A Funny Thing Happened on the Way To Jerusalem: Gaza/Israel conflict

[Northwestcoug]

Israel tells UN that over 1 million people in northern Gaza need to relocate in the next 24 hours.

That’s…not a serious proposal.

[old_gregg]

Israel tells UN that over 1 million people in northern Gaza need to relocate in the next 24 hours.

That’s…not a serious proposal.

is it a more or less serious proposal than driving all jews into the sea

[Non Sequitur]

Kill all the Hamas leadership and any Hamas fighter who won't surrender. Destroy all Hamas infrastructure, military or otherwise. It does not matter that they were elected nearly 20 years ago. They should be treated like the Nazi party. Yes, this will be very challenging and there will be suffering, but it is nowhere near killing all the Palestinians in Gaza. No sane person wants suffering, but I truly believe destroying Hamas now will lead to less overall suffering (among Israelis and Palestinians) in the long term than any cease fire.

I know you disagree. Sincerely asking, what would you do if you had to make the decision on the strategy going forward from this current reality?

I don't disagree. My point is that the focus should be on Hamas and that thoughtful consideration be given to the amount of acceptable collateral damage. It's very easy for people in situations like this to become motivated by revenge. It's also very tempting for politicians use a crisis like this as pretext to further exploit and subjugate the innocent Palestinians in Gaza. Frankly, I don't trust Netanyahu to not exploit this crisis.

[Non Sequitur]

yeah so the bloodlust that started this whole thing was the planned, targeted and intentional brutal killings of noncombatants, including the decapitation of babies, rape of women, execution of toddlers, etc. you can rest easy that idf targeted tactical action against military targets, located though they may be in areas of civilian concentration because hamas intentionally located them in places designed such that retaliatory action will necessarily inflict maximum collateral damage on its own people, is morally distinguishable.

You seem to think I'm defending Hamas. I'm not certainly not.

[Northwestcoug]

is it a more or less serious proposal than driving all jews into the sea

I mean sure if that’s what you’re going for. Forcing half of Gaza’s population to relocate in a day would probably come close to the carnage that Hamas could only dream of.

[myboynoah]

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[Jeff Lebowski]

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[Jeff Lebowski]

Which means it's probably true.

I hate to be a cynic, but Netanyahu needs this type of instability to stay in power. Both Egypt and Israel have the motive to lie. This could get even uglier.

Do you know why I don't dismiss the allegations that Netanyahu was indifferent to the Hamas attack? It's because I know that Netanyahu is just the other side of the Trump shekel, and that shekel loves chaos and doesn't care what burns to stay in power. And sadly, it's working.

You guys are in agreement with antisemite Nick Fuentes. Congratulations.

https://www.adl.org/resources/blog/h...iracies-online

Others believe that such a surprise attack by Hamas is unlikely or even impossible, citing Israel’s extensive intelligence networks, and claiming that Israel knew about the attack ahead of time but chose not to act preemptively to justify the "ethnic cleansing" of Palestinians. White supremacist Nick Fuentes pushed this narrative on Telegram, writing that Israel’s intelligence failure “is a little suspicious in light of how the Likud government will benefit politically from this crisis both domestically and internationally.”

[Northwestcoug]

I have no idea who this author is, but this long tweet resonated with me. Some good quotes:

Not defending Hamas is a very low bar to clear. Please clear it.

This is why we describe them as “innocent” and why Hamas has only reaffirmed that they are a brutal terror organization with this attack — an organization that I hope is quickly toppled, for the sake of both the Palestinian people and the Israelis. But as someone with a deep love for Israel, with friends in danger and people I know still missing, it breaks my heart to say it but I'm saying it again because it remains perhaps the most salient point of context in a tangled mess full of centuries of context: You cannot keep two million people living in the conditions people in Gaza are living in and expect peace. You can't. And you shouldn’t. Their environment is antithetical to the human condition. Violent rebellion is guaranteed. Guaranteed. As sure as the sun rising. And the cycle of violence seems locked in to self-perpetuate, because both sides see a score to settle

Am I pro-Israel or pro-Palestine? I have no idea. I'm pro-not-killing-civilians. I'm pro-not-trapping-millions-of-people-in-open-air-prisons. I'm pro-not-shooting-grandmas-in-the-back-of-the-head. I'm pro-not-flattening-apartment-complexes. I'm pro-not-raping-women-and-taking-hostages. I'm pro-not-unjustly-imprisoning-people-without-due-process. I'm pro-freedom and pro-peace and pro- all the things we never see in this conflict anymore. Whatever this is, I want none of it.

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[Jeff Lebowski]

I have no idea who this author is, but this long tweet resonated with me. Some good quotes:

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Sorry, but I am tiring of statements like this and others in this thread. Oh, you don't like people dying? Good for you. Glad we cleared that up.

The author admits at the end that he doesn't have any solutions. Then what is the point of that word salad? Virtue signaling, probably.

[Green Monstah]

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I can't remember, but were you transferred out of Israel before all this nonsense?

[Green Monstah]

Sorry, but I am tiring of statements like this and others in this thread. Oh, you don't like people dying? Good for you. Glad we cleared that up.

The author admits at the end that he doesn't have any solutions. Then what is the point of that word salad? Virtue signaling, probably.

Is annihilating Gaza the solution?

[Bo Diddley]

There's no sugar coating it. War is ugly. Better strap in!

[Northwestcoug]

Sorry, but I am tiring of statements like this and others in this thread. Oh, you don't like people dying? Good for you. Glad we cleared that up.

The author admits at the end that he doesn't have any solutions. Then what is the point of that word salad? Virtue signaling, probably.

You keep asking us for specific solutions. I told you before I don't have any. How about you tell us what you think should be done.

I'm on record stating that Israel is 100% justified in protecting itself and declaring war. I also oppose the general blockade and the forced eviction of millions in 1 day. Other than that, my hands are up in the air. There is too much history and conflict for any simple and quick solution. It's doubtful we'll ever see one in our lifetimes.

I shared that tweet for the main reason that it recognized the historical background of the conflict, freely admitting the abuses both sides have committed. There's no solution there, just context. I think it's helpful if there is ever to be a solution.

[smokymountainrain]

You keep asking us for specific solutions. I told you before I don't have any. How about you tell us what you think should be done.

I'm on record stating that Israel is 100% justified in protecting itself and declaring war. I also oppose the general blockade and the forced eviction of millions in 1 day. Other than that, my hands are up in the air. There is too much history and conflict for any simple and quick solution. It's doubtful we'll ever see one in our lifetimes.

I shared that tweet for the main reason that it recognized the historical background of the conflict, freely admitting the abuses both sides have committed. There's no solution there, just context. I think it's helpful if there is ever to be a solution.

i keep hearing the term open air prison and the comment above that their living conditions are antithetical to the human condition. so wouldn't a forced eviction be a good thing? maybe they just give them a longer time frame to get out? if it's so bad, what's the problem with being evicted?