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  • Originally posted by bluegoose View Post
    Kinvara 3s are on sale today at amazon for $54.95 with free shipping for prime customers.
    Originally posted by Pheidippides View Post
    Hurry because this won't last. The Kinvara 4 comes out in a couple of weeks.
    I just picked up a pair. I can't beat that price and with Amazon Prime I can return if I am not happy with them.
    I'm your huckleberry.


    "I love pulling the bone. Really though, what guy doesn't?" - CJF

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    • Originally posted by FN Phat View Post
      I just picked up a pair. I can't beat that price and with Amazon Prime I can return if I am not happy with them.
      It's a great shoe but be sure to build up slowly with them. I've run two of my last three marathons in them with zero problems, but they don't have a lot of cushioning or frills. A step up from minimalism, that's all.
      Awesomeness now has a name. Let me introduce myself.

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      • Know yourself, too. I purchased my first pair around a couple of years ago and jumped right in. They're all I've used since, including a marathon and three halfs. I've never had any problems.

        The ones I ordered from Running Warehouse arrived earlier this week (free overnight shipping to California residents). I pulled out one of the new pairs this morning and went for six miles; the shoes felt good.
        "What are you prepared to do?" - Jimmy Malone

        "What choice?" - Abe Petrovsky

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        • Ran a 5k this morning and finished in 29:55. One of my goals this year was a sub-30 minute 5k. Next up, I suppose, would be sub-29.
          Don't worry about people stealing your ideas. If your ideas are any good, you'll have to ram them down people's throats.
          - Howard Aiken

          Any sufficiently complicated platform contains an ad hoc, informally-specified, bug-ridden, slow implementation of half of a functional programming language.
          - Variation on Greenspun's Tenth Rule

          Comment


          • Originally posted by lambdacoug View Post
            Ran a 5k this morning and finished in 29:55. One of my goals this year was a sub-30 minute 5k. Next up, I suppose, would be sub-29.
            Way to go. It feels good to hit a goal.
            "What are you prepared to do?" - Jimmy Malone

            "What choice?" - Abe Petrovsky

            Comment


            • Originally posted by lambdacoug View Post
              Ran a 5k this morning and finished in 29:55. One of my goals this year was a sub-30 minute 5k. Next up, I suppose, would be sub-29.
              Awesome job! That's some big improvement!
              At least the Big Ten went after a big-time addition in Nebraska; the Pac-10 wanted a game so badly, it added Utah
              -Berry Trammel, 12/3/10

              Comment


              • I did the Ragnar Zion Trail Relay last weekend. This was Ragnar's first official trail relay (they did a trial run at the same location last year) but similar ones seem to be popping up all over the place lately so I thought I'd post a report, in case anyone is considering one of these (it was my first).

                The race took place around the Ponderosa Ranch, at the UT89 end of Zion (as an aside, this would be a fantastic getaway--right next to the national park, tons of ATV/hiking/horse trails, zip line, climbing/rappelling, canyoneering, a really fun and nice pool, miniature golf, etc. You really couldn't run out of things to do). The race was centered at the ranch, with all the teams either camping right there or renting a nearby cabin (we did the latter, but camping would have been fun too). Each runner ran the same 3 legs, for a total of 15-16 miles, all beginning and ending at the same spot adjacent to the camp--the green loop (about 4 miles, consisted of a big drop and then climb back), the yellow loop (a little over 4 miles, started with a crazy 500 ft climb over about a mile, then descended for the rest), and the red loop (about 7.5 miles, lots of rollers). There were 8 runners, with runner 1 starting with the green loop, who then passed off to runner 2 with the yellow loop, and so on, until your team went through the three loop progression 8 times (each runner having run each loop).

                I was runner 5 and started with the yellow loop around 4:30. I had great weather, a little warm but not hot. Runner 2 had warned me about the climb, and another team had told me that their 6:00 mile runner had taken 46 minutes to do the 4.2 miles, so I figured I wasn't going to speed through this. I started off at what I thought was a decent pace, up until I hear the footsteps from behind, and a few minutes later, discover they belong to this tall guy in basketball shorts passing me. WTF? This guy does not look like a runner, but he's still increasing the gap. I finally give up on staying with him and lose sight of him. Then, about a half mile later, near the midpoint of the race and almost to the top (the first mile consisted of about a 100 foot climb, followed by a really frustrating downhill, where you lost all the elevation you gained, only to start your elevation gain again), I pass the basketball short guy, who is now really struggling, and summit a few minutes later to this amazing 360 degree view of Zion and the surrounding area. I had meant to carry my phone for pics, but just had to register it in my brain. Photo wouldn't have done it justice anyway. The next two miles are a fun, fast downhill with a few tricky spots that are going to break some ankles for the night runners. Thank goodness I'm in the day.

                Our team was not fast, and like every Ragnar I've ever raced, we underestimate the time things will take, only more severely, because trails are slower than roads even when they're flat, and these are far from flat. Or smooth. I end up leaving on my next loop (the green one) around 3 am. I had a really good headlamp that I lost on a Ragnar a few years ago and the one I have now is turning out to be woefully inadequate. I run this loop carrying my phone in flashlight mode for some extra lighting, but I'm still picking my way down, hoping not eat it hard. I'm doing better than some folks though, as I register a bunch of kills on this leg. Not much scenery as all of my concentration is focused on the three feet in front of me. I manage to avoid accident until the last 1/4 mile where my foot slams into a rock I didn't see and I have a humbling wipeout. Oh well, could have been much worse.

                A little interjection here--Salomon did this very smart marketing move where they set up a booth and let anyone demo their trail runners for free. although I had planned on running in my MT10's, I took them up on the offer and ran my first two legs in this:
                http://www.rei.com/product/847798/sa...a-001b2166becc

                This is a great shoe. 6 mm drop, lots of protection, but still respectably lightweight. The front protection probably saved me from a broken toe on that last wipeout.

                I interject because as I'm taking off my shoe after my second run, I see that the front of my sock is red, and my big toe is a bloody mess, with the nail almost completely off. It suddenly starts hurting more.

                So I'm getting ready for my last leg and I discover that I only brought one pair of running socks. No problem, I'll just go buy another pair at the Ragnar Tent. I make the hike over to the start and find out that no, they don't have any socks for sale. Neither does the Salomon booth. I had also forgotten to roll out my IT band, which to that point, I'd been pretty religious about. But my toe is bandaged up, it's a 1/2 mile walk back to the cabin and my runner should be back in the next 15 minutes, and I haven't had any tightness to this point, so I decide to go sockless.

                Big mistake. I start feeling two hotspots on my left foot (absent toenail is on my right) within about two miles. I try to put this out of my mind, but this is pretty tough until about mile 4 when my right ITB starts acting up. It's been doing well the last week, but I think the continued downhill braking, which is really tough to avoid on steep trails, finally got to it. So I limp my way through the last 3 miles alternating between right knee pain and left blisters. I'm close to crying as I ascend the nasty switchback series that every leg finishes with for the third time now. As I take off the shoe, the roofs of both blisters are rubbed off and now bleeding. I sheepishly return the bloody shoes to the Salomon people. I honestly would have bought them if they would have let me--they're great shoes, they're just not barefoot shoes.

                Anyway, I've rambled more than I meant to. This is a fun format, but a little more demanding than the road relays. I heard that a large number of teams dropped out, due to injury or other issues, as people weren't prepared for pretty demanding trails. Also, LIGHT. This should have been common sense, but a headlight on a rough night trail just doesn't cut it. One of the pro teams passed my wife on her leg and she said that they had a ridiculously bright headlight and then these attachable spotlights on each hand. The darkness really was the big speed limiting factor at night. And Ragnar, usually so good at selling things, closed down their booth (and their array of headlights they were selling) at night. I suspect they won't make that mistake again as they lost a lot of potential sells.

                On the other hand, not driving around in a van for 200 miles (and with that, not having to get into a cramped van after running) pretty much rocked. No hour long car exhaust filled waits at the major exchanges either. And a really fun atmosphere at the enormous tent city. You lose a little of the camaraderie of the van support, but on the whole, I like this format better.

                Ragnar is doing another one at Snowbasin that I think would be fun. There's also one in Ogden where your team just runs a 6 mile loop as many times as it can in 18 hours. It's much cheaper and they've been doing it a few years to get the wrinkles out. I'm hoping to try both of those soon.
                At least the Big Ten went after a big-time addition in Nebraska; the Pac-10 wanted a game so badly, it added Utah
                -Berry Trammel, 12/3/10

                Comment


                • Thanks for the report ER! I've heard a couple people talk about this the last couple days. It sounds great. What's probably most intriguing is the fact that there's a single exchange point making it possible to bring the kids and have them hang out around camp. I'll be talking a serious look at this next year.

                  On a side note, a high school friend of mine's family owns the Ponderosa Ranch. In high school we'd always go down for the weekend and tear that place up. When we all got back from our missions, we did a big reunion trip down there. They had just started to develop the property as a tourist destination. They had just finished building the main barn at that point. It blows my mind to hear about all the stuff they have there now.

                  On a side, side note. My buddy worked on the ranch his first summer home from the mission, met a girl from neighboring Orderville, and now has inlaws that live on a compound.
                  I told him he was a goddamn Nazi Stormtrooper.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Dwight Schr-ute View Post
                    Thanks for the report ER! I've heard a couple people talk about this the last couple days. It sounds great. What's probably most intriguing is the fact that there's a single exchange point making it possible to bring the kids and have them hang out around camp. I'll be talking a serious look at this next year.

                    On a side note, a high school friend of mine's family owns the Ponderosa Ranch. In high school we'd always go down for the weekend and tear that place up. When we all got back from our missions, we did a big reunion trip down there. They had just started to develop the property as a tourist destination. They had just finished building the main barn at that point. It blows my mind to hear about all the stuff they have there now.

                    On a side, side note. My buddy worked on the ranch his first summer home from the mission, met a girl from neighboring Orderville, and now has inlaws that live on a compound.
                    lol...funny.
                    it's quite a place. my brother in law and his wife worked there last summer. he guided canyoneering trips down englestead (really close by--the 7 mile loop his the trailhead) and she was in charge of the nightly entertainment. It's too bad we never visited them while they were working.
                    he's sticking with just three one wife for now.
                    At least the Big Ten went after a big-time addition in Nebraska; the Pac-10 wanted a game so badly, it added Utah
                    -Berry Trammel, 12/3/10

                    Comment


                    • Well, I threw down a 2nd best 5k time today on my lunch run (10:13 pace). It felt good after missing the long run on the weekend due to an all day rock concert (and all day to recover on Sunday). I decided to just go for it today since I've read often on here that to get faster you just have to run faster. I want to get faster. I'm sure Wednesday will be slower than today, but that'll change as I get used to the faster pace. One thing is for certain, I won't get better unless I push myself harder. I've about used up the default improvement one gets going from where I was to where I am.
                      Don't worry about people stealing your ideas. If your ideas are any good, you'll have to ram them down people's throats.
                      - Howard Aiken

                      Any sufficiently complicated platform contains an ad hoc, informally-specified, bug-ridden, slow implementation of half of a functional programming language.
                      - Variation on Greenspun's Tenth Rule

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by lambdacoug View Post
                        Well, I threw down a 2nd best 5k time today on my lunch run (10:13 pace). It felt good after missing the long run on the weekend due to an all day rock concert (and all day to recover on Sunday). I decided to just go for it today since I've read often on here that to get faster you just have to run faster. I want to get faster. I'm sure Wednesday will be slower than today, but that'll change as I get used to the faster pace. One thing is for certain, I won't get better unless I push myself harder. I've about used up the default improvement one gets going from where I was to where I am.
                        There is no doubt that to run faster you have to run faster - but don't overdo it. Just pick one workout a week that is your "speed" workout. On that day run at your race pace or intervals or just push yourself - whatever you want. But don't do it every day. Over time your relaxed pace will gradually increase, as will your speed workouts.

                        Comment


                        • I ran 5K this morning. Legs still feel good. Cardio sucks. It's nice to be able to finally do a decent run though after so much time off.
                          "Discipleship is not a spectator sport. We cannot expect to experience the blessing of faith by standing inactive on the sidelines any more than we can experience the benefits of health by sitting on a sofa watching sporting events on television and giving advice to the athletes. And yet for some, “spectator discipleship” is a preferred if not primary way of worshipping." -Pres. Uchtdorf

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                          • Fun to catch up on everyone's running accomplishments. And holy crap, Lambda, that is some serious weight loss and it's great to hear that you enjoy getting faster. Just be careful not to push it too hard.

                            Speaking of pushing too hard, I've been thinking about something lately as I've been several months now around 35-40 mpw, much of that easy or recovery pace (lately with a hill workout and tempo run added in). I know the common error is to run 'easy' runs too fast, but what do people think about the possibility that running easy runs too slowly might also be detrimental? Not just to economy but also maybe with implications for the stress-adaptation cycle the body needs to keep bones/tendons/muscles fine-tuned and resistant to injury. Is it possible to have your easy runs be too easy? I wonder this as I have battled several minor injury issues nearly since i started running and have developed quite the paranoia about running too fast or too hard.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by OhioBlue View Post
                              Fun to catch up on everyone's running accomplishments. And holy crap, Lambda, that is some serious weight loss and it's great to hear that you enjoy getting faster. Just be careful not to push it too hard.

                              Speaking of pushing too hard, I've been thinking about something lately as I've been several months now around 35-40 mpw, much of that easy or recovery pace (lately with a hill workout and tempo run added in). I know the common error is to run 'easy' runs too fast, but what do people think about the possibility that running easy runs too slowly might also be detrimental? Not just to economy but also maybe with implications for the stress-adaptation cycle the body needs to keep bones/tendons/muscles fine-tuned and resistant to injury. Is it possible to have your easy runs be too easy? I wonder this as I have battled several minor injury issues nearly since i started running and have developed quite the paranoia about running too fast or too hard.
                              I've been looking at some related topics lately, and I have a couple of early thoughts. First, I think the easy running is still supposed to be in the aerobic zone (say 80% to 95% of aerobic threshold). That implies a minimum pace. Also, as aerobic capacity increases, a runner's pace at this heart rate will also increase. Second, training periodization should also provide sufficient periods of stress/adaptation. After a base-building period, a speedwork period will provide lots of stress for the bones, tendons, etc. Just some thoughts.
                              "What are you prepared to do?" - Jimmy Malone

                              "What choice?" - Abe Petrovsky

                              Comment


                              • Thank you everyone for the comments on my weight loss. I still have 17-ish pounds to go before my BMI drops below 25 (I'm at 28-29 now), with that said, I feel like a million bucks. Not to take anything away from FN Phat or anyone else that has lost major weight running, it is inspirational to hear others' successes.

                                This site has actually been quite the font of knowledge and advice on running as well as a motivation. Your advice has really helped me deal with my ITB and knee issues. They are still there, lurking in the background, but they are manageable and fading. I've really been focusing on my form, specifically striking mid-foot and cadence and posture. I especially think the mid-foot thing is really helping me manage the increase mileage without tearing up my knees. I did an 8 mile run a few weeks ago and my knees recovered within a day or two rather than the 2 months it took to recover from my first 10k.
                                Don't worry about people stealing your ideas. If your ideas are any good, you'll have to ram them down people's throats.
                                - Howard Aiken

                                Any sufficiently complicated platform contains an ad hoc, informally-specified, bug-ridden, slow implementation of half of a functional programming language.
                                - Variation on Greenspun's Tenth Rule

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