"You Gotta Love It Baby" Official Jazz thread

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

That is a lot of money for a guy that has never averaged more than 25 min a game, double digit points or double digit rebounds. They are paying strictly on potential. Which in a way is the Jazz own fault by not letting him loose sooner.

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Without having looked up enough examples to back up my assumption for sure, I'd say that most 21 year old players are getting paid almost strictly on potential, or they aren't signing for 4 yrs, $49 M. They are getting $90 M like Paul George or $62 M like Cousins. What Favors is worth, whether on potential or production or some combination of the two, based on the current market says he got about what he deserves while at the same time it says Utah didn't have to overpay to lock him up before his minutes, and hopefully production, go way up.

At 21, Tyson Chandler averaged 23 mpg, 6 ppg, 7.7 rpg, 1.8 bpg, shot a horrid 42% from the field for a guy that only dunked or finished close to the hoop, and had a PER of 14. Favors averaged 24 mpg, 9.4 ppg, 7.1 rpg, 1.7 bpg, shot a poor but not nearly as bad 48% from the field, and had a PER of 17. Chandler's first deal after his rookie contract averaged about $11 M and it started in 05-06.

Always risky to pay big money before a career is laid out, and mistakes will hurt a team like Utah more than most, but Favors being worth $12 M per over the life of this deal seems like a pretty safe bet barring injury.

[Jacob]

Larry Sanders got 4 yrs, $44 M. Cousins got 4 yrs, $62 M. Seems like a good deal for both sides. Favors got market value, and the Jazz didn't pay excessively, and don't run the risk of Favors having a huge year and then having to match a bigger deal this summer.

Sanders doesn't have the body of Favors, has shown an even more limited offensive game, and is 3 years older. Either the Bucks way overpaid or Utah got a solid here.

Exactly. Seems like a lot, but not really. I still think there's a chance he won't earn it, but then again, he just signed for the price we are paying Biedrins, almost. And so much less than Cousins, who most NBA people would not pick over Favors. Jazz could pay 4 guys that amount in the 4th year and still be well enough under the cap to have a decent bench. Hayward Favors, Kanter, next years free agent signing all making 12. Meanwhile, Indiana will be paying Hibbert and George we'll over 30m just for 2. And that's cheap compared to other teams. Al Horford and Noah at 12 is a better bargain, but you won't find many. Javale McGee makes about as much, and he,s basically Favor's floor.

He still could be over- or underpaid, but not overpaid like most bad NBA contracts that come to mind.

[Jacob]

That is a lot of money for a guy that has never averaged more than 25 min a game, double digit points or double digit rebounds. They are paying strictly on potential. Which in a way is the Jazz own fault by not letting him loose sooner.

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Tiago Splitter makes almost 10 On average and he's not even being paid on potential.

[cougjunkie]

Exactly. Seems like a lot, but not really. I still think there's a chance he won't earn it, but then again, he just signed for the price we are paying Biedrins, almost. And so much less than Cousins, who most NBA people would not pick over Favors. Jazz could pay 4 guys that amount in the 4th year and still be well enough under the cap to have a decent bench. Hayward Favors, Kanter, next years free agent signing all making 12. Meanwhile, Indiana will be paying Hibbert and George we'll over 30m just for 2. And that's cheap compared to other teams. Al Horford and Noah at 12 is a better bargain, but you won't find many. Javale McGee makes about as much, and he,s basically Favor's floor.

He still could be over- or underpaid, but not overpaid like most bad NBA contracts that come to mind.

Cousins is much better than Favors right now and has much more upside you are crazy thinking otherwise.



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[cougjunkie]

Tiago Splitter makes almost 10 On average and he's not even being paid on potential.

Almost 10? Nice way of rounding up. His deal was 4 for 36. Favors is making 3 million more per year and they have similar numbers.

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[Jacob]

Cousins is much better than Favors right now and has much more upside you are crazy thinking otherwise.



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I didn't say otherwise. I said most NBA guys would take Favors and that's based on the reporting I've read. Favors is already the vastly superior defender while Cousins is the vastly superior offensive of player. And then you have to deal with cousins' head.
Looks like I was mistaken it was only a slight majority of NBA executives who would take favors first. But still

There is still huge optimism around Favors as he enters his fourth season; a slight majority of league executives I polled in the summer said they would take Favors over DeMarcus Cousins long-term. But the idea that Favors might be a true franchise player took a bit of a hit last season, when his developmental curve flattened out.

And that's why he's not being paid like the franchise player like Demarcus cousins and Brook Lopez are even though they can't play defense.

[Jacob]

Almost 10? Nice way of rounding up. His deal was 4 for 36. Favors is making 3 million more per year and they have similar numbers.

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Exactly. Also Tiago makes 10 this year and 9.2 next year . Makes over 8 after he turns 30. He's reached his max potential. And Pop could have played Favors against the Heat.
And I like Splitter.

[cougjunkie]

Exactly. Also Tiago makes 10 this year and 9.2 next year . Makes over 8 after he turns 30. He's reached his max potential. And Pop could have played Favors against the Heat.
And I like Splitter.

If Pop coached Favors he would be worth $12 million.

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[Non Sequitur]

I didn't say otherwise. I said most NBA guys would take Favors and that's based on the reporting I've read. Favors is already the vastly superior defender while Cousins is the vastly superior offensive of player. And then you have to deal with cousins' head.
Looks like I was mistaken it was only a slight majority of NBA executives who would take favors first. But still


And that's why he's not being paid like the franchise player like Demarcus cousins and Brook Lopez are even though they can't play defense.

Which is more likely, getting Cousins to play defense like Favors or getting Favors to play offense like Cousins? It's the former, and it's not even close. The fact is that once you reach the NBA, your offensive skills are pretty much set, especially if you're an offensive player that relies heavily on his athleticism. As Favors gets older and is less able to get by on his athleticism, he's going to become an offensive liability. A guy like Cousins can excel with his offensive style for years. I can't imagine anyone looking long term would prefer Favors over Cousins.

[Jacob]

Which is more likely, getting Cousins to play defense like Favors or getting Favors to play offense like Cousins? It's the former, and it's not even close. The fact is that once you reach the NBA, your offensive skills are pretty much set, especially if you're an offensive player that relies heavily on his athleticism. As Favors gets older and is less able to get by on his athleticism, he's going to become an offensive liability. A guy like Cousins can excel with his offensive style for years. I can't imagine anyone looking long term would prefer Favors over Cousins.

Nope no chance of either.

[Jacob]

If Pop coached Favors he would be worth $12 million.

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I won dispute that.

[MarkGrace]

Which is more likely, getting Cousins to play defense like Favors or getting Favors to play offense like Cousins? It's the former, and it's not even close. The fact is that once you reach the NBA, your offensive skills are pretty much set, especially if you're an offensive player that relies heavily on his athleticism. As Favors gets older and is less able to get by on his athleticism, he's going to become an offensive liability. A guy like Cousins can excel with his offensive style for years. I can't imagine anyone looking long term would prefer Favors over Cousins.

For being a super smart guy, your posts about basketball are sure moronic.

[Non Sequitur]

For being a super smart guy, your posts about basketball are sure moronic.

So, you'd take Favors over Cousins? I'd love to hear you defend that.

[MarkGrace]

So, you'd take Favors over Cousins? I'd love to hear you defend that.

Why? it's not like it's an indefensible position. Look above and you'll see where Jacob posted that more execs said they'd take Favors over Cousins long-term. But it's not so much the conclusion (picking Cousins is perfectly fine and defensible as well) that looks moronic as the rationale. This is one of the dumber things I've read all week:

Which is more likely, getting Cousins to play defense like Favors or getting Favors to play offense like Cousins? It's the former, and it's not even close.

Topped only by this:

The fact is that once you reach the NBA, your offensive skills are pretty much set, especially if you're an offensive player that relies heavily on his athleticism.

You're just mimicking silly tropes you've heard from talking heads and whiffing on even that.

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

Marc Stein reporting that Jazz are likely to extend Hayward as well before the deadline, and that his deal will be richer in Favors'.

And Kevin Pelton replies with "That stuns me."