Penn State pedophilia

[TripletDaddy]

Not sure they have killed off something the has only been used once. What they did do is clarify its usage. The death penalty is for egregious violations that are committed WHILE on probation...and i think probation for those same violations, not just any type of probation. That would hold true in SMUs case, as well. SMU was on probation for impermissible benefits when it was discovered that they had continued giving impermissible benefits.

I don't think we will ever see the death penalty again simply because it would require an unfathomable amount of stupidity at an institutional level. PSU showed the same stupidity...they weren't on probation, though.

It is certain that Miami will Not receive the death penalty. And it is also certain that they absolutely cannot receive the same punishment as PSU because you can't give out the same punishment for taking cash as you do for child abuse. I predict Miami gets 2-3 year bowl ban and a loss of 10 scholarships per year for a few years.

[CJF]

Not sure they have killed off something the has only been used once. What they did do is clarify its usage. The death penalty is for egregious violations that are committed WHILE on probation...and i think probation for those same violations, not just any type of probation. That would hold true in SMUs case, as well. SMU was on probation for impermissible benefits when it was discovered that they had continued giving impermissible benefits.

I don't think we will ever see the death penalty again simply because it would require an unfathomable amount of stupidity at an institutional level. PSU showed the same stupidity...they weren't on probation, though.

It is certain that Miami will Not receive the death penalty. And it is also certain that they absolutely cannot receive the same punishment as PSU because you can't give out the same punishment for taking cash as you do for child abuse. I predict Miami gets 2-3 year bowl ban and a loss of 10 scholarships per year for a few years.

I think Miami could get it if the new charges are correct. If Al Golden used an associate of Shapiro to get around recruiting rules, they could get it. But, you're probably correct. Too much money involved for he NCAA to pull the trigger and do the right thing.

[Moliere]

NPR interviewed a bunch of PSU students and it's astounding to me that they all played the victim. They all feel like the NCAA was wrong to punish them, saying that the culprits should be the ones punished. It's amazing to be on this side of the coin and listen to this crap. These people are insane!!

I'm trying to figure out how the students got punished in the first place. Are they saying they are punished because their football team might suck for a decade? Unbelievable.

[DrumNFeather]

NPR interviewed a bunch of PSU students and it's astounding to me that they all played the victim. They all feel like the NCAA was wrong to punish them, saying that the culprits should be the ones punished. It's amazing to be on this side of the coin and listen to this crap. These people are insane!!

I'm trying to figure out how the students got punished in the first place. Are they saying they are punished because their football team might suck for a decade? Unbelievable.

Watching the reaction by the students that they showed on ESPN was comical. "4 years of bowl bans" (audible gasps and "oh nos").

[SeattleUte]

With the help of some bullets gleaned from an interview with an ESPN reporter on NPR, here are some salient points for you zealots or agenda hounds to consider:

1) $60 million penalty is totally unprecedented, and a staggering sum for Penn State. It must come out of the football budget and is based on Penn State football's annual revenue. Those of you owning all or part of small businesses, just imagine if you had to pay a fine of your annual gross revenue. It would bankrupt you. (At $60 million revenue Penn State football is definitely a small business. Further, if any school gets a single $60 million donation it's big news. Don't be saps; Penn State is not a country; $60 million is a lot of money, especially for a small business generating $60 million annually.)

2) Penn State will lose hundreds of millions of dollars total including post-season revenues, concessions, etc.

3) With the transfer exodus, limitations on scholarships and four year bowl ban it will take many years if ever for Penn State football to recovery.

4) There has never been a penalty like this leveled against any university, but there really was not any specific NCAA rule that Penn State violated.

5) The NCAA acted with historic swiftness, even bypassing its governing board. Mark Emmert was given full authority to decide the penalty.

6) Penn State signed the consent decree in record time and has not coplained.

7) The Paterno statute was torn down.

8) The NCAA had limited powers and jurisidction;it addressed its historic areas of jurisdiction and concern. The tort and criminal justice systems still grind on. Penn State will pay tens or hundreds of millions of dollars in damages to tort victims, more people may still go to prison. (I've wondered why the university itself isn't indicted; maybe becuse it's a public agency; sovereign immunity?)

[LA Ute]

With the help of some bullets gleaned from an interview with an ESPN reporter on NPR, here are some salient points for you zealots or agenda hounds to consider....

I think the highest level Penn State will ever achieve will the same as SMU: respectable, but not top-drawer ever again. Caveat: I understand that SMU decided to come back with football de-emphasized, and set up structures to ensure the sport would never achieve the relative importance on campus that it had before. I wonder if PSU leaders can find it in them to do the same.

[CJF]

I'm confused by your statements around the financial penalty. PSU recieved $208.7 million in donations last year. They recieved a single donation of $88 million. The penalty payment can come from anywhere PSU wants, but they cannot impact other sports. The $60 million fine is window dressing. It looks major, but to PSU, it is probably the least of their concerns.

I'm curious. Anyone know the value of a full ride scholarship at PSU? Solon?

[TripletDaddy]

I'm confused by your statements around the financial penalty. PSU recieved $208.7 million in donations last year. They recieved a single donation of $88 million. The penalty payment can come from anywhere PSU wants, but they cannot impact other sports. The $60 million fine is window dressing. It looks major, but to PSU, it is probably the least of their concerns.

I'm curious. Anyone know the value of a full ride scholarship at PSU? Solon?

Of course it is window dressing. If this were going to bankrupt PSU football, the BOT would have fought the charges rather than agree to them, as it would be in their best interest to do so. As it stands, they agreed to the plea bargain very quickly because it was a good deal compared to the alternative and would allow everyone to start moving on. A 2 or 3 year appeals process would have done no good.

The statue was torn down. Was it destroyed? No, it was put in storage "for now." why? Because it will probably come back at some point.

Another reason this was done quickly was to save face for the NCAA and the B1G. As we learned with SC, ALL penalties are stayed during NCAA appeals. So here we would have seen ZERO penalties for PSU for several years while this whole thing played out in front of the entire country. PSU could have continued recruiting, continued playing, continued winning, PSU could have achieved bowl wins, conference championships, etc, all while appealing punishments related to facilitated child rape. It would have been a PR disaster of epic proportions for the NCAA. Why haven't they moved as quickly against Miami? Nevin Shapiro has provided the NCAA with credit card receipts and bank statements. What more do you need??

We can give SeattleUte a pass because he knows little about sports, but make no mistake....the NCAA acted extremely quickly because it suited its own interests. The historic swiftness was because the seasons starts in 6 weeks.

[Jacob]

NPR interviewed a bunch of PSU students and it's astounding to me that they all played the victim. They all feel like the NCAA was wrong to punish them, saying that the culprits should be the ones punished. It's amazing to be on this side of the coin and listen to this crap. These people are insane!!

I'm trying to figure out how the students got punished in the first place. Are they saying they are punished because their football team might suck for a decade? Unbelievable.

Have you heard the many disinterested parties expressing the same sentiments? Jay Bilas, Brent Mussburger? Are they also insane?

If the football program is important to them, and the NCAA just gave them a virtual deth-knell, then of course they are some of the intentional, unintended people affected by the penalties. Even Emmert recognized this in his speech.

[SeattleUte]

Emmert said something important last night. Just becuase a lot of people at some universities are confused about any university's true values and mission, doesn't mean that the university itself is doing anything wrong or confused.

[Moliere]

Have you heard the many disinterested parties expressing the same sentiments? Jay Bilas, Brent Mussburger? Are they also insane?

If the football program is important to them, and the NCAA just gave them a virtual deth-knell, then of course they are some of the intentional, unintended people affected by the penalties. Even Emmert recognized this in his speech.

Bilas and Mussburger were calling themselves victims?

The NCAA didn't come down harder because they didn't want to hurt people that are around the football program but didn't participate in the coverup. Specifically they named the fans, businesses around PSU, etc. I find that explanation unconvincing. It's like building a plantation off of slave labor and, when slavery is outlawed, pretending like you didn't get rich off of the slave labor in the first place. And then arguing that because your plantation provides many great anciliiary things that you can't just divide it up and give parts of it to those that helped build it without recompense.

[TripletDaddy]

1) $60 million penalty is totally unprecedented, and a staggering sum for Penn State. It must come out of the football budget and is based on Penn State football's annual revenue. Those of you owning all or part of small businesses, just imagine if you had to pay a fine of your annual gross revenue. It would bankrupt you. (At $60 million revenue Penn State football is definitely a small business. Further, if any school gets a single $60 million donation it's big news. Don't be saps; Penn State is not a country; $60 million is a lot of money, especially for a small business generating $60 million annually.)

Please expound. This is news to me. Thanks.

[DU Ute]

Penn State likely won't miss out on a single football game (I'm guessing they won't be bowl eligible for a few years). Fans are upset because their football team is going to suck for a few years. Boo hoo. Plenty of great programs have tanked for a few years because they had a bad coach. JoPa sacrificed the future of the Penn state program for his own selfish interests. JoPa was a bad coach, he destroyed Penn State football.

College football is a zero sum game. Every win for one team is a loss for another. Why do Penn State and its fans have a right to win football games any more than any other team? The sense of entitlement coming out of Happy Valley is sickening. I'm personally going to revel a little bit in every Penn State loss for at least a decade. Players and fans at another school will be able to enjoy every one of those wins.

I don't feel an ounce of sympathy for Penn State players and fans. They'll still get a chance to play all their games and have a chance to win all those games. There will be the same number of Penn State players lining up on their side of the ball as there were before all this went down. Get over yourselves, you don't have a right to anything more than what you have.

[Jacob]

JoPa was a bad coach, he destroyed Penn State football.

[Paperback Writer]

I think the highest level Penn State will ever achieve will the same as SMU: respectable, but not top-drawer ever again. Caveat: I understand that SMU decided to come back with football de-emphasized, and set up structures to ensure the sport would never achieve the relative importance on campus that it had before. I wonder if PSU leaders can find it in them to do the same.

I predict otherwise. There are a lot of differences between SMU of 1987 and PSU of 2012.
1. SMU is a small private school; PSU is a large public one. Because of it's size, SMU struggled to compete with Texas, Texas A&M, and Arkansas and their resorting to cheating and paying players was a direct result.
2. SMU did not have very good football facilitis. In the heyday in the 1980s, they played in Cowboy Stadium in Irving. PSU has excellent football facilities in Happy Valley.
3. SMU lost it's conference when the SWC disbanned. The Big Ten is keeping PSU around.
4. Penn St. will continue to be a top destination school for in state and area talent. They have some of the top facilities in the country and are located in an area with a lot of football talent. PSU also draws from east coast talent. Sure those players will have other options but PSU will still draw talent. On the other hand, SMU was never in a competitive postion in relation to Texas, Texas A&M, Oklahoma, and whoever else was recruiting Dallas, Houston, and the rest of the state.

While I hope football is de-emphasized at PSU and elsewhere, I don't think PSU will fall off the same cliff as SMU. PSU has tradition, facilities, and advantages that SMU never had. PSU football will be back sooner rather than later but a lot of that depends upon the quality of coaching. No one was sure what would happen to PSU football after JoePa retired. It is not easy to follow a legend. Because of PSU's probation, I would think HC Bill O'Brien will have a better chance of succeeding than others. There are not a lot of data points to compare Joe Paterno's era at Penn St. Some that come to mind are Lavell Edwards-BYU, Tom Osborne-Nebraska, Bear Bryant-Alabama, Bobby Bowden-FSU. If O'Brien is given the chance I think he will be given and if he is a good college HC, Penn St. will be back in less than a decade.