"You Gotta Love It Baby" Official Jazz thread

[MarkGrace]

Schroder has also taken a dive in the latest DE mock, and Givony is usually pretty well connected to the general vibe around the league.

[Blueintheface]

Lawson weighed 197 at the combine, Larkin 171. Lawson also measured an inch taller (6'0.5").

His playing weight was much less though, right? I seem to recall seeing Lawson at the draft and being blown away by how much muscle he'd added in just a few months. But this is also why I don't see Larkin becoming Lawson since he couldn't replicate the added weight gain (perhaps on purpose?).

[MarkGrace]

His playing weight was much less though, right? I seem to recall seeing Lawson at the draft and being blown away by how much muscle he'd added in just a few months. But this is also why I don't see Larkin becoming Lawson since he couldn't replicate the added weight gain (perhaps on purpose?).

His UNC profile lists 195. IDK, he always looked pretty stocky and built at UNC to me.

Lawson(3).jpg

ty-lawson-unc.jpg

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

I was watching some highlights of Crabbe out of Cal and was wondering why he isn't rated higher. He's got a great shot, looks like he moves well on the court, and had some great finishes at the rim. I was sitting there thinking, "He looks how I hoped Morris Almond would play."

Then I checked the measurements. Both guys measured at 6'6", Mo had a 6'10" span and Crabbe is 6'11" there, their no-step and max verts were almost identical, and their agility testing was similar. The only real difference was Crabbe being significantly faster on the sprint.

So maybe I no longer think highly of Crabbe.

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

Lawson weighed 197 at the combine, Larkin 171. Lawson also measured an inch taller (6'0.5").

I didn't realize Larkin measured that light. No way he gets into the lane as well as Lawson does with that slight of a frame. Lawson is quicker than almost anyone, but once he gets his shoulders beyond his defender, he's stout enough to not get pushed off line. And he's defied any expectation I had about being able to finish at the rim in the NBA; he's done much better at that than I thought he ever would.

I do think Larkin looks to be a superior passer right now. Lawson was deadly in SnR action because of his incredible quickness and great handle. Larkin seems to kill it not just because of his ability, but because he picks angles well and has great vision.

[Blueintheface]

His UNC profile lists 195. IDK, he always looked pretty stocky and built at UNC to me.

Time for an eye exam. If I could just find the damn door...

[smokymountainrain]

I didn't realize Larkin measured that light. No way he gets into the lane as well as Lawson does with that slight of a frame. Lawson is quicker than almost anyone, but once he gets his shoulders beyond his defender, he's stout enough to not get pushed off line. And he's defied any expectation I had about being able to finish at the rim in the NBA; he's done much better at that than I thought he ever would.

I do think Larkin looks to be a superior passer right now. Lawson was deadly in SnR action because of his incredible quickness and great handle. Larkin seems to kill it not just because of his ability, but because he picks angles well and has great vision.

Also, Larkin, at the same stage is a better shooter with a sweeter stroke that Lawson had. The problem comes when projecting - Lawson has become a dangerous shooter and has elite quickness, strength and skill in terms of getting to and finishing at the rim. It seems doubtful Larkin could come in and do what Lawson has done. That said, we would have said the same thing about Lawson when he was entering the draft when being compared to - insert name of random borderline all-star PG at the time.

[MarkGrace]

Utah Jazz bring in 24 free agents for unprecedented 3-day minicamp

The Utah Jazz are throwing a wrinkle into their offseason player evaluation process.

The Jazz will work out 24 free agents — mostly from the D-League and international leagues — during a three-day minicamp that began Tuesday with physicals and will run through Thursday at Zions Bank Basketball Center.

Though there aren't any big names on the list of free agents, this is an unprecedented move for the Jazz, who have more than half of their 13-15-man roster to fill this offseason.

The most recognizable names of participating free agents are former Jazz player Travis Leslie, who played briefly with Utah on a 10-day contract last spring; ex-Phoenix big man Luke Zeller, whose brother, Cody Zeller, recently worked out for the organization; and forward Lazar Hayward, who has been on NBA rosters with Oklahoma City and Minnesota.

The Jazz will also hold another pre-draft workout Wednesday between two free agent sessions. Utah hasn't yet released the list of NBA hopefuls who'll participate in that tryout, but likely lottery-bound Lehigh point guard C.J. McCollum will be in that group.

The minicamp and pre-draft workout are closed to the public.

Here is the current roster for the Jazz's free agent minicamp:

Dee Bost, 6-2, 176 (Recent team: Buducnost, College: Mississippi St. 2012)

Will Buford, 6-6, 220 (Bluesens Monbus, Ohio State '12)

Xavier Gibson, 6-11, 229 (Panelefsinlakos, Florida State '12)

Drew Gordon, 6-9, 235 (Sanco di Sardania, New Mexico '12)

JaMychal Green, 6-8, 220 (Austin Toros, Alabama '12)

Rodney Green, 6-5, 205 (Novipiu Casale, LaSalle '10)

Jorge Gutierrez, 6-3, 194 (Canton Charge, California '12)

Marquez Haynes, 6-3, 185 (Art Dragons-GER, Texas Arlington '10)

Lazar Hayward, 6-6, 225 (Los Angeles Defenders, Marquette '10)

Cedric Jackson, 6-3, 209 (Breakers-AUS, Cleveland State '09)

Edwin Jackson, 6-3, 201 (ASVEL)

Rick Jackson, 6-9, 235 (Austin Toros, Syracuse '12)

D.J. Kennedy, 6-6, 215 (Rio Grande Valley Vipers, St. John’s '11)

Travis Leslie, 6-4, 205 (Santa Cruz Warriors, Georgia '11)

Rasid Mahalbasic, 6-10, 220 (Asseco Prokom)

Toure Murry, 6-5, 200 (Rio Grande Valley Vipers, Wichita State '12)

Harouna Mutombo, 6-5, 200 (Peja-Kosovo, West Carolina '12)

Arinze Onuaku, 6-9, 255 (Canton Charge, Syracuse '10)

Josh Owens, 6-8, 245 (Idaho Stampede, Stanford '12)

Chris Roberts, 6-4, 205 (Austin Toros, Bradley '10)

Henry Sims, 6-10, 244 (Petron Blaze, Georgetown '12)

Jermaine Taylor, 6-4, 209 (Maine Red Claws, Central Florida '09)

Chris Wright, 6-8, 220 (Maine Red Claws, Dayton '11)

Luke Zeller, 6-11, 244 (Phoenix Suns, Notre Dame '09)

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865581491/Utah-Jazz-bring-in-24-free-agents-for-unprecedented-3-day-minicamp.html

This isn't exactly today's news, but it feels like another indication Tank City is upon us.

[The_Douger]

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/8...-minicamp.html

This isn't exactly today's news, but it feels like another indication Tank City is upon us.

I can live with tanking for a year if it gets us a difference maker. Jazz management and ownership has never seemed to be ok with this approach.

Maybe Dennis Lindsay has come in and sold them on this.

There's enough good coaches available right now that I'd really like to see us let Corbin go and bring someone in.

[MarkGrace]

I can live with tanking for a year if it gets us a difference maker. Jazz management and ownership has never seemed to be ok with this approach.

Maybe Dennis Lindsay has come in and sold them on this.

There's enough good coaches available right now that I'd really like to see us let Corbin go and bring someone in.

You said in your first line you're ok with tanking. ha.

[The_Douger]

You said in your first line you're ok with tanking. ha.

I think you can sell those guys on a year of tanking. Then you know at least you have someone competent in place.

I think we all know Ty is not competent. I just worry there won't be anyone good to bring in. I'd love Karl or Hollins here. We should just pay to keep them on retainer. Secretly.

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

I'm really surprised Drew Gordon didn't play in the NBA last year. Good size for a 4, good athlete.

I'd be surprised if ever player on that FA workout list isn't better than Murphy. How are the Jazz even allowing that kid in their practice facility any more? I've never seen an NBA player shoot more airballs or just catch glass. He looked so out classed it was painful.

I wonder if part of Linday's plan is to get guys on the end of the bench that are able and willing to excel at one or two skills. That would fit in with the SA plan: find a defensive specialist, find a sharpshooter, and then let them fill those roles knowing that is really all the team is going to want them to do. Probably more important to a team's overall success to have guys like that, rather than someone like Marvin Williams who isn't good at anything, or Randy Foye, someone that can shoot it but is convinced he is more than that and should play more minutes because of it.

[MarkGrace]

I'm really surprised Drew Gordon didn't play in the NBA last year. Good size for a 4, good athlete.

Just read his draft profile from ESPN.

Long athlete
Good hands
Explosive leaper, quick off the floor
Runs the floor well
Midrange jump shot
Solid rebounder
Shot-blocker
Plays well without the ball

Negatives
No post game
Poor footwork
Lacks basketball IQ
Needs to add strength

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft/results/player/_/id/19266/drew-gordon

Jeremy Evans, is that you?!

I wonder if part of Linday's plan is to get guys on the end of the bench that are able and willing to excel at one or two skills. That would fit in with the SA plan: find a defensive specialist, find a sharpshooter, and then let them fill those roles knowing that is really all the team is going to want them to do. Probably more important to a team's overall success to have guys like that, rather than someone like Marvin Williams who isn't good at anything, or Randy Foye, someone that can shoot it but is convinced he is more than that and should play more minutes because of it.

That seems like it would be the plan. I've read the Spurs have done stuff like this before, and I'm guessing their hope is they can find a guy or two that could eventually develop into a specialist type role. The type of guy that in a couple years could be a defensive or shooting specialist to complement some of the more talented players in the way the Spurs have done so well. Also would seem to suggest that the plan is to play this year as cheaply as possible in hopes of picking up assets for taking on bad contract. I think the Jazz are going to lose a lot of games this year.

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

That seems like it would be the plan. I've read the Spurs have done stuff like this before, and I'm guessing their hope is they can find a guy or two that could eventually develop into a specialist type role. The type of guy that in a couple years could be a defensive or shooting specialist to complement some of the more talented players in the way the Spurs have done so well. Also would seem to suggest that the plan is to play this year as cheaply as possible in hopes of picking up assets for taking on bad contract. I think the Jazz are going to lose a lot of games this year.

With teams slightly under the cap, the question of what a first round pick is worth is an interesting debate. If you're a team and you're $5 M under the cap, would you be willing to take $4M in salary back to get a first round pick? What about $2 M? But that discussion changes when you're a team like Utah will be this year, where depending on what you decide to do with your roster you might actually need to take salary on to meet the league minimum. The minimum will be $49 M, and the Jazz only have $26 M committed (that includes Murphy's option at $788k). So if the plan is to turn the team over to the future, then I do wonder how many assets they could pick up by making trades to relieve teams of salary.

The Dallas pick at 13 is a popular topic, because Dallas clearly wants to clear as much space as possible, but would also like to retain OJ Mayo if it doesn't cost them a shot at Dwight Howard. Shawn Marion makes $9 M. No team would pay $9 M to get the 13th pick. But if Utah needs to get to the $49 M and doesn't want to add salary beyond 2013-14, would they consider taking Marion on for the 13th pick and a 2015 Dallas first? The 13th and Beaubois? I wonder what they'd be able to buy Marion out for, what kind of cut he'd take to then go and sign with Miami or LA.

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

What do you guys think about CJ McCollum? He's going to be long gone by 14, but would you be pleased if Utah traded the 14 and 21 to move up to get him? Is he the next big scoring guard from a small school, like Lillard? Or was he a flash in the pan that is going to get exposed? These are some numbers I posted on CB about him:

CJ McCollum is likely going to be a top 10 pick this year essentially based on 12 games he played his senior season before getting hurt, and one game against Dook in the previous NCAA tourney (a game where Lehigh upset Dook, but McCollum only made 37% of his shots and was 2-7 from 3). In those 12 games he was remarkable, shooting 50% from 3 and averaging 24 ppg in only 31 mpg. And he did play Baylor and Pitt. But here is who the other 10 opponents were:

Robert Morris
Fairfield
Penn
Sacred Heart
Quinnipac
Fair Dickinson
Fordham
St. Francis
Bryant U
VCU (played 15 minutes before getting hurt, was 0-5 from the field)

The previous two years McCollum shot 34% and 31% from 3pt range while playing in the Patriot League. Against Iowa St his junior year he was 0-5 from 3, against Michigan St he was 2-6, against the best team in the Patriot League that year he was 2-6 in 2 games, against Dook he was 2-6, and in the next round of the NCAA tourney he was 0-6 against Xavier. His sophomore season Lehigh played a bunch of nobodies outside of conference to go with all of the nobodies in conference. They did play USC and Penn St and he was a combined 5-19 from the field and 0-4 from 3 in those games. And against Bucknell, their toughest conference foe, he was 12-34 in 2 games. He looks like the perfect example of a guy that puts up nice numbers against bad teams and then struggles big time against even decent competition. The only real exception were those two games his senior year against Baylor and Pitt. So did he really take that huge step forward, or did he get hurt before his shooting came back down to earth?

I do like that his sophomore and junior years he really rebounded well and picked up a ton of steals. I don't buy the comparisons to Damian Lillard yet. But maybe he's the next Vinnie Johnson. Or maybe when he was to play against NBA talent each night he'll be a chucker who has a hard time getting decent shots off.