The Police Brutality Thread

[imanihonjin]

This Charlotte case and the protests just show what a powder keg there is over police actions in the country right now.

I mean this is a guy who had a gun in his hand, refused to drop it, and was shot by a black police officer. Gotta say from that standpoint I don't see the reason for the outrage.

And although I'm glad the officer in Tulsa is being charged I think her defense will have a pretty good case -- guy isn't following commands and is going back to his car and about to reach into door or window perhaps. Should have been tased instead of shot though clearly.

I will be interested to see the video that comes out in connection with the shooting in Charlotte. The video of the Tulsa incident is disturbing, but it is curious why the guy didn't follow orders and was trying to get back to his car. It ended up that he didn't have a weapon in the car, but I can understand why the police would have been concerned. Should they have tased him before becoming so worried about what he might be going for in his SUV? Yeah, I think so, but man those are some swift decisions that have to be made in an instant.

[byu71]

This Charlotte case and the protests just show what a powder keg there is over police actions in the country right now.

I mean this is a guy who had a gun in his hand, refused to drop it, and was shot by a black police officer. Gotta say from that standpoint I don't see the reason for the outrage.

And although I'm glad the officer in Tulsa is being charged I think her defense will have a pretty good case -- guy isn't following commands and is going back to his car and about to reach into door or window perhaps. Should have been tased instead of shot though clearly.

One commentator on CNN yesterday said the police need better training. He is probably right, but he also said they should be trained to wait until the gun is actually pointed at them and the person is ready to shoot.

How about we train people to obey the commands of the police even when we think they are wrong. Then we can sue them later if they acted improperly toward us.

I have no problem with protestors, but a lot of those in the crowd are thiefs, anarchists and unfortunately really don't give a shit about the person who was tragically killed, except as an excuse to cause trouble.

[myboynoah]

One commentator on CNN yesterday said the police need better training. He is probably right, but he also said they should be trained to wait until the gun is actually pointed at them and the person is ready to shoot.

How about we train people to obey the commands of the police even when we think they are wrong. Then we can sue them later if they acted improperly toward us.

I have no problem with protestors, but a lot of those in the crowd are thiefs, anarchists and unfortunately really don't give a shit about the person who was tragically killed, except as an excuse to cause trouble.

I can't understand why people don't listen to and follow the commands of police officers. It's obvious that not doing so will only escalate the situation.

I saw a report where the police had program with young people and switched roles with them. The police (as kids) harassed, stuck phones in the face of the kids (as police), didn't follow orders, etc. It appeared to be eye-opening for the kids. It also allowed for a good interaction between the police and community. I think much, much more of this type of thing needs to happen. I would be happy to see more money put into these types of programs.

[Bo Diddley]

This Charlotte case and the protests just show what a powder keg there is over police actions in the country right now.

I mean this is a guy who had a gun in his hand, refused to drop it, and was shot by a black police officer. Gotta say from that standpoint I don't see the reason for the outrage.

I've been thinking the same. Emotions are running high right now. Doesn't protesting a shooting where the suspect had a gun in his hand kind of undercut your narrative and cause?

I've also wondered if there are racial/police problems throughout the rest of the world. Is it only in the US where this dynamic plays out like this?

[BlueK]

I can't understand why people don't listen to and follow the commands of police officers. It's obvious that not doing so will only escalate the situation.

I saw a report where the police had program with young people and switched roles with them. The police (as kids) harassed, stuck phones in the face of the kids (as police), didn't follow orders, etc. It appeared to be eye-opening for the kids. It also allowed for a good interaction between the police and community. I think much, much more of this type of thing needs to happen. I would be happy to see more money put into these types of programs.

For the first six months of this year I served on my county's grand jury in Texas. I can tell you from that experience that plenty of people don't always obey an officer's order right away. Fortunately none of those ever got shot.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I've been thinking the same. Emotions are running high right now. Doesn't protesting a shooting where the suspect had a gun in his hand kind of undercut your narrative and cause?

I've also wondered if there are racial/police problems throughout the rest of the world. Is it only in the US where this dynamic plays out like this?

It is a weird phenomenon based primarily on anecdotes created by ubiquitous video and social media. Hopefully common sense will eventually win out and we can start addressing real problems.

[Bo Diddley]

It is a weird phenomenon based primarily on anecdotes created by ubiquitous video and social media. Hopefully common sense will eventually win out and we can start addressing real problems.

What are you referring to here? Anything related to police brutality?

[creekster]

Should they have tased him before becoming so worried about what he might be going for in his SUV? Yeah, I think so, but man those are some swift decisions that have to be made in an instant.

It strikes me as ironic that all of the violent protests probably make this sort of incident more rather than less likely. The cops out there are very much on edge. Protests? Fine, but the sort of heated rhetoric and violent actions that we are hearing and seeing only exacerbate the problem.

[byu71]

It appeared to be eye-opening for the kids. It also allowed for a good interaction between the police and community. I think much, much more of this type of thing needs to happen. I would be happy to see more money put into these types of programs.

I would be happy to get hit with a 10% surcharge on my tax return to help the inner cities. I wouldn't want the money to go to the beaurocrats and politicians to determine how it is spent. They have done a shitty job with the inner cities with the money they have.

I would want some honest civil rights leaders, not Sharpton or Jackson to be empowered with giving solutions and then spending the money on their suggested program.

If that is too simplistic, then give me a good way to do it not involving government solutions.

[Jeff Lebowski]

What are you referring to here? Anything related to police brutality?

Mandatory minimum sentencing. Racial bias in sentencing. Three strikes rules. The war on drugs.

I have yet to see hard data convincing me that police shoot black victims at a disproportionate rate. I think the things listed above are much bigger problems and impact a greater number of people.

[Topper]

I would be happy to get hit with a 10% surcharge on my tax return to help the inner cities. I wouldn't want the money to go to the beaurocrats and politicians to determine how it is spent. They have done a shitty job with the inner cities with the money they have.

I would want some honest civil rights leaders, not Sharpton or Jackson to be empowered with giving solutions and then spending the money on their suggested program.

If that is too simplistic, then give me a good way to do it not involving government solutions.

It is too simplistic.

There is a boatload of things which need fixing in the urban areas.

Problems include:

Economic mobility created in large part due to a lack of skills of the resident population;
Disproportionate drug dependency;
Disproportionate absences of paternal figures which come from drug dependency and incarceration.

To fix that you will need things which can't be delivered by government.

How do you stem the tide of fathers being absent due to drug dependency?
How do break the cycle of fathers leaving?
How do you increase skills development?

Some misguided souls want more government programs and assistance. We have had a deluge of these since the 1960s War on Poverty. The coordination and selection of these programs have been unsuccessful. Completely.

Perhaps we need to end the War on Drugs, and divert those funds to drug assistance in the inner cities, find meaningful rehabilitation to limit incarceration rates, and improve inner city schools. It won't be easy after decades of digging ourselves into these problems, but those seem to be the only method of reversing this disturbing trend.

[Bo Diddley]

Mandatory minimum sentencing. Racial bias in sentencing. Three strikes rules. The war on drugs.

Agreed.

I have yet to see hard data convincing me that police shoot black victims at a disproportionate rate. I think the things listed above are much bigger problems and impact a greater number of people.

I'm not convinced either in the overall picture. There are likely pockets of problems that need to be rooted out. However, I do see a general use of force problem with police. Behind each of the anecdotes where it is demonstrated that someone was killed unrighteously, there's a real person who lost their life. These data points pile up and highlight the problem. And perhaps this problem shouldn't top the list of issues we need to address in America, but I would hope that the police community puts it right near the top of their list to address.

[creekster]

I'm not convinced either in the overall picture. There are likely pockets of problems that need to be rooted out. However, I do see a general use of force problem with police. Behind each of the anecdotes where it is demonstrated that someone was killed unrighteously, there's a real person who lost their life. These data points pile up and highlight the problem. And perhaps this problem shouldn't top the list of issues we need to address in America, but I would hope that the police community puts it right near the top of their list to address.

That's also true for killings of police.

[byu71]

Mandatory minimum sentencing. Racial bias in sentencing. Three strikes rules. The war on drugs.

I have yet to see hard data convincing me that police shoot black victims at a disproportionate rate. I think the things listed above are much bigger problems and impact a greater number of people.

Racial bias in sentencing I can buy. I think that also has a lot to due with poverty. Poor people probably get tougher sentences than the rich just due to the type of counsel one can afford.

When my son was younger, immature and stupid he got a DUI. I left him on his own and he got a DUI on his record. I was told by an attorney I should have got him a good attorney and that would have been plead down and not a DUI. He is white by the way.

Do minorities (blacks and hispanics) commit more major crimes on a per capita basis or is that myth? If it is not myth, what is the root cause of that?

The war on drugs? Could you explain what you mean by that?

[Jeff Lebowski]

Racial bias in sentencing I can buy. I think that also has a lot to due with poverty. Poor people probably get tougher sentences than the rich just due to the type of counsel one can afford.

When my son was younger, immature and stupid he got a DUI. I left him on his own and he got a DUI on his record. I was told by an attorney I should have got him a good attorney and that would have been plead down and not a DUI. He is white by the way.

Do minorities (blacks and hispanics) commit more major crimes on a per capita basis or is that myth? If it is not myth, what is the root cause of that?

The war on drugs? Could you explain what you mean by that?

We had a long discussion about this just a few days ago. You forgot it already?