The Police Brutality Thread

[Flystripper]

I'll check it out later this week, thanks.

I am not always careful with my with words, but words matter. If people are clamoring to Defund the Police. That is what I hear. And they sound like people without a reasonable solution.

Like the protesters that wanted the mayor of Minneapolis commit to defunding. That would be completely irresponsible for a mayor to commit to that. It's dumb.

I just listened to the 25 minute video. Let me summarize for you. Defunding the police to the point of abolition is dangerous and stupid. Duh...

[BigPiney]

I just listened to the 25 minute video. Let me summarize for you. Defunding the police to the point of abolition is dangerous and stupid. Duh...

Thanks. You are a time saver.

[swampfrog]

I just listened to the 25 minute video. Let me summarize for you. Defunding the police to the point of abolition is dangerous and stupid. Duh...

Thanks. You are a time saver.

Did you find any of the reasoning leading to the conclusion helpful, or was just stating the conclusion enough? Just curious.

This piece from a legal process perspective was published in the Boston College Law Review. May 1999. Critical Race Theory has been constrained to the fringes for decades, but has now broken free into the mainstream. It's not just police they want abolished, the entire legal system needs to go. Also serves as an introduction to the thought behind CRT.

Critical race theorists attack the very foundations of the liberal legal order, including equality theory, legal reasoning, Enlightenment rationalism and neutral principles of constitutional law. These liberal values, they allege, have no enduring basis in principle, but are mere social constructs calculated to legitimate white supremacy. The rule of law, according to critical race theorists, is a false promise of principled government, and they have lost patience with false promises.

My disagreement with the race-crits has less to do with their long-term goals than with their diagnoses and solutions. Disadvantage in the United States continues to fall too heavily on racial minorities. Inequities in criminal justice, immigration law and welfare "reform" remain rampant, but are due to much more than simple bigotry.

All CRT writers believe, in varying degrees, that "racism is endemic to American life." While mainstream civil rights reformers assume that racism is a product of ignorance and can be overcome by education, critical race theorists insist that racism is pervasive and immutable, and "lies at the very heart of American—and western—culture." To critical race theorists, white racism is a "defect in the collective unconscious," a cultural phenomenon that automatically "reproduces hierarchy" even in the absence of conscious discrimination. In a racist society, everyone is either an "outsider" or an "insider," a "victim" or a "perpetrator." Much as Marx described human history as a permanent conflict between the bourgeoisie and the proletariat, the race-crits view American society as a zero-sum conflict between powerful white males and powerless minorities that cannot be mitigated by other affinities or commonalities.

[Flystripper]

Did you find any of the reasoning leading to the conclusion helpful, or was just stating the conclusion enough? Just curious.

This piece from a legal process perspective was published in the Boston College Law Review. May 1999. Critical Race Theory has been constrained to the fringes for decades, but has now broken free into the mainstream. It's not just police they want abolished, the entire legal system needs to go. Also serves as an introduction to the thought behind CRT.

He didn't address this in much detail during his 25 minute walk. He mostly acknowledged that while there could be a defect in the collective unconscious he muses who are you going to call when a Jewish school gets shot up...yeah duh

[BigPiney]

Did you find any of the reasoning leading to the conclusion helpful, or was just stating the conclusion enough? Just curious.

This piece from a legal process perspective was published in the Boston College Law Review. May 1999. Critical Race Theory has been constrained to the fringes for decades, but has now broken free into the mainstream. It's not just police they want abolished, the entire legal system needs to go. Also serves as an introduction to the thought behind CRT.

Thanks, those quotes are helpful.

Just when I start to feeling like I'm a bleeding heart liberal, I read something like that and it pushes me firmly back to the middle.

[swampfrog]

He didn't address this in much detail during his 25 minute walk. He mostly acknowledged that while there could be a defect in the collective unconscious he muses who are you going to call when a Jewish school gets shot up...yeah duh

His address wasn't against Critical Race Theory, but just on the nuance of the "Abolish The Police" narrative. But that narrative is a direct outgrowth or Critical Race Theory.

Thanks, those quotes are helpful.

Just when I start to feeling like I'm a bleeding heart liberal, I read something like that and it pushes me firmly back to the middle.

Understanding the theory is key to understanding what is happening in America today. It's seeping into everything--and is poised to aggressively push harder.

[Northwestcoug]

Good video showing the timeline and logistics of the Lafayette Park protest and police action against it:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/inves...p/?arc404=true

All that police/MP/secret service/prison guard coordination for a 3 minute photo op and resultant bad press. I hope the photo op was worth it, Trump.

[myboynoah]

Good video showing the timeline and logistics of the Lafayette Park protest and police action against it:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/inves...p/?arc404=true

All that police/MP/secret service/prison guard coordination for a 3 minute photo op and resultant bad press. I hope the photo op was worth it, Trump.

Just watched that. Very well done.

I originally thought that the protesters were down on Pennsylvania Ave. and that the police/natl guard/prison riot unit had pushed them back through Lafayette Square to create a buffer, which would have been reasonable. But the protestors were already back on the north side of Lafayette Square. Clearlly done for that photo op. because the protestors are now back to where they started.

Park Police are a bunch of liars about not using tear gas.

It's as if the Biden Campaign has a plant inside the White House helping with strategy.

[Commando]

Good video showing the timeline and logistics of the Lafayette Park protest and police action against it:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/inves...p/?arc404=true

All that police/MP/secret service/prison guard coordination for a 3 minute photo op and resultant bad press. I hope the photo op was worth it, Trump.

Dumbest f8king idiot in the history of the Oval Office. I almost feel bad for all the government officials whose job it is to prop up this imbecile and explain away his moronic, transparently stupid antics.

[Uncle Ted]

I am willing to listen to cutting funding and redistribution of funds to other social programs to help the community (ie counseling, drug rehab, education, training etc) but no cops at all is not going to work.

The Minneapolis PD is "cancer"... It needs to be removed!

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And sent to Florida where is it warm:

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[myboynoah]

Oh brother. "One of the most violent scenes ever caught on camera?" Dude needs to get out more.

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[Commando]

Oh brother. "One of the most violent scenes ever caught on camera?" Dude needs to get out more.

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lol. More like, "A somewhat violent scene, I guess, was captured on camera in Lafayette Square..."

[swampfrog]

Understanding the theory is key to understanding what is happening in America today. It's seeping into everything--and is poised to aggressively push harder.

More here. Heather Heying thread (who is also one of my favorite follows). Married to Bret Weinstein, brother of Eric Weinstein quoted earlier.

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Pasted entire thread for continuity of reading.

Totalitarianism always flies in on the wings of beautiful ideals.
It lands gently, flatters you and charms you, makes you feel smart for recognizing how beautiful it is.

Do not be fooled. It is dangerous. Those ideals? They are not what they seem. (1/23)
Democracy’s ability to reveal value depends on its members being able to freely decide what they think, and what they say. 2/

How do we assess truth, and how do we assess value?

The “naturalistic fallacy” reminds us that that which *is* true (e.g. in nature) is not inherently that which *ought* to be true. Truth and value are, therefore, distinct and unique. 3/

Many on the Illiberal-Left fall prey to the naturalistic fallacy without knowing it, and so try to stop the pursuit of truth, due to their fear that the truth is ugly.

Sometimes the truth is ugly. That does not make it untrue. 4/

Some also imagine that the reverse (also a fallacy) is true: What has value must itself be true.

I, at least, take it to be self-evident that people can find value in things that are not true (see: flat-earthers, lizard-people are among us, etc). 5/

So it is possible for people to derive value from things that are simply not true.

But a kind of reverse-engineered naturalistic fallacy lives in some people’s minds: Ah, if I value this—or if he or she values it—then it must be true! 6/

But no. That which is valued is not inherently true. We deceive ourselves so very effectively.

Sometimes what we “value” is just those conclusions that are politically- or socially- expedient. They may have little to do with what is in fact true. 7/

Self-deception is a powerful force in the social universe. 8/

When considering DiAngelo’s “White Fragility,” the bible du jour, let us then ask:
- Is what she says true? Seems not.
- Is what she says falsifiable (and thus assessable as true or not)? No.
- Does what she says have value? It does to some. To others it does not. 9/

Now let us return to this: How do we assess truth and value?

Truth: if a claim can’t be falsified, then we cannot know if it is true. We should therefore not accept that it simply is, even when heartfelt, emotional testimonials stream at us, night and day. 10/

Next: How do we assess value?

Democracy is one response to this: Let the majority decide. If all members of a civilization are freely able to decide what they believe, then the majority position should have weight, moving forward. 11/

Once again: Democracy’s ability to reveal value *depends* on its members being able to freely decide what they think, and what they say. The First Amendment protects these rights for good reason. 12/






The question then, is this: Have the people who find value in Critical Theory, “White Fragility,” intersectionality, and the debasing of one population at the feet of another, arrived there of their own free will? 13/

Police Officers wash the feet of Black faith leaders and beg for forgiveness in Cary, NC

I say *no*, many of the people who find value in Critical Theory, “White Fragility,” intersectionality, and the debasing of one population at the feet of the other, have in fact *not* arrived there of their own free will. 14/

We are seeing struggle sessions, loyalty oaths, bullying, more. History is repeating itself.

Totalitarianism always flies in on the wings of beautiful (sounding) ideals. 15/

Here is @BretWeinstein, warning us all, after our college succumbed to the New Religion, that this was not a niche concern, and that the troubles would not stay on campus: 16/

I think @BretWeinstein needs to add "prophet" to his twitter bio.

Here am I, marveling that defending the very idea of science, is becoming a shaky, risky position, in the face of the New Gods. 17/
https://medium.com/@heyingh/grievanc...d-63b6cfd9c913 …
Here is Bret again, testifying before Congress. 18/

https://youtu.be/uRIKJCKWla4
And here I am again, speaking at the Department of Justice. 19/

https://youtu.be/WozTbBN7aoU
We are not alone. There are many, many, *many* people, so many people, who have been seeing, pointing, yelling, screaming that there is a problem. I will not try to name them here. I would miss too many. 20/

We are not alone, and you are not alone. It is quite possible to recognize the many long-standing inequalities in society, & to recognize the racism that does in fact persist to this day, while simultaneously rejecting the New Religion that is upon us. 21/

https://www.the-american-interest.co...t-as-activism/ …
Do not genuflect before the New Gods. Do not admit to having original sin. Do not conflate “many people say so” with “it is true.” Be skeptical, be careful, and be good. 22/
Be good to your fellow humans. Be honest and honorable. Do not judge others by the color of their skin, or by any other immutable characteristic. Be kind, be grateful, be generous. And do not apologize for sins that you did not commit. /end

[BigPiney]

Thanks. That was interesting to read for clarification, though I am a simpleton and still think sociology and philosophy are boring AF.

Back to my fiction books and thinking both sides are crazy.

[Lost Student]

Thanks. That was interesting to read for clarification, though I am a simpleton and still think sociology and philosophy are boring AF.

Back to my fiction books and thinking both sides are crazy.

I agree.