/

Stanford has a much broader Selection of geeks from which to choose.

[UVACoug]

I placed value on education. I also placed value on other things. I guess I got to have my cake and eat it too.

But you seem to be suggesting that BYU should place its focus on the other things at the expense of academics in order to get better football players. Do you not see the absurdity of that? There isn't a school outside the SEC that would do such a thing.

[ERCougar]

I think that has to be a big part of it. Sizzle said kids weren't high on Grimes. I think that's a resonable explanation. Is it a combination of Grimes just wasn't a good evaluator, recruiter, and then didn't do a good job coaching them up? Seems plausible. The tone regarding o-line recruiting seemed to shift pretty noticeably once Anae and 2J took over. Hopefully that yields some dividends.

This makes a lot more sense to me, and would also explain why it might take a bit to turn it around.

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[Shaka]

But you seem to be suggesting that BYU should place its focus on the other things at the expense of academics in order to get better football players. Do you not see the absurdity of that? There isn't a school outside the SEC that would do such a thing.

That's not what I'm suggesting. I'm suggesting that the culture at BYU, a culture that is partially derived from the student body, Might not be palatable to some prospective athletes that ten years ago might have been more open to attending.

Also I would personally like to see BYU return to the academic standards of the 90s. I think it was much more fun And inclusive.

[UVACoug]

That's not what I'm suggesting. I'm suggesting that the culture at BYU, a culture that is partially derived from the student body, Might not be palatable to some prospective athletes that ten years ago might have been more open to attending.

Also I would personally like to see BYU return to the academic standards of the 90s. I think it was much more fun And inclusive.

So you aren't suggesting it ... but then you say you want to go back to the standards of the 90s. I am now thoroughly confused. Are you suggesting it or not?

[ERCougar]

That's not what I'm suggesting. I'm suggesting that the culture at BYU, a culture that is partially derived from the student body, Might not be palatable to some prospective athletes that ten years ago might have been more open to attending.

Also I would personally like to see BYU return to the academic standards of the 90s. I think it was much more fun And inclusive.

You're still missing the objection here. Are offensive lineman (this seems to have spared the DL too) uniquely attracted to partying, 'cruising chicks', and playing in bands?

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[Jeff Lebowski]

She wasn't offered a schollie so it's not even part of the argument. Had she been offered one it would have factored into her decision. However the schollie wouldn't have been the only thing that factored into her decision.

I have nothing against smart kids. My best friend in high school and college roommate received an academic schollie to BYU. However he and I were completely different animals in high school and that didn't change in college. Things I valued in choosing a school were far different than what he valued. Other than the time we spent together we hung with entirely different crowds. I'd be off cruising women, hitting parties, playing in bands, and playing hockey while he would be stuck in the library studying. Yes I studied but I didn't hit it nearly as hard as he did. These days both of us own the same size home, have toys, and have similar bank balances and retirement savings. In fact he manages my retirement. In the end we ended up pretty equal in spite of having two different paths.

That's great. Good for you.

But it has nothing to do with your argument that high academic standards are a net negative for recruiting.