Ukraine - somebody explain to me

[Omaha 680]

then after 4 yrs a cycle upwards will happen and vance gets 4 yrs

Likely. But the big problem is with each changeover we swing farther to the populist left or right, depending on the election. I hate Trump's poison so much.

[SteelBlue]

That is perhaps the most disgusting thing I have ever seen a US President do in front of the cameras. Definitely the most disgusting thing a President and VP did in tandem. I am rarely surprised by Trump any more but this was a new horrific low.

The most disgusting and cowardly treatment of an ally in my lifetime and then to see his little lapdog jump in was insane.

[Donuthole]

Guys, you are really overreacting. Maybe you should take the L and chill for a while to see what shakes out.

[Northwestcoug]

You know what would be <chef's kiss> right now? Ted coming back and gushing over JD Vance. Didn't think he'd be worse than Trump, but he's actually enabling the worst of him right now.

By the way, who was the punk ass bitch who asked why Zelensky doesn't wear a suit? His response should be chiseled on a mountain somewhere.

[LVAllen]

You know what would be <chef's kiss> right now? Ted coming back and gushing over JD Vance. Didn't think he'd be worse than Trump, but he's actually enabling the worst of him right now.

By the way, who was the punk ass bitch who asked why Zelensky doesn't wear a suit? His response should be chiseled on a mountain somewhere.

It was MTG's boyfriend, Brian Glenn. He hosts Real America's Voice, a right to far right conspiracy network. They took the AP's spot in the Oval.

How many days was it since Ol' Musky was wearing a tshirt and ballcap in a Cabinet meeting? Or the same in the Oval?

[USUC]

Guys, you are really overreacting. Maybe you should take the L and chill for a while to see what shakes out.

I think most people are reacting to shameful and dishonorable behavior of Trump and Vance. It's the public humiliation and lying that is disgusting. If there is a plan under all of this, it can be implemented without acting like teenage Andrew Tate fanboys.

Zelensky has not played his hands well. He is in over his head in dealing with the change in administration and not adapting. And that is what MAGA folks are focusing on, overblowing it in the process. But even they know deep down the rhetoric is vile.

Maybe Ukraine comes out better than we think they do. But there are a number of better ways to get there than this public display. I also think that for any chance of survival now, Zelensky will probably need to step down.

[PaloAltoCougar]

That was shameful. Among the many reasons for this embarrassment is that Trump still holds a grudge for Zelenskyy's refusal to play along with Trump's request/demand for cooperation with respect to the Bidens (the "perfect" phone call). Only the most delusional MAGA supporter would believe that U.S. prestige in the international community hasn't taken a serious hit in the past few weeks.

[Northwestcoug]

They took the AP's spot in the Oval.

Of course.

[LVAllen]

Of course.

But, hey, you know who was in the Oval instead?

The Russian outlet TASS. They had a correspondent in the Oval. Apparently, the White House is now claiming that he wasn't on the approved list of media, and when they noticed THE DUDE WAS WITHIN TEN FEET OF TWO PRESIDENTS IN THE OVAL OFFICE, Karoline Leavitt escorted him out. Such Security. wOw.

[LVAllen]

Maybe Ukraine comes out better than we think they do. But there are a number of better ways to get there than this public display. I also think that for any chance of survival now, Zelensky will probably need to step down.

Were you under the belief that Zelenskyy was the one in charge of getting all the cameras there? Trump and Vance wanted to posture and act like Big Strong Men for the cameras. They were an embarrassment. The second they declared that there would be no security guarantees, there was no reason to discuss any "peace" and the whole thing was pointless.

[Pelado]

Disgusting.

[USUC]

Were you under the belief that Zelenskyy was the one in charge of getting all the cameras there? Trump and Vance wanted to posture and act like Big Strong Men for the cameras. They were an embarrassment. The second they declared that there would be no security guarantees, there was no reason to discuss any "peace" and the whole thing was pointless.

Perhaps Zelensky put on a show for the purpose of European support as he figured its pointless with the US. Don't know. Otherwise, he played his hand wrong. Macron went in the oval office flattering Trump, transparently so obvious, but it worked because Trump is a child seeking attention.

[USUC]

I think Zelensky is done. It'll be interesting to see how this plays out over the weekend.

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Watching some of the video it is clear that Zelensky was trying to play the game with Trump. But he reacted to Vance and it went to hell.

[BigFatMeanie]

That was shameful. Among the many reasons for this embarrassment is that Trump still holds a grudge for Zelenskyy's refusal to play along with Trump's request/demand for cooperation with respect to the Bidens (the "perfect" phone call). Only the most delusional MAGA supporter would believe that U.S. prestige in the international community hasn't taken a serious hit in the past few weeks.

I posit that the delusional and even the average MAGA supporter doesn't really give a crap about U.S. prestige in the international community and whether said prestige is high or low.

[BlueK]

I posit that the delusional and even the average MAGA supporter doesn't really give a crap about U.S. prestige in the international community and whether said prestige is high or low.

Actually if they were to prefer one of those they would choose low