The Big 12 expansion groundswell

[Shaka]

My dream is that they announce the two AZ schools tomorrow and leave Utah in fear for a week or two and then announce they are inviting WSU.

[Paperback Writer]

I'm conflicted on the whole Utah to the Big12 possibility.

As background, I became a fan of the Big8/Big12 when my family moved to Nebraska about 50 years ago. I'm also a BYU alumni and a child of parents who are BYU alumni. I had hopes that BYU and Utah would join the PAC12 until I came to the realization that BYU is treated differently by the PAC12 than Baylor by the Big12 and Notre Dame by the B1G. Since then, I hoped BYU would join the Big12 but expected Nebraska would still be part of the conference. Even after Nebraska defected, I wanted BYU in the Big12. Also, was happy when Colorado re-joined the Big12 and looking forward to Cougars - Buffaloes games.

Here's my conflict: the Big12 would be strengthened with the additions of Arizona, ASU, and Utah. Taking the best of the old WAC conference and along with Colorado, a nice grouping of five western schools. That is not only good for the Big12 but also a plus for BYU.

On the other hand, Utah made the most of its competitive advantage against BYU that it enjoyed in the PAC12. We saw the impact with in-state recruiting and the on-field results. The Utes didn't lift a finger to lobby the PAC12 for BYU's inclusion and may have done worse to justify BYU's continued exclusion. It sill kind of boggles my mind that the PAC12 would continue to exclude BYU when it was in their best interest to put aside differences and welcome the Cougars. So why should the Cougars treat the Utes any different when the tables are turned?

My hope is that if Utah does join the Big12 that more of a competitive balance is restored between BYU-Utah now that both schools are back in the same conference. But a part of me wants the pendulum to swing the other way for a time (maybe a long time).

[myboynoah]

My dream is that they announce the two AZ schools tomorrow and leave Utah in fear for a week or two and then announce they are inviting WSU.

Why not go beyond a week or two? Just drag it out.

[myboynoah]

I'm conflicted on the whole Utah to the Big12 possibility.

As background, I became a fan of the Big8/Big12 when my family moved to Nebraska about 50 years ago. I'm also a BYU alumni and a child of parents who are BYU alumni. I had hopes that BYU and Utah would join the PAC12 until I came to the realization that BYU is treated differently by the PAC12 than Baylor by the Big12 and Notre Dame by the B1G. Since then, I hoped BYU would join the Big12 but expected Nebraska would still be part of the conference. Even after Nebraska defected, I wanted BYU in the Big12. Also, was happy when Colorado joined the Big12 and looking forward to Cougars - Buffaloes games.

Here's my conflict: the Big12 would be strengthened with the additions of Arizona, ASU, and Utah. Taking the best of the old WAC conference and along with Colorado, a nice grouping of five western schools. That is not only good for the Big12 but also a plus for BYU.

On the other hand, Utah made the most of its competitive advantage against BYU that it enjoyed in the PAC12. We saw the impact with in-state recruiting and the on-field results. The Utes didn't lift a finger to lobby the PAC12 for BYU's inclusion and may have done worse to justify BYU's continued exclusion. It sill kind of boggles my mind that the PAC12 would continue to exclude BYU when it was in their best interest to put aside differences and welcome the Cougars. So why should the Cougars treat the Utes any different when the tables are turned?

My hope is that if Utah does join the Big12 that more of a competitive balance is restored between BYU-Utah now that both schools are back in the same conference. But a part of me wants the pendulum to swing the other way for a time (maybe a long time).

I have similar feelings. I'd rather see the uofutah spend some time in oblivion. But, restoring the Holy War would elevate the XII and BYU. It would be the highest profile rivalry game in the XII and garner national attention. Having grown up a BYU fan, it would be crazy to see what historically only garnered regional interest suddenly take on that national interest. That would be very good for BYU.

But right now, oblivion in the PAC West seems like a great destination for the uofutah.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Oh brother!

If you're going to take ASU eventually, then take ASU now. What is the XII waiting for? OU and UW? That seems like the only reason to wait, and those two schools just want a parking spot before bolting for the B1G. And the B1G is making its move.

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Who says you have to take ASU eventually? I have never made that argument.

Let the B1G make a decision and then act. None of these other schools are going anywhere.

So you don't want Oregon or Washington because they might be too good for us? Oh brother, indeed.

[Moliere]

But can you get Oregon and Washington to jump ship? I don't think you can.

So, absolutely, give OU and UW the opportunity to join. But the longer you give them, the more time the P12 has to figure a way out of this mess, whether by an ACC merger or otherwise. If they merge with ACC, I think you have legit competition for the third best conference, which is suboptimal.

there is no possible merger with the ACC. The ACC has already said they looked at it and it didn’t make financial sense and that was before Arizona was leaving.

[Jeff Lebowski]

there is no possible merger with the ACC. The ACC has already said they looked at it and it didn’t make financial sense and that was before Arizona was leaving.

Ha. Yeah, that is a pipe dream.

[Jeff Lebowski]

We need to start a Utah-in-the-B12-Silver-Linings thread or discussion. Here is one:

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[myboynoah]

Who says you have to take ASU eventually? I have never made that argument.

Let the B1G make a decision and then act. None of these other schools are going anywhere.

So you don't want Oregon or Washington because they might be too good for us? Oh brother, indeed.

Well, I guess we differ on ASU, hence my view on when to invite.

Didn't say OR or WA would be too good for us, just that they clearly have eyes on the B1G and will likely eventually get invited, whether sooner or later. I prefer schools with a longer term view of XII inclusion. More stable to me.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Well, I guess we differ on ASU, hence my view on when to invite.

Didn't say OR or WA would be too good for us, just that they clearly have eyes on the B1G and will likely eventually get invited, whether sooner or later. I prefer schools with a longer term view of XII inclusion. More stable to me.

B1G: "We don't want Oregon or Washington"
Oregon and Washington: "Hey B12, can we please join your conference?"
B12: "No, we are afraid that the B1G wants you."

Weak, man. Weak.

[Jeff Lebowski]

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[MartyFunkhouser]

B1G: "We don't want Oregon or Washington"
Oregon and Washington: "Hey B12, can we please join your conference?"
B12: "No, we are afraid that the B1G wants you."

Weak, man. Weak.

Oregon and Washington will eventually be in one of the 2 power conferences (B1G/SEC). Even if they went to the Big-12 it is a temporary placeholder for them. Maybe that makes sense for the Big-12 to do, but this thing is going to end with 3 tier system in what was previously FBS football

Tier 1: SEC/B1G
Tier 2: Some form of the Big-12/ACC. At this point, I'm assuming the Pac-12 is basically gone from this tier.
Tier 3: Everyone else.

"College" football as we know it ended when Oklahoma/Texas left the Big12

[Jeff Lebowski]

Oregon and Washington will eventually be in one of the 2 power conferences (B1G/SEC). Even if they went to the Big-12 it is a temporary placeholder for them. Maybe that makes sense for the Big-12 to do, but this thing is going to end with 3 tier system in what was previously FBS football

Tier 1: SEC/B1G
Tier 2: Some form of the Big-12/ACC. At this point, I'm assuming the Pac-12 is basically gone from this tier.
Tier 3: Everyone else.

"College" football as we know it ended when Oklahoma/Texas left the Big12

Abandon all hope, college football fans. The end is near.

[SteelBlue]

What do we make of the UW board meeting scheduled for 9pm tonight (9pm????). Too early for B1G it would seem.

Edit: based on comments on twitter this may be completely unrelated to expansion so never mind.

[myboynoah]

B1G: "We don't want Oregon or Washington"
Oregon and Washington: "Hey B12, can we please join your conference?"
B12: "No, we are afraid that the B1G wants you."

Weak, man. Weak.

Meh. OR and WA are likely to end up in the B1G sooner, which is where they want to be. The other PAC schools know that and are looking for their own offramps.

Act now and take ASU. If OR and WA come calling, then room will be found.