"You Gotta Love It Baby" Official Jazz thread

[MarkGrace]

Thanks, falafel. Bird seems committed, but a lot of GM's say crap like that right before canning a guy. I'd much rather have Vogel than an unproven Vogel assistant.

I was also hoping Thibs would get canned for his refusal to tank, but seems we're out of luck there.

[MarkGrace]

Despite the fact you never made it to the NCAA tourney.

I never actually have made it to the NCAA tourney. One of these years I'd like to go.

[cougjunkie]

You won't be after the Jazz hire Boylen and he let's us in on the secret to Pops success. At that point you'll be running scared.

I think Pop is the best coach in the NBA and it is really not close. I have seen what he has done with guys like Malik Rose, Jaren Jackson, Antonio Daniels, Bruce Bowen, Derek Anderson and more recently guys like Danny Green, Patty Mills, Dejuan Blair and Gary Neal. He has turned these guys in to serviceable NBA players and the majority have gone on to sign larger contracts with other teams only to wind up stealing money throughout the duration of those deals.

However the one thing that has not changed is the core of this team, Timmy, Tony and Manu. Pop has made adjustments and he has added and subtracted pieces, however the core has stayed the same. It helps that his entire team buys in to his concept as well.

I obviously don't care about my family like Funk does, and watch a lot of basketball. Nobody moves the ball like the Spurs. It is no longer dump it in to the post and let Timmy go to work.

[Jacob]

I've read a bunch of stuff on the candidates, and not many in the national media seem to bat an eyelash at the Utah thing when his name is mentioned. They acknowledge that it would be an unpopular pick, but that's about it. It's only the local stuff which views his situation as unique, because they sat around and watched and think it's somehow different. But stuff like recruiting, kids transferring, scorched earth (or even better, salted earth!), looking in over his head, making excuses, etc., and all this other evidence of how terrible he is makes me laugh. This sounds about like most coaching failures.

I don't think national media guys have a clue of who would and would not make a good coach. Why should we care what any of them say?

The only thing that I really find worrisome about his tenure at the U is his temperament and behavior. The stepping out in front of the player thing was truly bizarre.

So, the only problem areas are probably the most important characteristics in a coach. At least, IMO. Sounds good!

[MarkGrace]

I think Pop is the best coach in the NBA and it is really not close. I have seen what he has done with guys like Malik Rose, Jaren Jackson, Antonio Daniels, Bruce Bowen, Derek Anderson and more recently guys like Danny Green, Patty Mills, Dejuan Blair and Gary Neal. He has turned these guys in to serviceable NBA players and the majority have gone on to sign larger contracts with other teams only to wind up stealing money throughout the duration of those deals.

However the one thing that has not changed is the core of this team, Timmy, Tony and Manu. Pop has made adjustments and he has added and subtracted pieces, however the core has stayed the same. It helps that his entire team buys in to his concept as well.

I obviously don't care about my family like Funk does, and watch a lot of basketball. Nobody moves the ball like the Spurs. It is no longer dump it in to the post and let Timmy go to work.

Pops is the best coach of my lifetime. Pops is also probably one of the 5 best coaches to ever do it at the NBA level. I know everyone here hates Boylen with a fiery passion, and I know any given coach's recommendation means nothing in terms success, but ascending to the 1st spot on Pops' bench is reason enough for me to give him the benefit of the doubt if hired. Doesn't make me excited about him, doesn't make him the guy I want, but seriously, that fact alone is enough for me to be fine with it if the Jazz give him a shot.

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

I obviously don't care about my family like Funk does, and watch a lot of basketball. Nobody moves the ball like the Spurs. It is no longer dump it in to the post and let Timmy go to work.

It is nice to have boys that like to watch hoops, except they are front runners and only want to watch good teams. I tried explaining to them how important Jazz losses are over the last 5 years but they don't get it.

[MarkGrace]

I don't think national media guys have a clue of who would and would not make a good coach. Why should we care what any of them say?

They have no more or less of a clue than the local media or anyone on this board. Why should we care what any of us say? Obviously we don't.

So, the only problem areas are probably the most important characteristics in a coach. At least, IMO. Sounds good!

You think it's the most important? Is this the point where we do examples of good coaches with poor temperament (of which there are plenty) and poor coaches with good temperament (of which there are plenty). I hope not. I need to get back to work.

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

Pops is the best coach of my lifetime. Pops is also probably one of the 5 best coaches to ever do it at the NBA level. I know everyone here hates Boylen with a fiery passion, and I know any given coach's recommendation means nothing in terms success, but ascending to the 1st spot on Pops' bench is reason enough for me to give him the benefit of the doubt if hired. Doesn't make me excited about him, doesn't make him the guy I want, but seriously, that fact alone is enough for me to be fine with it if the Jazz give him a shot.

How long before a guy is considered a branch on a coaching tree? Maybe Boylen has learned enough from Pop in 1 season to be as good as Del Negro.

James Borrego was with the Spurs for 7 years, first as video coordinator, then asst coach. Then he was with Monty Williams for 2 years, and now coaches in Orlando under Vaughn. I wonder how an asst goes from unknown to being mentioned with most coaching vacancies that come up.

[smokymountainrain]

How long before a guy is considered a branch on a coaching tree? Maybe Boylen has learned enough from Pop in 1 season to be as good as Del Negro.

James Borrego was with the Spurs for 7 years, first as video coordinator, then asst coach. Then he was with Monty Williams for 2 years, and now coaches in Orlando under Vaughn. I wonder how an asst goes from unknown to being mentioned with most coaching vacancies that come up.

Some guys are great assistant coaches, but simply aren't HC material. MG mentions Boylen moving up to #1 assistant under Pop - okay, so he's a great assistant coach. Pop is fortunate to have him and the Jazz should just leave it alone as we don't want Popovich pissed at the Jazz.

[cougjunkie]

Pops is the best coach of my lifetime. Pops is also probably one of the 5 best coaches to ever do it at the NBA level. I know everyone here hates Boylen with a fiery passion, and I know any given coach's recommendation means nothing in terms success, but ascending to the 1st spot on Pops' bench is reason enough for me to give him the benefit of the doubt if hired. Doesn't make me excited about him, doesn't make him the guy I want, but seriously, that fact alone is enough for me to be fine with it if the Jazz give him a shot.

The Pop coaching tree should be a good indication of NBA success:

Monty Williams, Doc Rivers, Vinny Del Negro, Jacque Vaughn, "Bud" Budenholzer, Brett Brown, Mike Brown, PJ Carlesimo.

[cougjunkie]

It is nice to have boys that like to watch hoops, except they are front runners and only want to watch good teams. I tried explaining to them how important Jazz losses are over the last 5 years but they don't get it.

I can't wait for that.

[MarkGrace]

How long before a guy is considered a branch on a coaching tree? Maybe Boylen has learned enough from Pop in 1 season to be as good as Del Negro.

James Borrego was with the Spurs for 7 years, first as video coordinator, then asst coach. Then he was with Monty Williams for 2 years, and now coaches in Orlando under Vaughn. I wonder how an asst goes from unknown to being mentioned with most coaching vacancies that come up.

Yeah, that's a good question. Seems most of the assistants being mentioned in this case have a direct tie to Lindsey. Boylen, Longabardi, Jones, etc. The funny thing is, I really want Longabardi. But most of that is just because I like where he stands philosophically as it relates to defense; I think he has a really great grasp of defensive efficiency and how to achieve, and obviously has some legitimate results in doing that. But in terms of just strictly NBA experience, I think Boylen's is probably better and broader. Of course I don't think that means he's going to be better and I still want that little horse jockey (have you seen that video of him coaching the C's? hysterical) Longabardi. I think it's reasonable to assume the next coach will have a tie to Lindsey, but probably not out of the question that he won't. The real curveball would be Messina.

[cougjunkie]

Some guys are great assistant coaches, but simply aren't HC material. MG mentions Boylen moving up to #1 assistant under Pop - okay, so he's a great assistant coach. Pop is fortunate to have him and the Jazz should just leave it alone as we don't want Popovich pissed at the Jazz.

Boylen became lead assistant by default.

Budenholzer left (who was the lead assistant for a long time). Pop promoted Brett Brown to lead assistant, and Sean Marks from director of basketball operations to fill the void. In June, Brown was hired by Philly.

Pop has two very inexperienced assistants in Marks and Ime Udoka. He does have Chip Englland on staff but he is the shooting coach not an X and O's guy. Pop needed a veteran on the staff and went after Boylen.

Another up and comer they have is Chad Forcier, Pop loves this kid and raves about him. He spent 5 years under George Karl, 6 years under Rick Carlisle and now 4 under Pop. I would expect he gets his chance pretty soon.

[Blueintheface]

I had a chance to meet and speak briefly with Boylen about 6 months to a year into his tenure at Utah and he was by far the nicest local public figure I have met. I mentioned my allegiance to BYU and he simply said "we'd still love to have you up to watch our games". IIRC correctly he was also just about the nicest guy publically when it came to the rivalry. All that said, I don't want him to coach the Jazz.

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

The Pop coaching tree should be a good indication of NBA success:

Monty Williams, Doc Rivers, Vinny Del Negro, Jacque Vaughn, "Bud" Budenholzer, Brett Brown, Mike Brown, PJ Carlesimo.

That's a weird looking tree, given the grafted branches that aren't really part of it.

Carlesimo was head coach at Seton Hall for 12 years and had two head coaching jobs in the NBA before spending several years in SA as an assistant.

Doc Rivers finished his career as a player in SA, but his first coaching job was as the had guy for Orlando.

Brown would be part of Carlisle's "tree" as much as Pop's, maybe more so since his last years as an asst were under Carlisle before getting the Cleveland head job.

Del Negro never coached with Pop.

Who knows what will come of Vaughn, Budenholzer, and Brown, but right now the results of trying to find the next coaching star by plucking a guy from Pop's staff are surprisingly limited.