President Trump: Making America Great Again...

[PaloAltoCougar]

How long until we get posts insinuating Trump is being witch-hunted? He did not do the same things Pence and Biden did with the documents.
Mar-a-Lago's server room was mysteriously flood ruining requested security footage of the movement of the documents.

Trumpists (including a depressingly large chunk of CBers) continue to see false equivalencies between Trump and his predecessors, actually believing what Trump says in his own defense. Here's a good explanation of the differences. But perhaps the biggest difference between Trump and others is that throughout his life Trump has always taken an aggressive "deny deny deny" approach to accusations of wrongdoing (thanks, Roy Cohn!). He NEVER admits mistakes or wrongdoing. Those he accuses (wrongfully in most cases) of committing similar violations usually apologize, correct the mistake, and move on. Trump is pathologically incapable of that. He has fought this every step of the way, and now he faces some very serious charges that would have vanished if had been able to muster a modicum of humility or contrition.

[originalsocal]

Boom.

Federal court. This is a big deal.

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Things I agree with:

1. Joe Biden does have many documents - although carefully vetted and still monitored by the National Archive.
2. He has been summoned.
3. He never thought this could happen to a former President of the US - better put, he thought he was above the law.
4. This was a dark day for our country - but not for the same reason he is inferring.
5. He will make America great again - after he is in prison.


Merry Arrestmas everyone!

[fusnik]

This legit makes me sad. I think this will be a huge marker, if we decline as a country over the next 40, as a major reason why things fell apart. It’s sad because a huge number of our citizenry have been bamboozled by a movement that at its heart is cruel, cynical and fueled by grievance.

Here’s my prediction, Ron DeSantis will start running on, DJT can’t help you because he’s wrapped up in this legal witch-hunt, but I will pardon him, and we will be his vengeance going forward. Ron DeSantis beats an old Biden and the culture wars we think we’ve been fighting with each other will escalate 100x.

[frank ryan]

This legit makes me sad. I think this will be a huge marker, if we decline as a country over the next 40, as a major reason why things fell apart. It’s sad because a huge number of our citizenry have been bamboozled by a movement that at its heart is cruel, cynical and fueled by grievance.

Here’s my prediction, Ron DeSantis will start running on, DJT can’t help you because he’s wrapped up in this legal witch-hunt, but I will pardon him, and we will be his vengeance going forward. Ron DeSantis beats an old Biden and the culture wars we think we’ve been fighting with each other will escalate 100x.

That any rational and decent person would consider voting for DeSantis when he has already said he would pardon Jan 6ers, (which include people indicted for sedition!) is saddening and horrifying. If that alone isn't a deal breaker, we are fucked.

[Flystripper]

This legit makes me sad. I think this will be a huge marker, if we decline as a country over the next 40, as a major reason why things fell apart. It’s sad because a huge number of our citizenry have been bamboozled by a movement that at its heart is cruel, cynical and fueled by grievance.

Here’s my prediction, Ron DeSantis will start running on, DJT can’t help you because he’s wrapped up in this legal witch-hunt, but I will pardon him, and we will be his vengeance going forward. Ron DeSantis beats an old Biden and the culture wars we think we’ve been fighting with each other will escalate 100x.

this seems like a relatively high probability

[Non Sequitur]

This legit makes me sad. I think this will be a huge marker, if we decline as a country over the next 40, as a major reason why things fell apart. It’s sad because a huge number of our citizenry have been bamboozled by a movement that at its heart is cruel, cynical and fueled by grievance.

Here’s my prediction, Ron DeSantis will start running on, DJT can’t help you because he’s wrapped up in this legal witch-hunt, but I will pardon him, and we will be his vengeance going forward. Ron DeSantis beats an old Biden and the culture wars we think we’ve been fighting with each other will escalate 100x.

This must be the new and improved "hopeful" Fusnik. First, you use the word "if" when referring to the possibility of the country's decline. Given the trajectory of our country's current decline, is it even possible to steepen the decline? And do you really think that 40 years from now there will still be a USA? That acronym will be as relevant as USSR.

[Commando]

I just read the 44-page indictment. He is toast. Talk about a dumbass. Basically consists of him filling a storage room at Mar a Lago with boxes of documents he took on his way out, receiving a subpoena from a grand jury after ignoring requests to return those documents, directing his assistant (his co-defendant) to move most of the boxes to another location before the date his attorney was to come over to review the storage room boxes for documents named in the subpoena.

And then after the attorney pulled like 12 files out and put them in a folder, wrapped it in clear duct tape, had another attorney certify that a diligent search was conducted of all available materials and issued to the FBI. So you have 31 counts of unlawfully retaining gov’t documents - a count per each specific classified document identified in the indictment(out of maybe 100 identified in the statement of facts)- and another bunch of counts ranging from Conspiracy to Obstruct Justice, False statements and Representations, Scheme to Conceal, Concealing a Document in a Federal Investigation, Corruptly Concealing a Document or Record, and Withholding a Document or Record.

Years and years in prison on the table. These are nuclear secrets, military secrets, strategy, allies' nuclear intelligence, etc. For me, a good result would be a plea agreement to a couple of felonies, probation, and disqualification from running for office ever again. Prison time is cool, too.

[fusnik]

This must be the new and improved "hopeful" Fusnik. First, you use the word "if" when referring to the possibility of the country's decline. Given the trajectory of our country's current decline, is it even possible to steepen the decline? And do you really think that 40 years from now there will still be a USA? That acronym will be as relevant as USSR.

As long as money is centralized in America, we will be the preeminent super power. With the Sauds sports washing their imagine across the globe, the creation of Dubai, a majority of our manufacturing happening in China and our dependence on fossil fuels, something like this can be the tipping point to self destruction. Empires fall, so will the US at some point.

[fusnik]

Really though why are our leaders holding government documents in their home?

A majority of the time an average person leaves a job their emails are scrapped, their boxes checked before leaving and all company property is retained. You want to write a memoir? Go into a government building to review your docs. Want to be a lobbyist? Head into a government building to review docs.

Apparently Jason Chaffetz thinks this was done, by a computer?

https://twitter.com/Acyn/status/1667...C2ieHosaMuAAAA

[falafel]

Really though why are our leaders holding government documents in their home?

A majority of the time an average person leaves a job their emails are scrapped, their boxes checked before leaving and all company property is retained. You want to write a memoir? Go into a government building to review your docs. Want to be a lobbyist? Head into a government building to review docs.

Apparently Jason Chaffetz thinks this was done, by a computer?

https://twitter.com/Acyn/status/1667...C2ieHosaMuAAAA

Great argument by Chaffetz. As if the only issue here were "hey, you took our only copy of that document and we need it back!" What a dumbass.

[PaloAltoCougar]

The indictment is a quick and interesting read and I now expect Trump's political career is over, although watching him tear the house down on his way out will be fascinating. Among the indictment's highlights are several quotes from Trump during his first campaign and later about how terribly others have handled confidential information (see, e.g., paragraphs 22 and 38 of the indictment0 and how he would do much better. He did worse. Unless the audiotapes and written statements by others prove to be false, Trump is manifestly guilty of serious wrongdoing.

A side note, I've always enjoyed (and vomited because of) Trump's garish decorating sense. He's like a Louis XIV fever dream. He thinks that the more gold and filigree one can add to a room, the better. and too much never is enough. He's a human Charlie the Tuna. And I loved the picture (paragraph 28) of the shower room where confidential documents were held. Note the elaborate chandelier hanging over the shitter. Every bathroom should have one.

[Jeff Lebowski]

The indictment is a quick and interesting read and I now expect Trump's political career is over, although watching him tear the house down on his way out will be fascinating. Among the indictment's highlights are several quotes from Trump during his first campaign and later about how terribly others have handled confidential information (see, e.g., paragraphs 22 and 38 of the indictment0 and how he would do much better. He did worse. Unless the audiotapes and written statements by others prove to be false, Trump is manifestly guilty of serious wrongdoing.

A side note, I've always enjoyed (and vomited because of) Trump's garish decorating sense. He's like a Louis XIV fever dream. He thinks that the more gold and filigree one can add to a room, the better. and too much never is enough. He's a human Charlie the Tuna. And I loved the picture (paragraph 28) of the shower room where confidential documents were held. Note the elaborate chandelier hanging over the shitter. Every bathroom should have one.

Man, I pray you are right. But how many times have we heard that his career is over?

[PaloAltoCougar]

Man, I pray you are right. But how many times have we heard that his career is over?

Oh I couldn’t agree more. Trump’s resilience has been amazing and lamentable. But there’s no getting around a criminal conviction and that’s where he is headed. ????

[Jeff Lebowski]

Oh I couldn’t agree more. Trump’s resilience has been amazing and lamentable. But there’s no getting around a criminal conviction and that’s where he is headed. ????

43% of Republicans say they would still vote for him, even if he were a convicted criminal.

[BlueK]

I just read the 44-page indictment. He is toast. Talk about a dumbass. Basically consists of him filling a storage room at Mar a Lago with boxes of documents he took on his way out, receiving a subpoena from a grand jury after ignoring requests to return those documents, directing his assistant (his co-defendant) to move most of the boxes to another location before the date his attorney was to come over to review the storage room boxes for documents named in the subpoena.

And then after the attorney pulled like 12 files out and put them in a folder, wrapped it in clear duct tape, had another attorney certify that a diligent search was conducted of all available materials and issued to the FBI. So you have 31 counts of unlawfully retaining gov’t documents - a count per each specific classified document identified in the indictment(out of maybe 100 identified in the statement of facts)- and another bunch of counts ranging from Conspiracy to Obstruct Justice, False statements and Representations, Scheme to Conceal, Concealing a Document in a Federal Investigation, Corruptly Concealing a Document or Record, and Withholding a Document or Record.

Years and years in prison on the table. These are nuclear secrets, military secrets, strategy, allies' nuclear intelligence, etc. For me, a good result would be a plea agreement to a couple of felonies, probation, and disqualification from running for office ever again. Prison time is cool, too.

On CNN Chris Christie just gave an incredibly powerful and eloquent rebuke of Trump through his analysis of all the important points in the indictment. It was something else.