The Pac-12 participation thread.

[All-American]

Philosophers have suggested that the fundamental appeal of sports is the notion of the uncertain, the possible, the "what-if?" part of life.
We don't get this very much in modern society - at least, not as much as pre-modern peoples. We don't have to worry about things like, "What if the harvest fails and we all starve to death?" or "What if we lose the upcoming battle and everyone in town is killed or enslaved?" We don't really have this kind of uncertainty in our world anymore, so we crave crisis and uncertainty. (don't get me wrong, we all worry about the future, but usually in much vaguer terms, and with much less statistical probability of happening - i.e., "what if I get hit by a truck while cycling with creekster?)

Sports, unlike most of real life, hinge on the possible, on the whimsical "what if?" that every season & every game starts with.
Real life is about routine and the expected.
Sports is a celebration of improvisation and possibilities and improbabilities.

To that end, the way the byu has constructed its independent schedule eliminates much of the unknown. It's almost like the Correlation Folks have gotten to the sports program, robbing it of its essence in an effort to streamline, promote efficiency, allow for projected results. Scheduling near-certain wins & bowl games in advance is good for the bottom line, perhaps, but contradicts the fundamental essence of why people are interested in the first place. It's a poor long-term strategy to manufacture wins & bowls. It's much better to embrace the uncertainties of "possible".

So, I think a lot of people - not everyone, but a lot of people - would rather have the fundamental "what if?" of a Pac-12 season, even if they're rooting for a bottom-of-the-heap team. The "what-if?" when the Utes strap it up against this year's Oregon or Stanford or USC is an uncertainty to savor. Win or lose, it's Uncertainty & Possibility that keep people coming back to sports. That's why I prefer a Pac-12 schedule. Even if the team is the shits, at least there's a "what if?" when the teams kick off.

This is not smack - fans have to play the cards they're dealt. But there is value in having a tough opponent almost every week.

I disagree with the idea that BYU's schedule yields a predictable outcome (you mean to tell me you wouldn't want to trade places with a team for whom beating Texas is a given?), but fine. There is value in having a tough opponent almost every week. That doesn't answer my question.

[All-American]

I'd rather have the record, but not the independent status.

I would also rather be rich than stupid.

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

I would also rather be rich than stupid.

Rich and stupid can be fun, just sayin'.

[wapiti]

Philosophers have suggested that the fundamental appeal of sports is the notion of the uncertain, the possible, the "what-if?" part of life.
We don't get this very much in modern society - at least, not as much as pre-modern peoples. We don't have to worry about things like, "What if the harvest fails and we all starve to death?" or "What if we lose the upcoming battle and everyone in town is killed or enslaved?" We don't really have this kind of uncertainty in our world anymore, so we crave crisis and uncertainty. (don't get me wrong, we all worry about the future, but usually in much vaguer terms, and with much less statistical probability of happening - i.e., "what if I get hit by a truck while cycling with creekster?)

Sports, unlike most of real life, hinge on the possible, on the whimsical "what if?" that every season & every game starts with.
Real life is about routine and the expected.
Sports is a celebration of improvisation and possibilities and improbabilities.

To that end, the way the byu has constructed its independent schedule eliminates much of the unknown. It's almost like the Correlation Folks have gotten to the sports program, robbing it of its essence in an effort to streamline, promote efficiency, allow for projected results. Scheduling near-certain wins & bowl games in advance is good for the bottom line, perhaps, but contradicts the fundamental essence of why people are interested in the first place. It's a poor long-term strategy to manufacture wins & bowls. It's much better to embrace the uncertainties of "possible".

So, I think a lot of people - not everyone, but a lot of people - would rather have the fundamental "what if?" of a Pac-12 season, even if they're rooting for a bottom-of-the-heap team. The "what-if?" when the Utes strap it up against this year's Oregon or Stanford or USC is an uncertainty to savor. Win or lose, it's Uncertainty & Possibility that keep people coming back to sports. That's why I prefer a Pac-12 schedule. Even if the team is the shits, at least there's a "what if?" when the teams kick off.

This is not smack - fans have to play the cards they're dealt. But there is value in having a tough opponent almost every week.

You were really asking "what if" before the Stanford game? Or the Oregon game?

The Stanford win caused me to ask "what if" for one week. Arizona proved that we didn't need to ask that question about the Utes until November 23rd.

[il Padrino Ute]

I would also rather be rich than stupid.

If you don't like the answer, don't ask the question.

[YOhio]

All the best to Travis Wilson. Feel terrible for him, but glad they discovered whatever the problem is before something more serious occurred.

[TripletDaddy]

All the best to Travis Wilson. Feel terrible for him, but glad they discovered whatever the problem is before something more serious occurred.

yikes. even the mere act of quoting LA ute comes off as phony.

go away.

[All-American]

If you don't like the answer, don't ask the question.

No, I'd love an answer to the question. Would you trade BYU's year for Utah's?

[LA Ute]

No, I'd love an answer to the question. Would you trade BYU's year for Utah's?

Of course I would, but not if it meant we would not be in the PAC-12.

[il Padrino Ute]

No, I'd love an answer to the question. Would you trade BYU's year for Utah's?

I said I'd like Utah to have BYU's won-loss record, but not at the cost of being in the PAC12. How is that not an answer?

[wally]

No, I'd love an answer to the question. Would you trade BYU's year for Utah's?

I am going to shock you by answering honestly no, I would not trade Utah's year for BYU's year. I am fine with each program having the year they have had.

Comparing BYU and Utah is comparing apples and oranges. Americans eat more apples than oranges but consume more orange juice than apple juice. I have no idea which is more profitable, and personally like apples more than I like oranges. If apples and oranges were both raised in the same orchard I'll bet that the Oranges would look down on apples becuase of religious and cultural differences and also because they are a more tropical fruit than the blue collar apples. Apples would be jealous of the apparent glamourous lifestyle of their rival oranges and start a crusade to beat them in head to head competition. Soon, the apples achieve this goal, but find that life as an A-list fruit competing with all sorts of other fruit like grapes and those damn primadonna watermelons is not what it is cracked up to be. The oranges relegated to popularity on the refrigerated juice (or worse, the frozen concentrate section) decide to embrace juice market superiority as the be-all end-all of fruit status. The apples and oranges would continue their trash talking back at the orchard about which is best, but they would look silly doing so because really who gives a shit about whether apples or oranges are best, when in reality they are completely different.

This is why the rivalry will never diminish no matter how long a break it takes.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I am going to shock you by answering honestly no, I would not trade Utah's year for BYU's year. I am fine with each program having the year they have had.

Comparing BYU and Utah is comparing apples and oranges. Americans eat more apples than oranges but consume more orange juice than apple juice. I have no idea which is more profitable, and personally like apples more than I like oranges. If apples and oranges were both raised in the same orchard I'll bet that the Oranges would look down on apples becuase of religious and cultural differences and also because they are a more tropical fruit than the blue collar apples. Apples would be jealous of the apparent glamourous lifestyle of their rival oranges and start a crusade to beat them in head to head competition. Soon, the apples achieve this goal, but find that life as an A-list fruit competing with all sorts of other fruit like grapes and those damn primadonna watermelons is not what it is cracked up to be. The oranges relegated to popularity on the refrigerated juice (or worse, the frozen concentrate section) decide to embrace juice market superiority as the be-all end-all of fruit status. The apples and oranges would continue their trash talking back at the orchard about which is best, but they would look silly doing so because really who gives a shit about whether apples or oranges are best, when in reality they are completely different.

This is why the rivalry will never diminish no matter how long a break it takes.

Oranges. Duh.

[Applejack]

Of course I would, but not if it meant we would not be in the PAC-12.

Really? I guess I don't get this attitude. I suppose that I enjoy beating a top 10 team and BYU more than most.

Has BYU's season been great? I guess I haven't been following closely enough.

[originalsocal]

I am going to shock you by answering honestly no, I would not trade Utah's year for BYU's year. I am fine with each program having the year they have had.

Comparing BYU and Utah is comparing apples and oranges. Americans eat more apples than oranges but consume more orange juice than apple juice. I have no idea which is more profitable, and personally like apples more than I like oranges. If apples and oranges were both raised in the same orchard I'll bet that the Oranges would look down on apples becuase of religious and cultural differences and also because they are a more tropical fruit than the blue collar apples. Apples would be jealous of the apparent glamourous lifestyle of their rival oranges and start a crusade to beat them in head to head competition. Soon, the apples achieve this goal, but find that life as an A-list fruit competing with all sorts of other fruit like grapes and those damn primadonna watermelons is not what it is cracked up to be. The oranges relegated to popularity on the refrigerated juice (or worse, the frozen concentrate section) decide to embrace juice market superiority as the be-all end-all of fruit status. The apples and oranges would continue their trash talking back at the orchard about which is best, but they would look silly doing so because really who gives a shit about whether apples or oranges are best, when in reality they are completely different.

This is why the rivalry will never diminish no matter how long a break it takes.

[All-American]

I said I'd like Utah to have BYU's won-loss record, but not at the cost of being in the PAC12. How is that not an answer?

Because I didn't ask whether you'd like to be 7-3 or 4-6. I asked whether you would trade BYU's season for Utah's season.