2024 Presidential Election Thread

[Pelado]

Me too, though just to make sure I've made the most of it, I'll also say that those are children from my first wife. (We're still married.)

Going forward, I might have to steal that.

[originalsocal]

And he was right about "Chameleon" Harris... I am still confused about what her race is.

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Ted, even for you this a dumb and racist statement.

[Northwestcoug]

Looks like what most people saw in the Trump interview today as a losing strategy has been green-lit for the entire campaign:

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[YOhio]

The Trump right wing has really honed the ability to take an important issue and present it in the least palatable possible way. Birth rates and demographics are important and government needs to consider policies that encourage responsible family planning. So of course the Trumpers decide the way to address the issue is by insulting women and creating another division point amongst Americans.

[myboynoah]

Looks like what most people saw in the Trump interview today as a losing strategy has been green-lit for the entire campaign:

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Double down. Not surprising.

I predict more Russian bot blasts from UT, these now focused on every time Kamala has worn a sari or eaten butter chicken.

[LVAllen]

Double down. Not surprising.

I predict more Russian bot blasts from UT, these now focused on every time Kamala has worn a sari or eaten butter chicken.

Hopefully, this should make it easier:

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[myboynoah]

The Trump right wing has really honed the ability to take an important issue and present it in the least palatable possible way. Birth rates and demographics are important and government needs to consider policies that encourage responsible family planning. So of course the Trumpers decide the way to address the issue is by insulting women and creating another division point amongst Americans.

You're right. We should discuss demographic issues facing the U.S. and the developed world and seeking possible solutions, including immigration. But I don't see JDV having misspoken or having been inarticulate about his ideas. It's clear he has given them a lot of thought and has expressed his solutions. That weird voting scheme just didn't appear out of thin air. And he has expressed his views on childless women/people a number of times, all them focused on how those people are faulty, sociopathic, or not really invested in the future of the country or world. That's just abhorrent, demeaning and offensive, particularly to everyone who has a friend or family member who is childless. Maybe I'm missing it, but I don't recall his views being framed in a way to address future demographic problems. I guess I don't see that as "Oh, those silly MAGA folks are just so inarticulate in expressing their vision and strategy to address real problems." It's more just plain mean "othering" and gross. His thinking seems dangerous to me.

[USUC]

You just did the bothsidism thing Obama was not corrosive like Trump. He did not try and perpetuate violence. You can dislike him he just was not dictatorial and didn't talk about seizing power.

No, but ran strategically divisive campaigns and eschewed bipartisanship with a "pen and a phone." He injected race into the political culture. You are right, he is not as vain and authoritarian as Trump. But he is a large part of why our current politics is garbage.

[falafel]

Double down. Not surprising.

I predict more Russian bot blasts from UT, these now focused on every time Kamala has worn a sari or eaten butter chicken.

Ms. Habba pronounced Kamala as "Camela"

[falafel]

Yeah, I thought he handled this attack from idiot reporter that didn't want to talk about the actual issues pretty well... It was great entertainment.


And he was right about "Chameleon" Harris... I am still confused about what her race is.

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Odd comment coming from Ted.

[frank ryan]

Seems a little elitist, frank.

To suggest because he has probably had so many children that he doesn't know for sure, that doesn't make him of greater social value than those who don't have children? That's not elitist. I don't think someone's value is predicated on whether or not they have kids.
And yes, some people have children who don't want them, who abuse them, who use them to awful ends and who should be parents. That isn't elitist, and I don't even think it's controversial. It's true. It's not inherently virtuous to be a parent. You sell your kid for sex (which happens) you aren't being a wonderful member of society.

[Jeff Lebowski]

To suggest because he has probably had so many children that he doesn't know for sure, that doesn't make him of greater social value than those who don't have children? That's not elitist. I don't think someone's value is predicated on whether or not they have kids.
And yes, some people have children who don't want them, who abuse them, who use them to awful ends and who should be parents. That isn't elitist, and I don't even think it's controversial. It's true. It's not inherently virtuous to be a parent. You sell your kid for sex (which happens) you aren't being a wonderful member of society.

You have constructed quite the straw man here with these anecdotes.

Do you believe that population decline is a problem?
Do you believe we should reward and encourage child-bearing?

[frank ryan]

No, but ran strategically divisive campaigns and eschewed bipartisanship with a "pen and a phone." He injected race into the political culture. You are right, he is not as vain and authoritarian as Trump. But he is a large part of why our current politics is garbage.

I'm taking the bait how did he inject race into the political culture when from the get go he had his citizenship questioned because of his race and his name used as a taunt because it is non-Anglo?

Trump, Arpiao, Jerry Corsi, those guys made heyday about birtherism.

I think Obama was plenty arrogant but an anticipated crazy socialist progressive, he sure didn't deliver.

[frank ryan]

You have constructed quite the straw man here with these anecdotes.

Do you believe that population decline is a problem?
Do you believe we should reward and encourage child-bearing?

Wait, so what is elitist? What is the strawman? I feel like some things are getting mixed up and you're making some assumptions of your own.

Also, everyone on here shares their own experiences and how it informs their opinions. I have some unique experiences and a background that has taught some things.


I wasn't making a statement on population decline or incentivizing having children. That was your assumption. My issue, and I thought it was clear, was the idea that people have greater value to society if they have children. I do believe some people aren't good parents and would be better off not having children. Everyone has value to society because everyone has inherent value:

To be direct. Population decline is an important concern. I'm not opposed to incentivizing people having children. I support, especially where kids are involved, a good social safety net. I also think immigration is part of the equation. If you look around the globe places like Japan who insist on being a closed society are really feeling it with population decline. So I'm not against addressing it.

My issue is demonizing people who don't have kids and that is where some of this messaging is going.

[Uncle Ted]

Hopefully, this should make it easier:

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Yes, this helps.... Now, which one of the grandparents were the slave owners?