Members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in the News

[myboynoah]

IIRC, if the government as property holder keeps ignoring them in 21 years they might have claim to the facility. That's not the action of a terrorist.

Yeah, those are squatters.

[Shaka]

I've started to read everything I can find on this issue. This conflict seems like a sort of continuation of the Sagebrush Rebellion. I think the Bundy's are nuts I think maybe the Hammond family isn't and have genuine grievances that need to be addressed.

[Eddie]

My brother's in-laws live in southeastern Oregon and say the BLM and Forrest Service are pretty heavy handed. One of them just posted this on FB and stated that this is a pretty good take on what has happened. I'm not really into news sites from either the left or the right. However, I think this was an interesting read:

http://theconservativetreehouse.com/...y-persecution/

I agree. Interesting read. Sure makes it sound like some backhanded measures were used to get to this point in the case for the Hammonds. I could see someone wanting to draw attention to it.

[RC Vikings]

A guy in our office was watching the news and realized Ammon Bundy was a AP in his mission. Sounds like he's always been an overachiever.

[smokymountainrain]

A guy in our office was watching the news and realized Ammon Bundy was a AP in his mission. Sounds like he's always been an overachiever.

and now he has a beard. how the mighty have fallen.

[Northwestcoug]

A guy in our office was watching the news and realized Ammon Bundy was a AP in his mission. Sounds like he's always been an overachiever.

He was in my brother's ward a while back. He didn't think too highly of him then. Bundy must have lost all those AP charisma skills pretty quickly.

[Jeff Lebowski]

So we want to call these yokels terrorists? This is the debate in America? Good hell, people.

I don't think that term has been used too much outside of social media. NYT called them "armed activists". WaPo called them "occupiers". CNN is calling them "armed protesters".

"Squatters" doesn't seem right given that they are armed have said that they are willing to die if necessary.

I just call them "idiots".

[Northwestcoug]

fivethirtyeight posted an interesting article yesterday about grazing fees. Here's an informative graphic:

Capture.jpg

Basically, grazing fees on public lands has been stable for over thirty years. It is much cheaper than private grazing fees, which continue to increase over time.

It ends with this paragraph, which I thought was a new way of thinking about the issue:

So getting to buy grazing rights from the Bureau of Land Management is a steal, unless, like the Bundys, you think the government is trying to charge you for what’s rightfully yours. Or, at the very least, not rightfully theirs. The Bundys claim the land because their ancestors worked on it before the bureau even existed.

The federal government owns over 80 percent of all land in the Bundys’ home state of Nevada and over half of all the land in Oregon. If that land were privately owned, the market price for grazing rights might be lower than it is today, as more private land owners competed with each other. But, for now, the government is using its clout to lower costs for ranchers, if they’re willing to accept the aid.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...cent-discount/

I admit that I only have a superficial understanding of the conflict between ranchers and the BLM, and I suppose this might attract the ire of Cowboy. I'll always lend a listening ear to the argument about federal overreach, and no doubt the feds have taken over a significant amount of land that was once owned privately. But I think the article adds an important viewpoint about the economics of grazing rights.

[Moliere]

I'll admit that I must not know enough about the situation if grazing fees is an issue since I've never heard of the Hammonds having disputes over grazing fees.

[Northwestcoug]

I'll admit that I must not know enough about the situation if grazing fees is an issue since I've never heard of the Hammonds having disputes over grazing fees.

I haven't heard if that's their beef (tee hee!) either. But I think it's an important detail. I've heard over and over that the federal government is making it harder for ranchers to maintain their lifestyle. Taking ownership of land that was historically controlled by ranching families is an issue. But based on public grazing fees, it certainly sounds like the government is trying hard to help them keep their businesses.

[old_gregg]

I'll admit that I must not know enough about the situation if grazing fees is an issue since I've never heard of the Hammonds having disputes over grazing fees.

so you basically don't know anything about it?

[RC Vikings]

Why does Mormonism seem to add fuel to some peoples craziness?

[wuapinmon]

From David Bundy's FB page. He is going to disregard today's directive from the church and follow other modern and ancient prophets, thank you very much.

[wuapinmon]

Why does Mormonism seem to add fuel to some peoples craziness?

Dogmatism coupled with Red Scare patriotism and a persecution complex since Pennsylvania.

[myboynoah]

Why does Mormonism seem to add fuel to some peoples craziness?

Because that can happen with any religion?

This is very tame considering what fuel other religions, or strongly held views of any sort, can add to people's craziness.