Latest Stats and Facts on Punography

[Coach McGuirk]

I don't think that what's LA Ute is saying. He's saying that a guy's porn usage may create an affinity for anal sex or something like that. He sees it depicted and wants the wife to recreate the act. The wife obviously wants none of it and the guy isn't satisfied and the woman is wondering what the hell is wrong with her husband. It's certainly possible that a guy would want that even without the porn (sodomy laws have been on the books since long before porn) but it's certainly possible that repeatedly seeing the depiction would cause some kind of compulsion.

Ah, I am a dunce.

The majority of LDS are walking into their marriages with little sexual identity. But that is a given I guess. That could also be factoring in to the porn usage. LDS sexual discovery takes place within the marriage. It would figure some end up not compatible.

[Color Me Badd Fan]

This happens, sure. The converse also happens, making this type of conclusion one of those correlation-isn't-causation type of things. I'm sure this has been hashed and re-hashed already, but the LDS culture doesn't exactly prepare its members for healthy sexual relationships, at least not very well (I know I'm generalizing). The author of 'And They Were Not Ashamed' does a pretty decent job taking on the ideas of the 'Good Girl Syndrome' that many LDS women seem to adopt. There's just no way that the combo of a sexually cold spouse and his/her counterpart with a strong sex drive doesn't create problems of some sort. Or at least exacerbate those problems that may have already existed in some form. Pornography obviously fits here.

I'm not blaming women in the church for their husbands' porn problems. But this part of the complicated marital relationship is still taboo in LDS culture, ie the Good Girl Syndrome. From my experience, whether chicken or egg it quite often is at least a mediating variable in marriages where porn use is a problem. Again, there are plenty of times where the porn-seeking offender has no excuse...but we already seem to rail plenty on this, to the point where it's the assumed scenario too often.

Unrelated, it has also been interesting to hear LDS women disclose problems with porn and masturbation. You think it's taboo for men? At least men in the church recently have got the idea, many of them, that it's not an uncommon thing to struggle with. There's kind of an unspoken feeling of 'at least I'm not alone' even if that doesn't take much off of the intense shame and guilt. Women have no such sense of universality. And there are plenty out there who struggle in this area as well.

Seriously, if my wife came to me and told me she had a porn problem, I would probably start giving myself a few high fives and go run around the block a few times. I'd then want to have sex with her.

[Donuthole]

Seriously, if my wife came to me and told me she had a porn problem, I would probably start giving myself a few high fives and go run around the block a few times. I'd then want to have sex with her.

And when you couldn't last as long as the pornstars, or bring her to multiple orgasms during intercourse, she'd give up. Later, she'd sneak to the computer to finish the job you couldn't.

In short, I am very glad my wife doesn't have an addiction to porn (at least to my knowledge).

[LA Ute]

So she's saying that the average guy would, for example, rather watch repulsive sex on a DVD or computer than have more conventional kinds of sex with his wife? The implication seems to be that otherwise they have a healthy sex life but the guy wrecks it by getting repulsive ideas from porn and trying to get his wife to participate in similar activity, which turns her off of more conventional sex she was otherwise happy to do.

Okay, if you say so. That doesn't comport with my common sense and experience.

I am not a therapist and do not play one on TV. I think what she is telling me is that too much porn can have a desensitizing (no double entendre intended) effect on one partner, and since that occurs when the other partner is not in the same place, it can create serious problems. She did not get specific about anal or oral sex. That may well be the least of what she is talking about. I agree with OhioBlue (who alone among is is professionally qualified to say anything about all of this) that marital relationships are incredibly varied and complex, and it's terribly difficult to generalize.

[Color Me Badd Fan]

And when you couldn't last as long as the pornstars, or bring her to multiple orgasms during intercourse, she'd give up. Later, she'd sneak to the computer to finish the job you couldn't.

In short, I am very glad my wife doesn't have an addiction to porn (at least to my knowledge).

Let's just say there's some untapped male pornstar talent outside the confines of Van Nuys and Chatsworth. I'm a star, I'm a star, I'm a star, I'm a big, bright shining star.

[FN Phat]

I enjoy your humor CMBF.

[ERCougar]

Seriously, if my wife came to me and told me she had a porn problem, I would probably start giving myself a few high fives and go run around the block a few times. I'd then want to have sex with her.

I don't think you're the only one like this and that itself is an interesting commentary. Why the different reactions? Soup seems like one of the cooler (and maybe "liberated"?) women out there and she says she'd be insecure. What gives? Is it cultural? Biological?

[OhioBlue]

I don't think you're the only one like this and that itself is an interesting commentary. Why the different reactions? Soup seems like one of the cooler (and maybe "liberated"?) women out there and she says she'd be insecure. What gives? Is it cultural? Biological?

The women I've seen with porn/mast problems, it often has a quite different feel to it than the male struggle. Not entirely dissimilar, just different. More on the side where the behavior is used as an avoidance or coping mechnism, much less about quenching a sexual thirst.

With men, well we know how thirsty we all get.

However, it's also interesting how for many, whether or not it started out that way, a porn habit does start to play a coping role as well. I talk about this pretty frankly with clients, and we acknowledge that when one is looking to distract from stress, emotional burdens, frustration, or just generally wants to avoid things, pornography and stimulation are pretty dang effective distractors. Too effective. Of course, that effectiveness comes only in the short-term and often at a cost. So giving up that habit means having to find replacement coping skills, and acknowledging that while flawed, from a pragmatic viewpoint, porn is a very effective immediate coping/avoidance behavior.

back to the above question that was raised....simply stated, one of the ways men feel loved in a relationship is through physical means. Physical meaning sex, not cuddling. So of course men say they'd love to have a wife addicted to porn, although I think most would find it doesn't quite work out the way they think.

Women feel loved in other ways. It is incumbent upon both partners in a relationship to figure out how to help the other feel loved, and to balance the tendency to overfocus on getting one's own needs met.

[woot]

And when you couldn't last as long as the pornstars, or bring her to multiple orgasms during intercourse, she'd give up. Later, she'd sneak to the computer to finish the job you couldn't.

In short, I am very glad my wife doesn't have an addiction to porn (at least to my knowledge).

You might as well go ahead and announce that you are not secure in your sexuality. Seriously, though, I wonder if this isn't one of the real reasons why so many men and women have issues with porn. They're afraid that their partner might decide that the other one isn't any good in the sack.

[woot]

The women I've seen with porn/mast problems, it often has a quite different feel to it than the male struggle. Not entirely dissimilar, just different. More on the side where the behavior is used as an avoidance or coping mechnism, much less about quenching a sexual thirst.

With men, well we know how thirsty we all get.

However, it's also interesting how for many, whether or not it started out that way, a porn habit does start to play a coping role as well. I talk about this pretty frankly with clients, and we acknowledge that when one is looking to distract from stress, emotional burdens, frustration, or just generally wants to avoid things, pornography and stimulation are pretty dang effective distractors. Too effective. Of course, that effectiveness comes only in the short-term and often at a cost. So giving up that habit means having to find replacement coping skills, and acknowledging that while flawed, from a pragmatic viewpoint, porn is a very effective immediate coping/avoidance behavior.

back to the above question that was raised....simply stated, one of the ways men feel loved in a relationship is through physical means. Physical meaning sex, not cuddling. So of course men say they'd love to have a wife addicted to porn, although I think most would find it doesn't quite work out the way they think.

Women feel loved in other ways. It is incumbent upon both partners in a relationship to figure out how to help the other feel loved, and to balance the tendency to overfocus on getting one's own needs met.

Not being familiar with your background, I wonder how often you find situations in which the woman is incapable of orgasm from intercourse but is unwilling to seek other means of achieving orgasm with her partner due to societal/religious pressures or embarrassment. I recently saw where a very large percentage of women just never orgasm, and I wonder if it isn't because of an unwillingness to explore their options rather than a physiological incapability.

[Donuthole]

You might as well go ahead and announce that you are not secure in your sexuality. Seriously, though, I wonder if this isn't one of the real reasons why so many men and women have issues with porn. They're afraid that their partner might decide that the other one isn't any good in the sack.

I am not secure in my sexuality. Either that, or I was using an inverse example to portray how pornography can negatively affect a marriage.

[UtahDan]

I had a bishop at BYU who was a gynecologist who was very open to these kinds of discussions and actually did a Q&A session during a 5th sunday combined relief society and priesthood meeting. The questions were written down and submitted in a hat or basket to the bishop. Literally half the questions were on "is it okay to perform oral sex within a marriage?"

This is all kinds of wrong but my very first unguarded thought was "how could this woman be a Bishop?" I'm very tired.

[RobinFinderson]

I generally enjoy logging on at the end of a day to discover that people have been talking about me in my absence (the SU vs. RF poll resulted in my having to call a doctor to deal with a certain tumescent condition lasting longer than four hours). But this thread left me feeling like kind of dirty... like a desperate actor in some bad 70's porn.

[TripletDaddy]

I am not secure in my sexuality. Either that, or I was using an inverse example to portray how pornography can negatively affect a marriage.

This reminds me of a cougarboard quote

"One thing I have noticed of late is that there are a lot of flamboyant LDS men that, if I didnt know they members, I would automatically assume were gay. The size of BYU's male ballroom dance population is a prime example. Maybe its because as a people we are more cultured? or possibly because we are so comfortable with our sexuality that the extreme femininity doesn't register? I don't know, but its something that I have observed lately...thoughts?" CaliWG, Feb 14, 2008

[Babs]

I don't think you're the only one like this and that itself is an interesting commentary. Why the different reactions? Soup seems like one of the cooler (and maybe "liberated"?) women out there and she says she'd be insecure. What gives? Is it cultural? Biological?

Biologically speaking, men have no drive toward exclusivity. Their drive revolves around the sexual act. If the woman's interested, who cares how she got there, let's get it on.

Women, otoh, have a powerful need for security as a context for true sexual freedom and intimacy. She needs to believe she's the only object of her husband's affection, to believe she's the only one he desires. She needs to believe that all his needs are being met in her.

Flash's and my intimacy has a freedom and joy that's afforded by the fact that he's successfully convinced me that I'm the most beautiful creature in the world and the only one he wants to be with. If I found him looking at other women -- whether in porn or anywhere else -- that belief would be shattered. I would know that there's a need or desire remaining unmet. I would know that he hadn't been honest with me about it. I would doubt myself, and I would pull back to protect myself.

It's not the porn, exactly. It's what the decision to seek out porn represents. I don't know that what I describe above is representative of women in general, but I imagine that it's probably pretty close.