Confirmed: Senator Mike Lee is a wanker

[frank ryan]

I dont even know where to begin with this (and the last few posts in this thread).

"I approve of this sexual predator because he opposes this guy I hate and it's ok because the guy I hate is also a sexual predator" should be obvious in its hypocrisy regardless of how much you hate Trump. If you argued that the toxicity of Trump was the most important reason to get him out of office, and you still support the Lincoln Project, your credibility is worthless. It just means you disapproved of HIS toxic behavior and are ok with your side's toxic behavior. Seems like it wasn't all about norms and integrity after all. What a great way to ensure unity. And by the way, Weaver as a sexual predator makes Trump look like a choir boy.

And despite what the supporters of the Lincoln Project say, they aren't accomplishing anything but lining their own pockets. They dumped a ton of money in this election and didn't flip one seat. Not one. They threw $12 million at seven Democratic Senate candidates in races they promised they could win. They are so completely ineffectual and incompetent, they couldnt even stop Susan Collins from being elected. Yet they praise themselves and collect money from dupes, all while harboring a sexual predator knowing full well the accusations against him...until they couldn't anymore. This is an organization that is worthy of praise and support?

This group is so toxic, not even other never Trumpers will support them. They say they want to remake the GOP, but if they cant even get the support of people like Jonah Goldberg or David French, they will never garner support among the base. Never.

Schmidt is a bully, a cheat, and a narcissist. And now we know a protector of sexual predators. This is the person you all want to primary Lee?

Which brings me to Lee. You all are up in the night if you think Lee doesn't win re-election. Lee is more popular in this state right now than Romney. If Lee gets primaried, it will be someone far worse than Lee. But Schmidt? Lol.

I know you guys want accountability. You wants heads to roll. Punishment meted(?). But that doesn't really happen in politics. And you will never be satisfied if you don't accept anything less. The best to hope for is for the fever to break and the GOP pretends the last 5 years didn't happen. Hope that they become more reasonable and keep the Dem excesses in check. GWB, the worst president of the last 45 years, never attoned for his sins. Neither did the politicians that supported him. Many are still in office. If you require a public tour of penance and self flagellation, you should look elsewhere.

Is Lee more popular with all Utahns of just republicans? As of this poll his disapproval rating is 41 percent, Romney's is 46.


https://www.deseret.com/utah/2021/1/...biden-democrat

Bush didn't try to exercise a coup de'tat.

[USUC]

Trump partied with Epstein Was was accused of violently raping a 13 y/o among other things. Trump predatory sexual behaviors are pretty vile. I'm not sure you can assert Trump isn't as bad.

Fair point, but I see a lot of effort put in here to focus on Trump while avoiding Weaver. Can I at least get a condemnation and acknowledgment that he is terrible and the project is a grift?

Is Lee more popular with all Utahns of just republicans? As of this pole his disapproval rating is 41 percent, Romney's is 46.


https://www.deseret.com/utah/2021/1/...biden-democrat

Bush didn't try to exercise a coup de'tat.

More popular among GOP = more electable In the state. The reality is what it is.

As of 2/06/2021, GWB's policies have been more consequential than Trump's failed coup. Time will tell if that changes, but it ain't close now.

[frank ryan]

Fair point, but I see a lot of effort put in here to focus on Trump while avoiding Weaver. Can I at least get a condemnation and acknowledgment that he is terrible and the project is a grift?



More popular among GOP = more electable In the state. The reality is what it is.

As of 2/06/2021, GWB's policies have been more consequential than Trump's failed coup. Time will tell if that changes, but it ain't close now.

No one is defending Weaver. You compared him to Trump. I don't know that the project is a grift but Weaver's behavior is definitely predatory.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Why are we talking about weaver?

[Now who’s the dean?]

Fair point, but I see a lot of effort put in here to focus on Trump while avoiding Weaver. Can I at least get a condemnation and acknowledgment that he is terrible and the project is a grift?

Did you read the 2nd sentence of my 2 sentence post?

[Moliere]

Wait, the Lincoln project tried to oust Susan Collins? Why? She’s probably the most moderate senator the GOP has.


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[USUC]

Wait, the Lincoln project tried to oust Susan Collins? Why? She’s probably the most moderate senator the GOP has.


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They sure did. What better way to try and stick it to Trump than make sure one of his biggest GOP critics and roadblock loses, am I right? Hooray for the non grifters at the Lincoln Project!

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/mee...181#blogHeader

[USUC]

Did you read the 2nd sentence of my 2 sentence post?

The one where you say he is a "skeezy perv" but was worthwhile because he was part of an organization that tossed trumpers in the gutter? Even though they never actually tossed a Trumper in the gutter? Yes, I read that.

[BlueK]

You're not arguing this in good faith. No where did I say Weaver and Trump are equally damaging. I said they are both sexual predators, but Weaver is the more egregious sexual predator. Trump has more power and is therefore much more damaging well beyond his sexual deviance. But because Weaver doesn't have as much power as Trump we can look past his predatory ways?

And as of now, yes GWB was a worse president. Trump may very well be worse, time will tell how long lasting his stamp will be. But Bush left us with 2 disaster wars, kicked the door open for unlimited spending, and created the norm of governing through executive order. Sure he is a good guy at heart, but his presidency was a disaster for this country.

Trump just tried to overthrow our entire Constitution by nearly destroying the legislative branch of government through egging on a violent mob intent on murdering the vice president and any other member of Congress they could find. Only by the grace of God, IMO, did it not turn out to be a huge tragedy. Then he sat for HOURS doing nothing to stop it. Politically it's by far the worst thing any US president has ever done.

[USUC]

Trump just tried to overthrow our entire Constitution by nearly destroying the legislative branch of government through egging on a violent mob intent on murdering the vice president and any other member of Congress they could find. Only by the grace of God, IMO, did it not turn out to be a huge tragedy. Then he sat for HOURS doing nothing to stop it. Politically it's by far the worst thing any US president has ever done.

Ok, ok. Looks like we are going to have to define the parameters of what makes a "worse" president. Look, I think Trump is probably one of the most morally lacking, divisive, and ill intentioned person to be president. This is certainly true since Nixon. But the only way to truly judge how bad a president is, is the long term consequences of their policies and behavior. And right now we just dont have enough data. We arent even a month removed from his presidency. Right now the GOP base is almost fully behind him. They beleive his lies. Some of them tried to carry out his wishes to overturn an election. If in 2024 and 2028 the GOP base still believes and espouses his lies and it is believed that a coup is acceptable, then yes. He is the worst modern president. But right now, he pales in comparison to Woodrow Wilson.

Edit: and yes, at this point I still stand by my assertion that GWB was a worse president than Trump. Bush seemsnlike a good guy who just happened to open the gates of hell to bad governance and disastrous foreign policy.

[Now who’s the dean?]

The one where you say he is a "skeezy perv" but was worthwhile because he was part of an organization that tossed trumpers in the gutter? Even though they never actually tossed a Trumper in the gutter? Yes, I read that.

Heh. Clearly I’m the one making a bad faith argument.

[USUC]

Heh. Clearly I’m the one making a bad faith argument.

"Sleezy perv" is kind of dismissive descriptor for a predator, isn't it? What is the good faith way to take your statement?

[Jeff Lebowski]

Ok, ok. Looks like we are going to have to define the parameters of what makes a "worse" president. Look, I think Trump is probably one of the most morally lacking, divisive, and ill intentioned person to be president. This is certainly true since Nixon. But the only way to truly judge how bad a president is, is the long term consequences of their policies and behavior. And right now we just dont have enough data. We arent even a month removed from his presidency. Right now the GOP base is almost fully behind him. They beleive his lies. Some of them tried to carry out his wishes to overturn an election. If in 2024 and 2028 the GOP base still believes and espouses his lies and it is believed that a coup is acceptable, then yes. He is the worst modern president. But right now, he pales in comparison to Woodrow Wilson.

Edit: and yes, at this point I still stand by my assertion that GWB was a worse president than Trump. Bush seemsnlike a good guy who just happened to open the gates of hell to bad governance and disastrous foreign policy.

Walter, is that you?

[MartyFunkhouser]

Lost in all this discussion is that we can hopefully find common ground that Mike Lee is a wanker.

[wapiti]

When the Lincoln Project expanded its scope beyond simply ousting Trump it lost its way. I'm guessing that most of its $$$ are coming from democrats.

Lee needs to be primaried by someone with a high profile and reasonably popular. Huntsman would be fine. A wanker vs wanker primary. I would vote for the wanker who didn't compare Trump to Captain Moroni.

Also, Trump was much worse than GWB.