2024 Presidential Election Thread

[Maximus]

Which of those concepts do you think should be taught in schools?

do you think trachers shouldnt be able to have pride flags in a classroom? or students (pins or whatnot)?

do you think a book that shows a slave should be banned? Do you think a book that shows mistreatment of indians should be banned?

[old_gregg]

Which of those concepts do you think should be taught in schools?

wrong question, but teachers should give context to the things they teach about. #3 on that list is especially problematic: there are clear, specific and historical examples of oppression on the basis of race, national origin and sex. how do you teach historical events like the trail of tears, japanese internment, slavery, the tulsa race massacre, abuse of chinese and irish immigrants in the building of the transcontinental and other railroads, etc., without contextualizing in modern day treatment and oppression of those populations? why tie teachers' hands when those connections to present day conditions have pedagogical value? it's stupid and wrong.

[old_gregg]

Unconstitutional?

don't know, but it's dangerous and bad, ideologically driven political theater that is going to lead to a progressive analog that is going to be similarly stupid and bad for students.

[Pelado]

do you think trachers shouldnt be able to have pride flags in a classroom?

Teachers should be allowed to display pride flags in their classroom, if they want.

or students (pins or whatnot)?

Students should be able wear pins or whatnot supporting causes, if they want. I seem to remember my junior high and high schools having prohibitions on apparel with obscene language or advertising alcohol or drugs. I think the prohibition extended to things like Nazi symbols, but I don't remember that ever being tested.

do you think a book that shows a slave should be banned?

No.

Do you think a book that shows mistreatment of indians should be banned?

No. Kids should definitely have access to books detailing oppression of the people in India.

[Maximus]

Teachers should be allowed to display pride flags in their classroom, if they want.



Students should be able wear pins or whatnot supporting causes, if they want. I seem to remember my junior high and high schools having prohibitions on apparel with obscene language or advertising alcohol or drugs. I think the prohibition extended to things like Nazi symbols, but I don't remember that ever being tested.



No.



No. Kids should definitely have access to books detailing oppression of the people in India.

Thus you disagree with the law.

books wbook2 dads or moms too. Fun!

[Pelado]

wrong question, but teachers should give context to the things they teach about. #3 on that list is especially problematic: there are clear, specific and historical examples of oppression on the basis of race, national origin and sex. how do you teach historical events like the trail of tears, japanese internment, slavery, the tulsa race massacre, abuse of chinese and irish immigrants in the building of the transcontinental and other railroads, etc., without contextualizing in modern day treatment and oppression of those populations? why tie teachers' hands when those connections to present day conditions have pedagogical value? it's stupid and wrong.

I absolutely agree that teachers should provide context. There is plenty of context to provide - including recognizing that the disadvantaged plight of many minorities today is directly related to discrimination and racism in the past. I don't think the teachers ought to be assigning blame for that to their students, though.

[Pelado]

Thus you disagree with the law.

I have yet to see any quotes of the statutory language that would ban any of the things you described.

books wbook2 dads or moms too. Fun!

Uh, what?

[BlueK]

I absolutely agree that teachers should provide context. There is plenty of context to provide - including recognizing that the disadvantaged plight of many minorities today is directly related to discrimination and racism in the past. I don't think the teachers ought to be assigning blame for that to their students, though.

They aren't blaming their students for it. That's ridiculous.

[Pelado]

They aren't blaming their students for it. That's ridiculous.

They better not be - it's against the law!

[old_gregg]

I absolutely agree that teachers should provide context. There is plenty of context to provide - including recognizing that the disadvantaged plight of many minorities today is directly related to discrimination and racism in the past. I don't think the teachers ought to be assigning blame for that to their students, though.

the law criminalizes espousing that whether a person is oppressed can be determined by race, color, sex or national origin. a teacher could not, for example, discuss the trail of tears and state that native americans are oppressed as a result of their historical mistreatment.

and everybody is free to think whatever you want: a parent that doesn't like what is being taught in a classroom has the option to talk to their kids about stuff, to discuss it with a teacher, to remove their kid from class, to remove their kid from public school or to send their kid to a different (including private) school. the fix for this is not legislation that criminalizes necessary pedagogical practice.

[BlueK]

They better not be - it's against the law!

It will be funny when the Florda law eventually gets thrown out even by the current Supreme Court. MAGA heads will explode.

[Pelado]

the law criminalizes espousing that whether a person is oppressed can be determined by race, color, sex or national origin. a teacher could not, for example, discuss the trail of tears and state that native americans are oppressed as a result of their historical mistreatment.

and everybody is free to think whatever you want: a parent that doesn't like what is being taught in a classroom has the option to talk to their kids about stuff, to discuss it with a teacher, to remove their kid from class, to remove their kid from public school or to send their kid to a different (including private) school. the fix for this is not legislation that criminalizes necessary pedagogical practice.

I could see that.

[Maximus]

It will be funny when the Florda law eventually gets thrown out even by the current Supreme Court. MAGA heads will explode.

have you seen the court currently?

[BlueK]

have you seen the court currently?

Yes, but I still think this is too extreme even for this court. Thomas is crazy but the rest are traditional conservatives rather than MAGA, and traditional conservatives tend to be favorable toward freedom of speech usually.

[Northwestcoug]

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Good point. I'm sure most parents would agree some books are wholly inappropriate. So why did you push through legislation that was so overarching that people would ban books just to be safe?

Nice conspiratorial dig at the school unions also.