2020 presidential election straw poll

[tooblue]

the paradox of the economic rationality of voting, you fucking wanker

Ok, let me get this straight. Your vote is irrelevant except when it is relevant, though it is very rare for a vote to be relevant, so don’t vote, because your vote is irrelevant ... And in fact the only relevant vote is the deciding vote, but of course any deciding vote can't be a deciding vote unless it is cast in succession to all preceding and so-declared irrelevant votes ... of course, then by definition that means an irrelevant vote isn't irrelevant precisely because there cannot be a relevant vote without the preceding irrelevant votes.

[All-American]

Ok, let me get this straight. Your vote is irrelevant except when it is relevant, though it is very rare for a vote to be relevant, so don’t vote, because your vote is irrelevant ... And in fact the only relevant vote is the deciding vote, but of course any deciding vote can't be a deciding vote unless it is cast in succession to all preceding and so-declared irrelevant votes ... of course, then by definition that means an irrelevant vote isn't irrelevant precisely because there cannot be a relevant vote without the preceding irrelevant votes.

The bold part is where you lost me. I'm not saying you shouldn't vote.

[tooblue]

The bold part is where you lost me. I'm not saying you shouldn't vote.

Semantics ... stating your vote is irrelevant, or doesn't matter is equivalent to stating you shouldn't vote.

[old_gregg]

Ok, let me get this straight. Your vote is irrelevant except when it is relevant, though it is very rare for a vote to be relevant, so don’t vote, because your vote is irrelevant ... And in fact the only relevant vote is the deciding vote, but of course any deciding vote can't be a deciding vote unless it is cast in succession to all preceding and so-declared irrelevant votes ... of course, then by definition that means an irrelevant vote isn't irrelevant precisely because there cannot be a relevant vote without the preceding irrelevant votes.

what's it like having to wonder if you're the dumbest guy in every room you walk into

[tooblue]

what's it like having to wonder if you're the dumbest guy in every room you walk into

I don't know, you tell me ... and while you are at it riddle me this: if one vote is irrelevant then all votes are irrelevant, except the deciding vote which then therefore means all votes are relevant, so should I vote even if it is not economically rational?

[All-American]

Semantics ... stating your vote is irrelevant, or doesn't matter is equivalent to stating you shouldn't vote.

Of course it is not. Unless the reason you vote is that you think you are choosing the winner, in which case JL thinks you're an idiot.

[tooblue]

Of course it is not. Unless the reason you vote is that you think you are choosing the winner, in which case JL thinks you're an idiot.

Philosophically speaking, it most definitely is semantics. And according to Greg you are neither choosing the winner or the loser, you and your vote are irrelevant ... except when you and your vote are relevant

[Pelado]

Even if you are a super nerd robot that sets up a T-account to balance the cost and benefit for every single decision, voting can have a net positive to the individual. I think that some people here are not seeing the same magnitude of benefit in providing a minor assistance in the outcome. For some the outcome of a ballot initiative, school board member, or the POTUS has incredibly high stakes. To some, one outcome is incredibly favored over another. For these people, the potential benefit of voting (even adjusted for probability of success) provides enough benefit to outweigh the costs.

Basically what I am saying is that if you don't vote, you don't view the probability adjusted result as meaningful. I disagree with that notion, but I view this election as having a massive importance on the future and direction of our country.

A million points to Flystripper for referencing T-accounts.

do you also play the powerball? because, unless the magnitude to you of the election result is $75m, it's the exact same calculus.

The lottery is a tax on the mathematically inept.

I wrote in Mitt. Ballot sent!

After that weird rambling performance by Biden last night I just couldn’t bring myself to vote for him. The guy was dumb to start with and is clearly in a state of early dementia.

What are your qualifications for determining that? We need someone with "doctor" in the handle so we know it's a legit diagnosis. Where's doctorcoug when you need him?

[Jeff Lebowski]

agreed--they do not vote to determine the outcome of elections

Ha. I love both of you guys even though you are so stubborn about this.

[MartyFunkhouser]

YEEZY2020

[Jeff Lebowski]

I wrote in Mitt. Ballot sent!

After that weird rambling performance by Biden last night I just couldn’t bring myself to vote for him. The guy was dumb to start with and is clearly in a state of early dementia.

I voted today. Rambling biden >>>>>>>>>>>> trump.

I love Utah's vote by mail system. Works great. And I don't have to drive anywhere or stand in line so my economic lazy ass calculus is much simpler!

[All-American]

Philosophically speaking, it most definitely is semantics. And according to Greg you are neither choosing the winner or the loser, you and your vote are irrelevant ... except when you and your vote are relevant

No, your vote is pretty much never individually relevant.

That doesn't mean you shouldn't vote. It just means that your individual vote doesn't really make a difference, and you should come up with a better reason for going to all the trouble of casting a vote than affecting the outcome, which you will almost certainly never do.

[Northwestcoug]

I voted today. Rambling biden >>>>>>>>>>>> trump.

Hear hear. I saw the same town hall that Cardiac did. I know it's been awhile since I've dealt with patients, but if that was dementia, I didn't realize just how many people I know have it!

[Jeff Lebowski]

This is surprising. Typically more people will tune in to watch the train wreck.

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[tooblue]

No, your vote is pretty much never individually relevant.

That doesn't mean you shouldn't vote. It just means that your individual vote doesn't really make a difference, and you should come up with a better reason for going to all the trouble of casting a vote than affecting the outcome, which you will almost certainly never do.

A vote cast always affects the outcome because without it the deciding vote cannot be the deciding vote.