Obama's Health Plan

[tooblue]

I care because if the incentives arent good then the doctors of the future become something else. In total our quality of medical care goes down.

You don't really care -- no more than you care about how long it takes any one else to get a degree etc. I want individuals to choose to be a doctor because they sincerely want to help people. Not because of financial incentives! That's the EXACT WRONG reason to become a doctor. And that's one of the fundamental problems with the health system.

Health care SHOULD NOT be about making money -- it should be about helping people!

[wuapinmon]

People, it's not socialized if I pay my insurance premiums to the government. Right now, $426 a month goes to BCBS to insurance my ass. I give that money instead to the government. They take the combined purchasing power of everyone and put it to work, driving down pricing. I don't want someone else to pay my medical costs, I want to not avoid going to the doctor when I'm sick because I can't afford $1000 for "tests."

I was billed $378 for an EKG. They hooked up some stickies to my chest for 30 seconds. That was it. The paper went into my file. I'm sure the medicals professionals looked at it before they shoved a camera down my throat, but charging me $378 for a test that took a few seconds is ridiculous....the National Health Insurance is going to drive down the cost of that test to a point where it will be affordable. Sure the machine cost a lot to buy, but it wasn't that big, and if there were competition and bulk buying, the cost of the machine would go down too.

NHI should be run like a business---keep Medicare separate. If medical professionals don't want to accept the pricing, in a free market, they can choose to not accept the bulk of the population and see their practice suffer as a result.

ERCoug.....in my book, I don't think a doctor should have to pay for med school, or dental school, or podiatry, or optometry, or any job that improves public health. I also think that if you have National Health Insurance, you should renounce your right to litigate for malpractice. I think, that in turn, a doctor should have to work a few years back as payment for their scholarships, but the pay should be a healthy wage that encourages the best and brightest to go into medicine. I know how much of a sacrifice med school is....no family, no social life, no time for anything but studying for four years. And then you get shat on for another 3-7 during residency. But, every job has its time and dues that must be paid. All the sacrifice pay off with greater economic freedom in the end. If you didn't have that house payment of a student loan to pay back, the money side of doctoring would be much simpler....and if the government got serious about tort reform, you'd make even more money.

If the government doesn't move in this direction, I see Wal*Mart creating their own hospitals and clinics in the next 25 years.

[wuapinmon]

You don't really care -- no more than you care about how long it takes any one else to get a degree etc. I want individuals to choose to be a doctor because they sincerely want to help people. Not because of financial incentives! That's the EXACT WRONG reason to become a doctor. And that's one of the fundamental problems with the health system.

Health care SHOULD NOT be about making money -- it should be about helping people!

This is a touch naive......being a doctor is a lot of shitty work with bad hours and patients who lie and won't listen to you......helping people is one thing, but we need more doctors than there are Florence Nightingales in the world.

[byu71]

Asshole racist. Do some research....most "illegals" pay cash for their services.

http://www.state.sc.us/cma/data/CMAFinalReport0807.pdf

Wow, do you constantly have a broomhandle stuck up your butt?

[wuapinmon]

I obviously don't like this. I doubt CardiacCoug does either. We're not hurting, but we also spent a lot of money and time to get where we are, and suddenly you want to change the rules of the game. Let us unionize and maybe we'll think about it. Also, don't make us pay for our medical education (a la Europe).


This has been an issue in Massachusetts.

I think that doctors should absolutely be allowed to unionize, with some exclusions about the public health risks of striking enacted at terms that both sides can agree with. Any group of professionals should be allowed to unionize.

Unions are a huge reason why America has a middle class.

As far as it being an issue, I think if we had more doctors, and that could be done by paying for med school, the problems would be less, though medical infrastructure would need some serious billions in investments too.

[wuapinmon]

Wow, do you constantly have a broomhandle stuck up your butt?

Pucker up and kiss right next to where the handle comes out. I bet you don't even think there's anything prejudiced with what you said.

[Mormon Red Death]

You don't really care -- no more than you care about how long it takes any one else to get a degree etc. I want individuals to choose to be a doctor because they sincerely want to help people. Not because of financial incentives! That's the EXACT WRONG reason to become a doctor. And that's one of the fundamental problems with the health system.

Health care SHOULD NOT be about making money -- it should be about helping people!

The oldest axiom in the healthcare business... "No Margin.. No Mission"

Healthcare is a service that cost money. Its a business. What if I said "Making art SHOULD NOT not be about making money -- It should be about inspiring people"

[Mormon Red Death]

I think that doctors should absolutely be allowed to unionize, with some exclusions about the public health risks of striking enacted at terms that both sides can agree with. Any group of professionals should be allowed to unionize.

Unions are a huge reason why America has a middle class.

As far as it being an issue, I think if we had more doctors, and that could be done by paying for med school, the problems would be less, though medical infrastructure would need some serious billions in investments too.

Why would doctors want to unionize? That would mean less money for all the good ones.

[RobinFinderson]

Wow, do you constantly have a broomhandle stuck up your butt?

I don't know what is up with wuap, but FYI, the polite way to refer "illegals" is to call them "undocumented." People who strive to improve conditions of undocumented people in this country have run a successful campaign to stigmatize the term "illegal" in reference to these people. At this point, educated people who want to respect the dignity of undocumented workers should probably avoid the word "illegal" when talking about these people. A lot of people will definitely assume that a person who uses the word "illegals" is intentionally trying to be insulting. Anyhow, that may be wuap's beef.

[byu71]

Pucker up and kiss right next to where the handle comes out. I bet you don't even think there's anything prejudiced with what you said.

The one thing I think is you have a much higher opinion of yourself than you really should. I know I won't be looking to you for someone to determine whether I am racist or not. I have you in my "prick" category already, but I have exchanged views with many a prick through the years so I look forward to the exchange of thoughts and ideas.

[tooblue]

This is a touch naive......being a doctor is a lot of shitty work with bad hours and patients who lie and won't listen to you......helping people is one thing, but we need more doctors than there are Florence Nightingales in the world.

There's nothing naive about it. Being a teacher has a lot of sh** aspects too. I continually go to school to upgrade my skills, to keep current. I deal with a violent, whiny, spoiled generation y ... y can't you do it for me, why can't i have my Mom do it blah blah blah.

We do need many doctors. I have stated that they should be well-paid AND have their education paid for. But let's be blunt -- Doctors aren't owed anything for their choice!

[byu71]

I don't know what is up with wuap, but FYI, the polite way to refer "illegals" is to call them "undocumented." People who strive to improve conditions of undocumented people in this country have run a successful campaign to stigmatize the term "illegal" in reference to these people. At this point, educated people who want to respect the dignity of undocumented workers should probably avoid the word "illegal" when talking about these people. A lot of people will definitely assume that a person who uses the word "illegals" is intentionally trying to be insulting. Anyhow, that may be wuap's beef.

Maybe that is my problem. I know what I mean and how I mean it and the "educated" can go F themselves if they don't like how I speak.

[RobinFinderson]

Maybe that is my problem. I know what I mean and how I mean it and the "educated" can go F themselves if they don't like how I speak.

Like I said, it was just an FYI. Plenty of people may not be aware of the distinction between the two words, and the preference for one over the other. It is your reputation, and you can spend it however you like.

[tooblue]

The oldest axiom in the healthcare business... "No Margin.. No Mission"

Healthcare is a service that cost money. Its a business. What if I said "Making art SHOULD NOT not be about making money -- It should be about inspiring people"

I don't make art to make money -- you've got no argument from me there! And I made my choices -- society doesn't owe me anything.

In regards to your axiom what's more important -- the mission or the margin? In other words are you willing to fulfill your mission without a margin. If not, then what was the point of accepting the call in the first place?

[wuapinmon]

I don't know what is up with wuap, Anyhow, that may be wuap's beef.

I could care less about PC-ness. I'm talking about the attitude of someone who says he won't take medicine so some "X" can have them. It's not altruism that's motivating his statement, it's a disdain for the "Other" that he's choosing to despise at the moment. Insert any other minority in the blank and you see the effect.

He's also speaking for a point of ignorance or denial, which while it could be innocent, it's probably willful, or gleaned from some other misanthropic source.

If he had said, I'll not take them so someone else less-fortunate-than-me can have them, that'd be one thing.....but he chooses to lambaste illegals....that's something else completely different.

If you lived in poverty in another country and knew you could make a better life for your family by WORKING somewhere else, in a country that can't get many of its own citizens to get up off their asses and work, you'd do whatever you could.

Illegal, amnesty, what do those even mean anyway? It's the significance that his aspersion signifies to him that is the issue.