Breast implants

[byu71]

Then you don't believe in following the prophet. I don't think anything less of you for it, though.

I certainly don't think you are blindly following as some might accuse. I appreciate that we can differ and still respect where the other one is coming from.


My own belief is one follows the Prophet as far as leading the church as a whole. However, when it comes to how it affects me personally, I feel I can ask and receive inspiration for myself.

As an example, when I was first married it was taught birth control was evil and we shouldn't practice it. After two quick kids and still in grad school, we practiced birth control and when we prayed about it, we felt no guilt in deciding to procede to use birth control. Not only is birth control not taught now, I never hear it referred to as evil.

Thank goodness I rarely hear anything that I disagree with these days. I do hear though people give me their interpretation of what the prophet said and how I should act. Well actually not so much because most people who would talk to me that closely about something like that know I would tell them to f-off. (f stands for frick)

[BlueHair]

link?

To explain where I'm coming from, I'm not a hard a$$ demanding everyone obey everything that's taught in general conference. I just think it's lame for people to pick and choose and pretend they're not under any obligation to obey the prophet. I say go ahead and pick and choose but admit by doing so you're weak and sinful and need Christ. We get into problems when we have this super scary heavy view of what sin is. Just admit you sin every day and then figure out what to do about it.

Do you really think a person should obey the prophet? Even as a believer, I never thought the prophet was my boss. I always thought of him as a nice old guy that gives advice (not commandments) on how to live a good life. If Thomas S. Monson says roast beef is good, does that mean we are commanded to eat roast beef?

[BlueHair]

For the record, I am pro-breast implants.

[jay santos]

http://www.cougaruteforum.com/showpo...1&postcount=45

That's a reference to doctrine. BIG BIG BIG difference between doctrine and prophetic counsel/commandment.

[jay santos]

Do you really think a person should obey the prophet? Even as a believer, I never thought the prophet was my boss. I always thought of him as a nice old guy that gives advice (not commandments) on how to live a good life. If Thomas S. Monson says roast beef is good, does that mean we are commanded to eat roast beef?

If he tells you to eat roast beef over the pulpit at GC, then it is a commandment. And if you eat roast beef it is a sin. That's assuming you believe TSM is a prophet of God.

[Jeff Lebowski]

If he tells you to eat roast beef over the pulpit at GC, then it is a commandment. And if you eat roast beef it is a sin. That's assuming you believe TSM is a prophet of God.

Do you see personal revelation playing any part in this?

[Fiyero]

Dallin H. Oaks:

[There is a] principle that a message given by a General Authority at a general conference- a message prepared under the influence of the Spirit to further the work of the Lord- is given to inspire, to edify, to challenge, or to correct. It is given to be heard under the influence of the Spirit of the Lord, with the intended result that the listener learns from the talk and from the Spirit what he or she should do about it.

As a General Authority, it is my responsibility to preach general principles. When I do, I dont try to define all the exceptions. There are exceptions to some rules. For example, we believe the commandment is not violated by killing pursuant to a lawful order in an armed conflict. But dont ask me to give an opinion on your exception. I only teach the general rules. Whether an exception applies to you is your responsibility. You must work that out individually between you and the Lord.

http://www.ldschurchnews.com/article...-Lifetime.html

[pellegrino]

That's a reference to doctrine. BIG BIG BIG difference between doctrine and prophetic counsel/commandment.

please elaborate.

[DU Ute]

BIG BIG BIG

This is the first thing you've said in the Breast Implant thread that I've agreed with.

[jay santos]

Do you see personal revelation playing any part in this?

Yes I do. But I think you step outside of Mormon orthodoxy if you do this on a very regular basis.

There are a lot of commandments that are pretty clear that I see people hedging on a lot (assuming the person is orthodox Mormon and believes the prophet is a true prophet):

--every young man a mission
--no tats or multiple earrings
--wear your garments night and day
--attend your meetings
--no rated R movies
--no NFL on Sunday

etc etc

I hear over and over, these are not commandments they are suggestions. Bullshit. I'll be the first to admit I love rated R movies, watch football on Sunday. I wouldn't have time to list all the things I do wrong.

The charity-related sins are even more commonly committed, i.e. being an asshole to someone. And we generally ignore those as sins too.

But, I think it's a real important nuance to understand that sin is something we humans do on a constant basis. There are commandments. There are things we should be doing and not doing on an hourly basis that we're not. And this should turn us to the Savior and atonement. We are the prostitute and the publican not the Pharisee.

I think we get legalistic and can easily make it a Pharisee religion when we start justifying everything and thinking we're not committing sin.

[Art Vandelay]

This was an actual conversation my wife had with her friend. Here is what I posted on CB last June:

My wife recently visiting with a friend whose husband is a bishop. According to my wife this good sister (and she is a very good person) was quoted as saying, "I really want to get it done, but I need to wait until *** is released. The bishop's wife can't just walk into sacrament with a new set of boobs"

So basically she wants them, I know they can easily afford them, but she doesn't feel it would be appropriate because of her husband's calling.

This doesn't add anything to the discussion, but it cracks me up so I thought I would share.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I think we get legalistic and can easily make it a Pharisee religion when we start justifying everything and thinking we're not committing sin.

Irony alert.

[jay santos]

please elaborate.

How is this not obvious? Prophetic counsel and commandment varies in every time. Doctrine is unchanging.

[jay santos]

Irony alert.

I don't follow.

[KillerDog]

Yes I do. But I think you step outside of Mormon orthodoxy if you do this on a very regular basis.

There are a lot of commandments that are pretty clear that I see people hedging on a lot (assuming the person is orthodox Mormon and believes the prophet is a true prophet):

--every young man a mission
--no tats or multiple earrings
--wear your garments night and day
--attend your meetings
--no rated R movies
--no NFL on Sunday

etc etc

I hear over and over, these are not commandments they are suggestions. Bullshit. I'll be the first to admit I love rated R movies, watch football on Sunday. I wouldn't have time to list all the things I do wrong.

The charity-related sins are even more commonly committed, i.e. being an asshole to someone. And we generally ignore those as sins too.

But, I think it's a real important nuance to understand that sin is something we humans do on a constant basis. There are commandments. There are things we should be doing and not doing on an hourly basis that we're not. And this should turn us to the Savior and atonement. We are the prostitute and the publican not the Pharisee.

I think we get legalistic and can easily make it a Pharisee religion when we start justifying everything and thinking we're not committing sin.

I read your list of obvious commandments that people hedge on. I realize you have a strong belief of your position on this and I don't want to offend but you are up in the night on that list. Even a true believer can look at some of those subjects and not agree that they are clear commandments for the general populace of the Church. Are you unable to hear their arguments when presented because of your strong opinions or have you never had someone explain why some of those are clearly not commandments?