The official Dave Rice is a better coach than Special K thread..........

[Clark Addison]

Right. If we're talking apples to apples, only tournament games count, not play-ins.

Rose is a fine coach and may end up being a great one. I'd love to have him at Utah (both his parents are Utah grads, I understand). He had a very good season this year and got to the play-in round, but he didn't win a NCAA Tournament "round of 64" game. It's hard to compare Rose's early career success in play-in games with Majerius's early career, when (I think) there were no play-in games. If there were, Majerus never coached in one.

No charge for the analysis.

Not related to Majerus vs. Rose, but I wonder if your principled stand against play-in games extends to Utah's 1983 first round win. Does that win in a play-in game also not count as a tournament win?

Maybe it would be best if it doesn't, as then Utah's loss in a 1979 play-in game also doesn't count.

As to Majerus vs. Rose, it's a stupid conversation. I always thought Majerus was a great coach, and he obviously has accomplished more than Rose so far. If it will make you happy I will also stipulate that Ike Armstrong was a better football coach than Chick Atkinson. But if you all really want to compare BYU and Utah coaches, then it is more meaningful to me to know that Rose is a better coach than Utah's current coach (as well as their previous coach, and the coach before that, but again, those are not as important). I like Majerus, though.

[SeattleUte]

Not related to Majerus vs. Rose, but I wonder if your principled stand against play-in games extends to Utah's 1983 first round win. Does that win in a play-in game also not count as a tournament win?

Maybe it would be best if it doesn't, as then Utah's loss in a 1979 play-in game also doesn't count.

As to Majerus vs. Rose, it's a stupid conversation. I always thought Majerus was a great coach, and he obviously has accomplished more than Rose so far. If it will make you happy I will also stipulate that Ike Armstrong was a better football coach than Chick Atkinson. But if you all really want to compare BYU and Utah coaches, then it is more meaningful to me to know that Rose is a better coach than Utah's current coach (as well as their previous coach, and the coach before that, but again, those are not as important). I like Majerus, though.

I am not ready to concede that Rose is better than K.

[Clark Addison]

I am not ready to concede that Rose is better than K.

That's fine. I' OK with waiting a couple of years.

[Top Ute]

If it will make you happy I will also stipulate that Ike Armstrong was a better football coach than Chick Atkinson.

I don't know if I'm "happy" to hear a BYU fan admit this, but I will say that I'm relieved to know you're not clinically insane by suggesting otherwise.

[il Padrino Ute]

Not related to Majerus vs. Rose, but I wonder if your principled stand against play-in games extends to Utah's 1983 first round win. Does that win in a play-in game also not count as a tournament win?

Maybe it would be best if it doesn't, as then Utah's loss in a 1979 play-in game also doesn't count.

I'm wondering if those games you're talking about were really play-in games, as the highest seeds had byes in the first round, whereas now, there are no byes in the tournament. And the winners of these games don't even play against the highest seeds.

[U-Ute]

K v Rice will work itself out in time. All I know right now is that Utah is the better program.

[ERCougar]

This thread's awesomeness continues to grow.

This thread IS awesome!

Which do you think made it the awesomest:
1) funk's contention that Rose will never be even half the coach that Majerus was, based on tournament success, despite having a clearly better first seven years, with three times as many NCAA appearances
2) funk's idea that zoobies were smacking the U with the thought of them hiring a mere assistant coach, instead of...oh wait...
3) SU's argument that K's 5 win season clearly demonstrates his superiority over Rice, since he lost a NCAA tourney game.

It really is tough to pick just one, isnt it?

[Scorcho]

This thread IS awesome!

Which do you think made it the awesomest:
1) funk's contention that Rose will never be even half the coach that Majerus was, based on tournament success, despite having a clearly better first seven years, with three times as many NCAA appearances
2) funk's idea that zoobies were smacking the U with the thought of them hiring a mere assistant coach, instead of...oh wait...
3) SU's argument that K's 5 win season clearly demonstrates his superiority over Rice, since he lost a NCAA tourney game.

It really is tough to pick just one, isnt it?

regarding #3, wouldn't you compare Krystko's 1st season as a collegiate head coach with Rice's first season? Both teams made the NCAA, UNLV as a #6 seed, Montana as a #12 seed. Krystko's team won, and we know how Rice did.

[ERCougar]

regarding #3, wouldn't you compare Krystko's 1st season as a collegiate head coach with Rice's first season? Both teams made the NCAA, UNLV as a #6 seed, Montana as a #12 seed. Krystko's team won, and we know how Rice did.

All smack aside...
I don't know which coach is better. Honestly, I'm glad Utah didn't pursue Rice (at least very hard), because I think he might have taken the job, and my hunch is that he's a better coach, but that has as much to do with a lack of familiarity with K as anything. I just found SU's argument that K is clearly better because Rice lost while K was watching at home to be...well, awesome.

On a side note, I think the NCAA tournament is a pretty poor (if easy) way to evaluate a coach because the sample size is too small and the worse team wins too frequently. Was Tom Coughlin the best coach in the NFL this year? I'm more impressed with Majerus' multiple 28-30 win seasons than a run to the finals (not to discount the latter). It takes more to keep a team excellent and well-prepared for every game for an entire season than to get hot for six games.

[Donuthole]

All smack aside...
I don't know which coach is better. Honestly, I'm glad Utah didn't pursue Rice (at least very hard), because I think he might have taken the job, and my hunch is that he's a better coach, but that has as much to do with a lack of familiarity with K as anything. I just found SU's argument that K is clearly better because Rice lost while K was watching at home to be...well, awesome.

On a side note, I think the NCAA tournament is a pretty poor (if easy) way to evaluate a coach because the sample size is too small and the worse team wins too frequently. Was Tom Coughlin the best coach in the NFL this year? I'm more impressed with Majerus' multiple 28-30 win seasons than a run to the finals (not to discount the latter). It takes more to keep a team excellent and well-prepared for every game for an entire season than to get hot for six games.

The easiest way to refute NCAA Tourney success as evidence of a good coach is to mention Giac, especially when arguing about it with a Utah fan.

[SeattleUte]

regarding #3, wouldn't you compare Krystko's 1st season as a collegiate head coach with Rice's first season? Both teams made the NCAA, UNLV as a #6 seed, Montana as a #12 seed. Krystko's team won, and we know how Rice did.

AWESOME

[Art Vandelay]

K v Rice will work itself out in time. All I know right now is that Utah is the better program.

We're still talking about basketball in this thread, right?

[SeattleUte]

All smack aside...
I don't know which coach is better. Honestly, I'm glad Utah didn't pursue Rice (at least very hard), because I think he might have taken the job, and my hunch is that he's a better coach, but that has as much to do with a lack of familiarity with K as anything. I just found SU's argument that K is clearly better because Rice lost while K was watching at home to be...well, awesome.

On a side note, I think the NCAA tournament is a pretty poor (if easy) way to evaluate a coach because the sample size is too small and the worse team wins too frequently. Was Tom Coughlin the best coach in the NFL this year? I'm more impressed with Majerus' multiple 28-30 win seasons than a run to the finals (not to discount the latter). It takes more to keep a team excellent and well-prepared for every game for an entire season than to get hot for six games.

If you don't think that this season cost Rice goodwill at UNLV you're deluded.

[ERCougar]

If you don't think that this season cost Rice goodwill at UNLV you're deluded.

Yes, the bar is a bit higher than "keep it within 30 and we're happy!"

[SeattleUte]

We're still talking about basketball in this thread, right?

I don't know whose program is better at this point. I do know Utah has a better tradition, and he may have meant that. Utah also has a brighter future, IMMHO.