Michelle Bachmann's Head is a Novelty Fishbowl

[Borderline Divine]

I DON'T think men should have a say on abortion.

[il Padrino Ute]

I DON'T think men should have a say on abortion.

So, if a wife is pregnant and something happens and she goes into a state of health that is threatening her life and the only way to save her life is to abort the pregnancy, but she's unable to make that decision, such as being comatose, the husband should not have a say on what to do?

[Uncle Ted]

I DON'T think men should have a say on abortion.

I think I would want a say if I was the target of the abortion.

Using your same logic men shouldn't have a say on prostitution. i.e. Women should be able to decide themselves what they can do with their bodies.

[Borderline Divine]

I think I would want a say if I was the target of the abortion.

Using your same logic men shouldn't have a say on prostitution. i.e. Women should be able to decide themselves what they can do with their bodies.

Yes thats my opinion on the subject.

[Moliere]

I DON'T think men should have a say on abortion.

I don't agree. The child is as much than mans as it is the woman's. But that presupposes that the fetus is considered a child.

[RobinFinderson]

How many years do you think it will take before talking about America in derogatory terms by Black Ministers is excused because of the horrible treatment received in the past.

Obviously electing a black President isn't good enough. You need to love him and support him regardless of how you feel about his policies.

Back to my question, 50 years, 100 years or when repatriation is made and we take billions from the white rich son of a bitches and give it to blacks.

I know, based on what I have said I am a racist.

Similarly, you could ask how long a people should be able to grumble about Christ getting persecuted and nailed to a cross. Just as Christians in general believe that meditating on the suffering and sacrifice of Jesus has the power to raise up a kind of Christian consciousness that inspires a better way of living, the Black church takes a similar view of historic Black oppression. I think that it is useful to understand that Black churches teach a Christian theology that is rooted in issues of power and oppression.

Anyhow, I'm getting away from my point -- J. Wright was not some isolated kook. He represents a tradition with deep roots, one that has given rise to Martin Luther King Jr., and one that is uniquely American. One can't attack Wright without attacking the Black church, because Wright is a typical example of a Black Christian leader (and not that different in his style than MLK, who said plenty of controversial things about the American government himself, in regard to Civil Rights, the war in Vietnam, and over the issue of poverty in general. What most people think of when they talk about MLK is a very sanitized version of the man, who in real life was much more similar to Wright).

[Borderline Divine]

So, if a wife is pregnant and something happens and she goes into a state of health that is threatening her life and the only way to save her life is to abort the pregnancy, but she's unable to make that decision, such as being comatose, the husband should not have a say on what to do?

Yes in such an extereme situation as the hypothetical you imagine, then of course the husband or father would be next in line legally to make the call.

My position is that men shouldn't be passing a bunch of laws concerning women's reproductive choices and rights.

And women should stay the hell out of the rules of college football.

[Jacob]

Apparently you know more about standard Lutheran doctrine than you do about standard Black Theology. What folks need to understand wrt Brother Wright is that he represents a fairly typical preacher coming from the tradition of Black American Christiandom.

You are missing the point. I don't claim to be an expert on either Lutheranism or Black Liberation Theology. But he's not excused from saying and preaching crazy and offensive stuff just because it's part of a theology accepted only by a tiny minority of the population. Now, if his belief was mainstream, and he wasn't preaching the most offensive points of the theology, but merely acknowledged the doctrinal relevance, he'd probably get a pass.

[Jacob]

My position is that men shouldn't be passing a bunch of laws concerning women's reproductive choices and rights.

In one sense, I completely agree with this, but everthing turns on how you define "women's reproductive choices and rights." I suspect we'd define them quite differently.

On the other hand, the statement is absurd. Laws prohibiting rape, for example, is a clear case of men passing laws concerning women's reproductive choices.

[Borderline Divine]

In one sense, I completely agree with this, but everthing turns on how you define "women's reproductive choices and rights." I suspect we'd define them quite differently.

On the other hand, the statement is absurd. Laws prohibiting rape, for example, is a clear case of men passing laws concerning women's reproductive choices.

I'm sure you didn't mean to imply that rape is some sort of "reproductive choice" a woman might make.

[Jacob]

[/B]

I'm sure you didn't mean to imply that rape is some sort of "reproductive choice" a woman might make.

I neither said nor implied as much. I'm certain you can understand what I wrote.

[RobinFinderson]

You are missing the point. I don't claim to be an expert on either Lutheranism or Black Liberation Theology. But he's not excused from saying and preaching crazy and offensive stuff just because it's part of a theology accepted only by a tiny minority of the population. Now, if his belief was mainstream, and he wasn't preaching the most offensive points of the theology, but merely acknowledged the doctrinal relevance, he'd probably get a pass.

Wright preached the biblical concept that violence begets violence. That isn't crazy or offensive.

Wright then preached that the attacks of 9/11 represent the kind of violence a violent nation might face as retribution from offended peoples. He didn't say that the US deserved to be attacked. He simply said that, in the face of American acts of violence throughout parts of the world, there are a lot of pissed off people willing to do violent things against the US. That isn't crazy or offensive.

Then he said that God might not be blessing America, but that God might be damning America. This is the controversial part, but I it isn't out of line with traditional religious teaching, especially that found in the Book of Mormon, where the cycle of nations waxing and waning in the favor of the Lord is perhaps the strongest theme of the book. He didn't call for God to damn America. He simply suggested that people take 9/11 as an opportunity to reflect on our nation's foreign policy. It is a theme that Samuel the Lamanite would appreciate.

But Samuel was preaching crazy and offensive stuff to a majority population of a different race, so I guess he had it coming...

[wuapinmon]

[YOUTUBE]34u_3Z9_LUw[/YOUTUBE]

[Borderline Divine]

And back to the original thread

Bachmann in South Carolina on Saturday night regarding the deficit:

“We need to simply tell people the facts, like Glenn Beck, with that chalkboard, that man can explain anything. I think if we give Glenn Beck the numbers, he can solve this.”

You can't make this shit up...

[Jacob]

Wright preached the biblical concept that violence begets violence. That isn't crazy or offensive.

In your opinion. However, many of the things he said are crazy and offensive to most Americans. But you've now successfully drawn me away from the topic, as usual.

I don't know why you don't think these statements are both crazy and offensive:

The government lied about the Tuskegee experiment. They purposely infected African American men with syphilis.

The government lied about inventing the HIV virus as a means of genocide against people of color.

And guess what else? If they don't find them some weapons of mass destruction, they gonna do just like the LAPD, and plant the some weapons of mass destruction.

The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, not God Bless America. God damn America — that's in the Bible — for killing innocent people. God damn America, for treating our citizens as less than human. God damn America, as long as she tries to act like she is God, and she is supreme.

And then there is the moral equivocation between the 911 attacks and our response in Afghanistan which you tried to soften up and defend.