Wah-hoo-wah! BYU @ Virginia

[myboynoah]

Geez. Come on, people. It is Tuesday already. Let's start talking about Texas.

Or discuss nursing programs at Texas.

One thing for sure, Shaka could have had even more fun "cruising chicks" and playing in a band in Austin. Sixth Street, baby.

I am convinced. Bad call.

How about those Longhorns?

The voice of one crying in the wilderness.

[badutahboy]

You guys sure did a good job of twisting Shaka's words to make his arguments more and more ludicrous, and he played right into the trap.

Let's go back to his original point about how being in a conference benefits recruiting. You say BYU's recruiting hasn't slipped as a result of independence? Scout disagrees. According to them, here are BYU's football recruiting rankings since Bronco took over:

2014: 57
2013: 63
2012: 60
2011: 66
2010: 22
2009: 40
2008: 57
2007: 42
2006: 46
2005: 53

Something obviously happened in 2011 that caused a 20 position drop on average in scout's rankings. The primary thing I can think happened was the independence announcement (following 6 months worth of rumors and uncertainty about the fate of pretty much everyone in college football).

Just to give you some math: BYU's average ranking pre-2011 was 43.33. If you include 2011 in the pre-independence era, it was 46.57. Their ranking since 2011 is 61.5, and again, if you assign 2011 to the pre-independence era, it's 60. That means that no matter how you slice it, BYU's average ranking has dropped about 14 spots since declaring independence.

As for a recruit stating he chose to go elsewhere because of a shot to play for a conference championship? I'm sure those quotes could be found, but of course, as soon as someone does the research to show it, you'll say "well duh, all recruits pander to the strengths of the program they choose. It doesn't mean much."

[cougjunkie]

You guys sure did a good job of twisting Shaka's words to make his arguments more and more ludicrous, and he played right into the trap.

Let's go back to his original point about how being in a conference benefits recruiting. You say BYU's recruiting hasn't slipped as a result of independence? Scout disagrees. According to them, here are BYU's football recruiting rankings since Bronco took over:

2014: 57
2013: 63
2012: 60
2011: 66
2010: 22
2009: 40
2008: 57
2007: 42
2006: 46
2005: 53

Something obviously happened in 2011 that caused a 20 position drop on average in scout's rankings. The primary thing I can think happened was the independence announcement (following 6 months worth of rumors and uncertainty about the fate of pretty much everyone in college football).

Just to give you some math: BYU's average ranking pre-2011 was 43.33. If you include 2011 in the pre-independence era, it was 46.57. Their ranking since 2011 is 61.5, and again, if you assign 2011 to the pre-independence era, it's 60. That means that no matter how you slice it, BYU's average ranking has dropped about 14 spots since declaring independence.

As for a recruit stating he chose to go elsewhere because of a shot to play for a conference championship? I'm sure those quotes could be found, but of course, as soon as someone does the research to show it, you'll say "well duh, all recruits pander to the strengths of the program they choose. It doesn't mean much."

You must be friends with Shaka. I can poke more holes in this post than his defense of Riley.

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[cougjunkie]

Crazy that BYUs average star ranking in 2014 is thr 2nd highest of the Bronco Mendenhall era. Makes no sense.

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[badutahboy]

As for players who've chosen Boise over BYU, in the last two years, there have been 5 who ranked 3 stars or better according to scout. Shay Fields, Hawkins Mann, Alec Dhaenens, Tanner Shipley, and Tutulepeata Mataele.

[badutahboy]

You must be friends with Shaka. I can poke more holes in this post than his defense of Riley.

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I don't know Shaka.. I do, however think I know UVAcoug from ESPN and other sites...

Feel free to poke away. Validate why your average ranking dropped so far, so fast.

[Flystripper]

I don't know Shaka.. I do, however think I know UVAcoug from ESPN and other sites...

Feel free to poke away. Validate why your average ranking dropped so far, so fast.

correlation does not = causation. As one who thinks independence will hurt in the long run (at least indirectly), even I know there are too many factors at play with recruiting and not enough time has elapsed to pin it on Independence....yet.

[old_gregg]

lol at scout recruiting class rankings

[cougjunkie]

You do realize Nick Kurtz just picked BYU over Oregon, Texas Tech and Cal?

Byu is 3-0 head to head against Utah so fsr in recruiting battles landing Fuga, Fonua and Fred Werner.

Speaking of Werner he chose Byu over USC.

Tyler Cook had 18 offers including Miami, Arizona and Boise yet still chose BYU.

Last year Jamaal Williams chose BYU over Boise.

Sione Takitaki committed to BYU over Arizona, Wisconsin and Boise.


Your argument is weak because the 2014 class will be one of Broncos best ever.

We are also still in the hunt for Damien Mama the number 1 lineman in the country.

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[badutahboy]

correlation does not = causation. As one who thinks independence will hurt in the long run (at least indirectly), even I know there are too many factors at play with recruiting and not enough time has elapsed to pin it on Independence....yet.

No, correlation does not indicate causation. however, correlation certainly beats speculation, and that's all you've got to back your claim that recruiting won't suffer in inependence.

[jay santos]

You guys sure did a good job of twisting Shaka's words to make his arguments more and more ludicrous, and he played right into the trap.

Let's go back to his original point about how being in a conference benefits recruiting. You say BYU's recruiting hasn't slipped as a result of independence? Scout disagrees. According to them, here are BYU's football recruiting rankings since Bronco took over:

2014: 57
2013: 63
2012: 60
2011: 66
2010: 22
2009: 40
2008: 57
2007: 42
2006: 46
2005: 53

Something obviously happened in 2011 that caused a 20 position drop on average in scout's rankings. The primary thing I can think happened was the independence announcement (following 6 months worth of rumors and uncertainty about the fate of pretty much everyone in college football).

Just to give you some math: BYU's average ranking pre-2011 was 43.33. If you include 2011 in the pre-independence era, it was 46.57. Their ranking since 2011 is 61.5, and again, if you assign 2011 to the pre-independence era, it's 60. That means that no matter how you slice it, BYU's average ranking has dropped about 14 spots since declaring independence.

As for a recruit stating he chose to go elsewhere because of a shot to play for a conference championship? I'm sure those quotes could be found, but of course, as soon as someone does the research to show it, you'll say "well duh, all recruits pander to the strengths of the program they choose. It doesn't mean much."

A statistician would tell you there's not enough data to tell if there's really much of a trend, especially if you toss the 2010 data point which is a clear outlier. But data's always dirty and I'll give you that it appears there seems to be a trend.

Let's throw out possible theories:
--BYU moving to independence
--BYU's poor seasons lately
--Utah moving to Pac 12
--other (I'm sure we could think of several more)

Intuitively, I just don't feel like BYU's move to independence has anything at all to do with it. The kind of recruits that are going to get you ranked in the top 20 or top 30 don't give a shiz about winning a MWC championship.

Even if you can show a trend, you are not showing causality. And you don't even have any anecdotal evidence. And most people would say if anything, independence would be slightly more attractive to potential recruits than the MWC. It just doesn't make any sense.

[badutahboy]

lol at scout recruiting class rankings

BYU fans have touted scouts rankings for over a decade, and I'm sure you will again in the future. If you'd prefer, I'll go get Rivals, ESPN or any other source you'd like me to use. I'm confident they'll all be similar. I actually chose scout specifically because they're the most pro-BYU of the recruiting services.

[badutahboy]

You do realize Nick Kurtz just picked BYU over Oregon, Texas Tech and Cal?

Byu is 3-0 head to head against Utah so fsr in recruiting battles landing Fuga, Fonua and Fred Werner.

Speaking of Werner he chose Byu over USC.

Tyler Cook had 18 offers including Miami, Arizona and Boise yet still chose BYU.

Last year Jamaal Williams chose BYU over Boise.

Sione Takitaki committed to BYU over Arizona, Wisconsin and Boise.


Your argument is weak because the 2014 class will be one of Broncos best ever.

We are also still in the hunt for Damien Mama the number 1 lineman in the country.

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Congrats on winning some recruiting battles. BYU is losing more than they're winning. I just listed 5 from the past 2 seasons that you lost to a single team who isn't even in a big 5 conference.

[old_gregg]

BYU fans have touted scouts rankings for over a decade, and I'm sure you will again in the future. If you'd prefer, I'll go get Rivals, ESPN or any other source you'd like me to use. I'm confident they'll all be similar. I actually chose scout specifically because they're the most pro-BYU of the recruiting services.

how about you investigate the correlation between wins and recruiting class rankings (from an outlet of your choosing)?

[cougjunkie]

Congrats on winning some recruiting battles. BYU is losing more than they're winning. I just listed 5 from the past 2 seasons that you lost to a single team who isn't even in a big 5 conference.

I follow recruiting as close as anyone. The only player on your list BYU lost was Tanner Shipley. The other 4 were never offered or in play for various reasons. Nice try though. That same year we picked up a non lds kid in Jamal Williams whose final two were BYU and Boise.

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