Alright, let's hear your Heaps assessments

[Surfah]

It seems to me that the same set of data is going to produce similar results regardless of the level that it's taken to. I guess I just don't find this interesting or surprising anymore.

Agreed.

[Katy Lied]

That data was way too cherry picked.

[jay santos]

That data was way too cherry picked.

Not sure if this is a joke or not. The analysis was pretty thorough.

[jay santos]

I think this is a good analysis, and it's the right way to analyze the two QB's. It's similar to what I did here.

http://cougaruteforum.com/showthread.php?t=52823

The possible counters to this are:

1. PER's a flawed stat that should be ignored.

I find this completely irrational. I think if you wanted to throw out any other important stat, the results would be the same. Except of course the subjective metric "which QB looks more like I think a QB should look".

2. Yeah Nelson performed a little better, but the competition the second half of the year was so bad that anyone could have won the games, so might as well let Heaps play.

a) I think we could have lost 2-3 more games easily with Heaps. b) I think we could easily lose 2-3 more games with Heaps in 2012. c) It's not a guarantee Heaps will be a great QB in 2013 d) Nelson is not spectacular but he's good and he has some upside left

The importance of winning today can not be overstated. It affects recruiting, fan participation, donations, conference affiliation talks, everything. I will never gamble one win this year for two wins two years from now.

3. It's the coaches' fault or there are extenuating circumstances that explain Heaps poor play, and we should have been patient with him.

Maybe. Nelson had the same coaches and less practice and game time and stepped up and did marvelously. This is D1 football and if you are not performing, you only get so long to correct the situation.

[Indy Coug]

Heaps had a pass efficiency of 153.2 in 57 pass attemps in his last 3 appearances, which is on par with Nelson's season efficiency.

Enjoy.

[MarkGrace]

Heaps had a pass efficiency of 153.2 in 57 pass attemps in his last 3 appearances, which is on par with Nelson's season efficiency.

Enjoy.

The "Heaps was broken and would have struggled to win games against even our lesser competition if we brought him back" argument held water right up to the point where Heaps actually played again, and proved that he would have been doing the same thing against those teams. The team put up back-to-back 40 point games when he was reinserted (yeah, Riley scored one of the TD's against Idaho, but Heaps was pulled early in that game and clearly would have gone for 40 himself), including what is still our only +40 offensive output game against a D1 opponent this year. Heck, even Jay started a thread to say that we should still consider the QB competition open after the Idaho game because neither had really proved any more than the other, and that was before NMSU, which was his best game.

I'm not really seeing the value in the argument anymore, as nothing new or enlightening has been said or discussed in probably a month or more. But we all just keep getting sucked into it and keep wanting to tell everyone what we think, even if it doesn't get us anywhere. I think that because people always tell me I look like Ed Norton there's a good chance Salma Hayek would want to have sex with me if she ever met me. Hasn't really worked out for me so far, however.

[Shaka]

I think that because people always tell me I look like Ed Norton there's a good chance Salma Hayek would want to have sex with me if she ever met me. Hasn't really worked out for me so far, however.

Clearly you are a handsome man. I think you need to make sure you and Salma have a, "chance" encounter.

[Hsaru]

The "Heaps was broken and would have struggled to win games against even our lesser competition if we brought him back" argument held water right up to the point where Heaps actually played again, and proved that he would have been doing the same thing against those teams. The team put up back-to-back 40 point games when he was reinserted (yeah, Riley scored one of the TD's against Idaho, but Heaps was pulled early in that game and clearly would have gone for 40 himself), including what is still our only +40 offensive output game against a D1 opponent this year. Heck, even Jay started a thread to say that we should still consider the QB competition open after the Idaho game because neither had really proved any more than the other, and that was before NMSU, which was his best game.

I'm not really seeing the value in the argument anymore, as nothing new or enlightening has been said or discussed in probably a month or more. But we all just keep getting sucked into it and keep wanting to tell everyone what we think, even if it doesn't get us anywhere. I think that because people always tell me I look like Ed Norton there's a good chance Salma Hayek would want to have sex with me if she ever met me. Hasn't really worked out for me so far, however.

The arguments will go nowhere even where there is new data in 2013, the "haters" have already said they won't change their mind one bit if Heaps is good elsewhere, they are arguing an argument they can't lose in their minds no matter what happens.

You won't hear Shaka saying that maybe we shouldn't have played his boy Riley if Jake somehow turns into a 1st or 2nd round draft pick, he will just be happy his boy got his moment in the sun, damn the consequences. And Jay/Viking/etc admitting they're wrong about anything? fat chance.

[myboynoah]

You won't hear Shaka saying that maybe we shouldn't have played his boy Riley if Jake somehow turns into a 1st or 2nd round draft pick, he will just be happy his boy got his moment in the sun, damn the consequences. And Jay/Viking/etc admitting they're wrong about anything? fat chance.

Let's review: Heaps left the program, he was not asked to leave. Indeed, he was asked to stay. Heaps was given opportunities to start, and he did. After being replaced, he was asked to stay and would have had the inside track to start his last two years. Heaps opted to leave the program.

Heaps was benched when it became apparent another QB would give the team a better chance to win games. Of course Riley should have played. When Heaps was benched he was playing far from 1st or 2nd round level. BYU was happy to have him stay and reach that level. Again, it was Heaps who decided to leave.

[Jarid in Cedar]

Let's review: Heaps left the program, he was not asked to leave. Indeed, he was asked to stay. Heaps was given opportunities to start, and he did. After being replaced, he was asked to stay and would have had the inside track to start his last two years. Heaps opted to leave the program.

Heaps was benched when it became apparent another QB would give the team a better chance to win games. Of course Riley should have played. When Heaps was benched he was playing far from 1st or 2nd round level. BYU was happy to have him stay and reach that level. Again, it was Heaps who decided to leave.

Hater...

[myboynoah]

Hater...

My religion is unkindness.

[Hsaru]

Let's review: Heaps left the program, he was not asked to leave. Indeed, he was asked to stay. Heaps was given opportunities to start, and he did. After being replaced, he was asked to stay and would have had the inside track to start his last two years. Heaps opted to leave the program.

Heaps was benched when it became apparent another QB would give the team a better chance to win games. Of course Riley should have played. When Heaps was benched he was playing far from 1st or 2nd round level. BYU was happy to have him stay and reach that level. Again, it was Heaps who decided to leave.

So basically, the guy sucks, but if he is good elsewhere it means nothing as he would have done it here also if he just went through the magical post sophomore redshirt year that turns sucky qbs into stars(even though he was regressing), and if he sucks elsewhere we were right all along! Gotcha.

[creekster]

Somebody else already said something like this, but who cares? I wish Heaps had stayed; I really do. But he didn't. I will be curious to see how he does, and I hope he does well in the way you might wish any young man do well, but otherwise I don't really care.

[Jarid in Cedar]

My religion is unkindness.

Your cougar avatar has a look of ill repute

[myboynoah]

Your cougar avatar has a look of ill repute

He needs an eye-patch; do you have a spare?