My 9/11 concerns

[LiveCoug]

No, the problem is you are trying to tell me what my problem is rather than hearing what I'm saying my problem is. I came into this conversation without ANY passion or vigor and a very open mind, I can't take on everybody attacking me at once, calling me disingenuous and a liar, crazy, nutjob looking for black helicopters and expect to have any kind of rationality remain with me. It just isn't reasonable to expect that from me.

If you guys want to straighten me out, pm me. The forum won't be changing my mind today.

No, I'm trying to help you come to an understanding of why you got to your problem. I still have no real idea what you problem is. I don't think you are disingenuous, a liar, crazy or any of those things...

[taekwondave]

TKD, you have taken a beating here and I am guilty of part of that beating so I am sorry if I was too hard on you. That being said, going back and deleting all of your posts in the thread is just about the most chickenshit thing you can do in a case like this. I, for one, can't imagine ever making the effort to debate you in the future if you are likely to simply erase your entire part of the conversation once the going gets rough.

I for one, refuse to "debate" you in the future if that is what you call debating. I wasn't here to debate in the first place. I don't take well to people calling me names in a forum. The only thing I can do in return is call them names back. I think that's stupid. If you can't talk to me in a way that doesn't involve personal insults then we have nothing to talk about. I think you guys have great ideas and great points and you have no need to attack anyone personally and yet you do. What I do with my posts after a personal attack like that is not up to you and don't give two shits if you didn't like it.

[LiveCoug]

I for one, refuse to "debate" you in the future if that is what you call debating. I wasn't here to debate in the first place. I don't take well to people calling me names in a forum. The only thing I can do in return is call them names back. I think that's stupid. If you can't talk to me in a way that doesn't involve personal insults then we have nothing to talk about. I think you guys have great ideas and great points and you have no need to attack anyone personally and yet you do. What I do with my posts after a personal attack like that is not up to you and don't give two shits if you didn't like it.

Just ignore the people you feel are attacking you and just focus on the posts that are trying to understand you.

[taekwondave]

No, I'm trying to help you come to an understanding of why you got to your problem. I still have no real idea what you problem is. I don't think you are disingenuous, a liar, crazy or any of those things...

First off you can stop saying I have a problem. If you want to change my mind about a think take a page out of Benajamin Franklin's book. If you start off appearing to be someone who thinks I'm deranged or has a problem that you might be able to help me with, there's no way I'm going to believe you think of me as an equal, rather than some dolt child, and thus have a mind open to new information. Condescension never works very well in persuasion.

[taekwondave]

But even though the temptation is strong to keep it going, I'm done with this thread. Like I said, if you really care to enlighten me, there's always pm.

[Portland Ute]

No, I'm trying to help you come to an understanding of why you got to your problem. I still have no real idea what you problem is. I don't think you are disingenuous, a liar, crazy or any of those things...

I'll go ahead and say it: I don't think he's crazy...I DO think he's disingenuous.

I think he's trolling the board. I think he never had any intention of an open dialog or in learning anything. In fact, I'm not sure that he even believes what he is spouting. Like Live said, you can read all the posts and not even come to a semi-clear idea of what point he is trying to make. Seems that if he had a genuine conviction, there would be some clarity to the message. There is not.

This is a just a game to TKD.

[falafel]

First off you can stop saying I have a problem. If you want to change my mind about a think take a page out of Benajamin Franklin's book. If you start off appearing to be someone who thinks I'm deranged or has a problem that you might be able to help me with, there's no way I'm going to believe you think of me as an equal, rather than some dolt child, and thus have a mind open to new information. Condescension never works very well in persuasion.

Well, you said you didn't like your current world view. That sounds like a problem to me.

[LiveCoug]

First off you can stop saying I have a problem. If you want to change my mind about a think take a page out of Benajamin Franklin's book. If you start off appearing to be someone who thinks I'm deranged or has a problem that you might be able to help me with, there's no way I'm going to believe you think of me as an equal, rather than some dolt child, and thus have a mind open to new information. Condescension never works very well in persuasion.

Problem, mindset, whatever. No condescension intended. It's just that we have no idea what your mindset is, so trying to get you to understand something that we don't know that you don't understand is troublesome. Since I don't see any real specifics, I'm trying to understand underlying reasons behind believing conspiracy theories.

It's not a knock on you, as we ALL have some things about us that we don't quite understand.

[LiveCoug]

But even though the temptation is strong to keep it going, I'm done with this thread. Like I said, if you really care to enlighten me, there's always pm.

Enlighten you concerning WHAT specifically? That's our issue...

Just the whole "did planes really cause the towers to fall" issue? If it's that, the conspiracy theories have been debunked over and over and only a very small minority continue to hang on...

If it's about major banking institutions controlling the world and Obama is a puppet of the rothschilds, then I don't know what to say...

[creekster]

So were the planes hijacked? were they remote controlled? were people even on them?

Who got the explosives into the WTC?

Did the owners know?

Were all the experts that looked at the WTC in the ensuing insurance litigation in on the plot or just dumber than the group of experts running the website you are talking about?

[falafel]

I'll go ahead and say it: I don't think he's crazy...I DO think he's disingenuous.

I think he's trolling the board. I think he never had any intention of an open dialog or in learning anything. In fact, I'm not sure that he even believes what he is spouting. Like Live said, you can read all the posts and not even come to a semi-clear idea of what point he is trying to make. Seems that if he had a genuine conviction, there would be some clarity to the message. There is not.

This is a just a game to TKD.

Yeah, but trolls like to keep the thread going. That's part of the fun. Now TKD has shut this thread down, which runs contrary to the goal of a troll.

[YOhio]

So were the planes hijacked? were they remote controlled? were people even on them?

Who got the explosives into the WTC?

Did the owners know?

Were all the experts that looked at the WTC in the ensuing insurance litigation in on the plot or just dumber than the group of experts running the website you are talking about?

Was about the plane that crashed into the Pentagon? Was it really a missile? What about Flight 93? Was it shot down?

[taekwondave]

Whatever. I'm not trolling on this board. I have VERY strange beliefs, I admit that. Just look at my posts in the religion section. I came to this board because I found a lot of people in the religious section who were going through the same stuff I was, namely: they don't buy most of what is taught or done in the LDS church anymore, but don't feel any real reason to leave. But I have weird views in areas other than religion and I arrived at those views because I have been willing to keep my mind open to many possibilities. On the one hand it frustrates people because I can be persuaded into things that to them sounds crazy, on the other hand people have found that I am one of the few people they know that if I find I'm wrong I can admit it. I'm not stubborn in any of my views, if I was I wouldn't HAVE my views. So when I come on here and say, "I'm your humble pupil" I'm one of few people who probably mean it. I don't claim to know everything. I do claim to have an open mind, but I DON'T appreciate name calling or condescension and even though I can brush it off with and taking little shots at myself to fend off the wolves for a little while, I can't keep it up forever. Sometimes I need SOMEBODY to jump in and simply say "give the kid a break, he's trying."

[Portland Ute]

Yeah, but trolls like to keep the thread going. That's part of the fun. Now TKD has shut this thread down, which runs contrary to the goal of a troll.

We shall see... It's only been 9 minutes.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Was about the plane that crashed into the Pentagon? Was it really a missile? What about Flight 93? Was it shot down?

As for flight 93, it was shot down by the government because the passengers had somehow discovered the secret plot.

I am not kidding. That is one of the theories.