The Independent Expansion Groundswell

[SloanHater]

You're not familiar with BYU are you? Holmoe's job is to give an Education Week class while the big boys are making deals. He gets an email every now and then to keep him informed.

On the bright side, his Cal record is looking better.

[LA Ute]

wow, utah state getting absolutely screwed. i wonder if they have any civil claim in addition to the wac's pending litigation as a result.

It would take some analysis, but I guess this situation has some dandy lawsuits in it if anyone wants to pursue them. Then again, this whole mess just looks like a bunch of schools trying to protect their own interests, with varying degrees of shark-like behavior:

1. BYU decides to leave the MWC bleeding in the dust behind it by (a) bolting to independence and partial WAC membership and (b) asking for the $5million departure penalty to make sure the WAC is locked up for 5 years so BYU will have a good arrangement there. Pure self-interest at work, and really only BYU's interest.

2. The MWC decides not to be the victim and invites USU, FSU and Nevada (In that order, I guess; USU's Barnes says USU was the first invited, I've got to think Fresno was next). Again, pure self-interest, but at least it was on behalf of an entire league.

3. USU honors the deal it made to stay in the WAC. (Barnes seems to describe this as a matter of honor, but the $5 million probably figured into the Aggies' thinking, plus a desire not to shaft its neighbor BYU.) This is self-interest too, but seems to be leavened with some honor and with concern for the rest of the WAC and USU's promises to that league.

4. FSU and Nevada decide to make the leap to the MWC (not sure if they thought they'd have to pay the $5 million), probably knowing they were wrecking the BYU-WAC deal. Naked self-interest, and not much honor or concern for anyone else to be seen anywhere.

So as everyone looks at this story, who are the bad guys?

• Worst, most selfish bad guys: FSU and Nevada.

• Second-worst, pretty selfish bad guy: BYU (without them the whole thing would not have happened)

• Victim of its own decency and/or lack of killer instinct: USU.

[SloanHater]

It would take some analysis, but I guess this situation has some dandy lawsuits in it if anyone wants to pursue them. Then again, this whole mess just looks like a bunch of schools trying to protect their own interests, with varying degrees of shark-like behavior:

1. BYU decides to leave the MWC bleeding in the dust behind it by (a) bolting to independence and partial WAC membership and (b) asking for the $5million departure penalty to make sure the WAC is locked up for 5 years so BYU will have a good arrangement there. Pure self-interest at work, and really only BYU's interest.

2. The MWC decides not to be the victim and invites USU, FSU and Nevada (In that order, I guess; USU's Barnes says USU was the first invited, I've got to think Fresno was next). Again, pure self-interest, but at least it was on behalf of an entire league.

3. USU honors the deal it made to stay in the WAC. (Barnes seems to describe this as a matter of honor, but the $5 million probably figured into the Aggies' thinking, plus a desire not to shaft its neighbor BYU.) This is self-interest too, but seems to be leavened with some honor and with concern for the rest of the WAC and USU's promises to that league.

4. FSU and Nevada decide to make the leap to the MWC (not sure if they thought they'd have to pay the $5 million), probably knowing they were wrecking the BYU-WAC deal. Naked self-interest, and not much honor or concern for anyone else to be seen anywhere.

• Worst, most selfish bad guys: FSU and Nevada.

• Second-worst, pretty selfish bad guy: BYU (without them the whole thing would not have happened)

• Victim of its own decency and/or lack of killer instinct: USU.

So working hard and a little luck to improve your status in life makes you a 'bad guy' ? Welcome to the Democratic Party Comrade!

[pellegrino]

I just read this.

http://www.utahstateaggies.com/genrel/081910aab.html

wow

I hope we pound the hell out of Nevada this year. I mean 100-0 and I hope Bronco leaves the first team in until the very last play. Backstabbing mother:swear:! May they rot in hell!

[old_gregg]

So working hard and a little luck to improve your status in life makes you a 'bad guy' ? Welcome to the Democratic Party Comrade!

Fail troll is fail. Have a seat next to woot on the very exclusive camleish cuf ignore list bus.

[LA Ute]

So working hard and a little luck to improve your status in life makes you a 'bad guy' ? Welcome to the Democratic Party Comrade!

Nah. Working hard and succeeding is the American way, but so is being up-front, honest, and just a little community-spirited. Just go in through the front door, in other words.

[YOhio]

I hope we pound the hell out of Nevada this year. I mean 100-0 and I hope Bronco leaves the first team in until the very last play. Backstabbing mother:swear:! May they rot in hell!

Lol! Its great fun to see you show some fire. I want to pay them back for the 2002 game as well.

[SloanHater]

Nah. Working hard and succeeding is the American way, but so is being up-front, honest, and just a little community-spirited. Just go in through the front door, in other words.

They did. The invitation door wasn't open when they pledged their $5 mil. How it dishonest to value MWC membership as more than that and leave?

I'll echo your sentiment if they pull a Rich Rod and try to leave w/o paying.

[ERCougar]

It would take some analysis, but I guess this situation has some dandy lawsuits in it if anyone wants to pursue them. Then again, this whole mess just looks like a bunch of schools trying to protect their own interests, with varying degrees of shark-like behavior:

1. BYU decides to leave the MWC bleeding in the dust behind it by (a) bolting to independence and partial WAC membership and (b) asking for the $5million departure penalty to make sure the WAC is locked up for 5 years so BYU will have a good arrangement there. Pure self-interest at work, and really only BYU's interest.

2. The MWC decides not to be the victim and invites USU, FSU and Nevada (In that order, I guess; USU's Barnes says USU was the first invited, I've got to think Fresno was next). Again, pure self-interest, but at least it was on behalf of an entire league.

3. USU honors the deal it made to stay in the WAC. (Barnes seems to describe this as a matter of honor, but the $5 million probably figured into the Aggies' thinking, plus a desire not to shaft its neighbor BYU.) This is self-interest too, but seems to be leavened with some honor and with concern for the rest of the WAC and USU's promises to that league.

4. FSU and Nevada decide to make the leap to the MWC (not sure if they thought they'd have to pay the $5 million), probably knowing they were wrecking the BYU-WAC deal. Naked self-interest, and not much honor or concern for anyone else to be seen anywhere.

So as everyone looks at this story, who are the bad guys?

• Worst, most selfish bad guys: FSU and Nevada.

• Second-worst, pretty selfish bad guy: BYU (without them the whole thing would not have happened)

• Victim of its own decency and/or lack of killer instinct: USU.

C'mon...how is BYU any worse/selfish than Utah was? Maybe (MAYBE) a little devious with the $5 M exit penalty, but we'd absolutely hanging them today if they hadn't put some sort of security provision in place to ensure that the WAC didn't immediately dissolve. BYU saw a good move for themselves and put the pieces together to make it work. I guess Utah's not quite so bad in that they just sat back and agreed to play on Sundays.

[ERCougar]

I hope we pound the hell out of Nevada this year. I mean 100-0 and I hope Bronco leaves the first team in until the very last play. Backstabbing mother:swear:! May they rot in hell!

This is what every MWC team will be thinking about us this year.

[ERCougar]

They did. The invitation door wasn't open when they pledged their $5 mil. How it dishonest to value MWC membership as more than that and leave?

I'll echo your sentiment if they pull a Rich Rod and try to leave w/o paying.

I'm with you. But it appears that their intent/hope was to never have to pay the money. We'll see, I guess.

Oh...and there is the little part about leaking presumably confidential agreements to Thompson. Oh wait...he didn't find out anything until yesterday.

[LA Ute]

C'mon...how is BYU any worse/selfish than Utah was? Maybe (MAYBE) a little devious with the $5 M exit penalty, but we'd absolutely hanging them today if they hadn't put some sort of security provision in place to ensure that the WAC didn't immediately dissolve. BYU saw a good move for themselves and put the pieces together to make it work. I guess Utah's not quite so bad in that they just sat back and agreed to play on Sundays.

Hey, the Utes simply positioned themselves for and accepted an invitation. Anyone else in the conference would have done the same. We are pure, you are a tad slimy. And that's that.

[pellegrino]

They did. The invitation door wasn't open when they pledged their $5 mil. How it dishonest to value MWC membership as more than that and leave?

I'll echo your sentiment if they pull a Rich Rod and try to leave w/o paying.

Bullshit. You're suggesting that Fresno and Nevada had no idea the MWC would come calling, which is complete bullshit. Utah State's actions were honest and up front. They and every other WAC member knew full well that the reason they pledged five years to the WAC and $5 million as an exit fee was to discourage members from jumping ship to a fractured MWC after BYU left it. If you really think that there was anything honest about Nevada's and Fresno's actions you are far dumber than anyone could have ever imagined.

This is what every MWC team will be thinking about us this year.

and I hope we pound the hell out of them too! Sorry ass excuses of athletic programs that they are. (sorry landpoke)

[YOhio]

Hey, the Utes simply positioned themselves for and accepted an invitation. Anyone else in the conference would have done the same. We are pure, you are a tad slimy. And that's that.

As its been well established that these actions came as a directive from the Q12, I hope you do realize that you're referring to men set apart as special witnesses of Jesus Christ as slimy.

[Moliere]

Bullshit. You're suggesting that Fresno and Nevada had no idea the MWC would come calling, which is complete bullshit. Utah State's actions were honest and up front. They and every other WAC member knew full well that the reason they pledged five years to the WAC and $5 million as an exit fee was to discourage members from jumping ship to a fractured MWC after BYU left it. If you really think that there was anything honest about Nevada's and Fresno's actions you are far dumber than anyone could have ever imagined.




and I hope we pound the hell out of them too! Sorry ass excuses of athletic programs that they are. (sorry landpoke)

Don't let SH rile you up. The guy couldn't beat Palin in an unscripted debate.