183 Semiannual General Conference Thread

[Solon]

Is it probable that the sealing doctrine has been usurped by modern day prophets to reinforce an emphasis on the nuclear family? I need to spend some time studying JS's preaching on the sealing power, but in what little I've read so far he seems to make it more about an unbroken chain of ancestors sealed all the way back to Adam and not so much about living with your kids again after this life. It seems to be more about saving yourself (and your ancestors) through that chain and not so much wanting to hang out while making worlds without end.

As much as I love the idea of an eternal family, I really just love the idea of being married to MJ for eternity.

I"ve always understood the sealing-power to be all about literal lineage. Some lineages receive more blessings than other lineages. You need to be connected to the right bloodline in order to receive the promised inheritance. This is evident in the Old Testament's Abrahamic Covenant, and even in the New Testament's emphasis on Jesus's Davidic descent. This is the justification for both polygyny & polyandry. Being tied to certain bloodlines brought inheritances, in this case literal heavenly kingdoms bestowed on Israel's royalty by a nepotistic God.

There's probably stuff out there on how this idea relates to freemasonry & Jacksonian democracy in the early 1800s, but you'd have to ask a real historian where to find it.

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

Does the size of the penis matter when trying to simulate a mother?

[YOhio]

Does the size of the penis matter when trying to stimulate a mother?

Yes.

[Jarid in Cedar]

I am consistently befuddled by the willingness of adults with perfectly functioning brains to subjugate their own thoughts to the opinion of others simply because they have been told that the other persons' opinion is better.

[All-American]

I am consistently befuddled by the willingness of adults with perfectly functioning brains to subjugate their own thoughts to the opinion of others simply because they have been told that the other persons' opinion is better.

So you've never followed a doctor's orders?

[Harry Tic]

I am consistently befuddled by the willingness of adults with perfectly functioning brains to subjugate their own thoughts to the opinion of others simply because they have been told that the other persons' opinion is better.

You're easily befuddled then, JiC. Not all opinions are created equal and I will happily defer to the informed opinion of, say, a physician, rather than believe that my own opinions are more trustworthy simply because they are my own, smart and handsome as I am.

EDIT: Jinx on AA. Buy me a Coke.

[All-American]

EDIT: Jinx on AA. Buy me a Coke.

Why? You're the hack.

[Harry Tic]

Why? You're the hack.

Well, yes. But I said "jinx, buy me a Coke" first. How can you claim to be an "All-American" and yet know not of these things?

[Jarid in Cedar]

So you've never followed a doctor's orders?

You have never dealt with patients.

[TripletDaddy]

So you've never followed a doctor's orders?

I think he is just opining on Utahs recent coaching hires..giacoletti, boylen, and now coach K. It is almost hoops season so we will be seeing more and more of this sort of introspective frustration.

[Northwestcoug]

Is it probable that the sealing doctrine has been usurped by modern day prophets to reinforce an emphasis on the nuclear family? I need to spend some time studying JS's preaching on the sealing power, but in what little I've read so far he seems to make it more about an unbroken chain of ancestors sealed all the way back to Adam and not so much about living with your kids again after this life. It seems to be more about saving yourself (and your ancestors) through that chain and not so much wanting to hang out while making worlds without end.

As much as I love the idea of an eternal family, I really just love the idea of being married to MJ for eternity.

I think family sealing can be a very comforting doctrine, especially when confronted with mortality. But like JL says, there's nothing much beyond generalities that is taught (well, not in the last century )

I heard a trite saying the other day, which I think is good to think about: an eternity of anything is hell. If there is an eternal existence, I hope it gets mixed up frequently. I think we assume that an 'eternal increase' will be its own reward, but I assume even that would get boring after an eon or two.

[clackamascoug]

I just assumed he would address the other dimensions in a follow up post. Or maybe he already did address the other dimensions in another dimension.

The people want what the people want.

The concept of perfected adults living communally in peace and love is the predominant Mormon endgame theme. We're told that if we hit all the checkpoints that "we can have it all" including the ability to have children and create new worlds. Just like our Heavenly Father. We understand the game plan to be - "this is your one shot - don't blow it." On the other hand we understand the game plan to be "this is your one shot - you're going blow it, and we will provide a Savior to bail you out." Mormons mitigate the uneven earthly playing field by saying a couple of things. First, our good behavior in the pre-existence merited our time/place/circumstance to be born under the covenant. Second, temple work is the key to everyone's ticket to the CK. Of course, they have to accept the ordinances, but who wouldn't when faced with the truth as it's unfurled to us after death. Even then, two kingdoms with glory are still available for the people who are too stupid to bow there heads and accept their postmortem good fortune.

But what about eternal truths? Are we to ignore eternal truths as a measure of Faith? Do we believe things that aren't true just because "that's the way it's always been?" Or do we search out new truths so that we can make better and more perfect choices regarding our eternal future. How do we as Latter-Day Saints balance scientific truth with contradictory Mormon lore? Does lore and tradition guide us, and if so where is it going to guide us? Is it a better life plan to stick to the middle of the LDS pack and not to question the sometimes zany banal contradictions of Science and LDS Tradition? Who are these Three Nephites, and where exactly was the Garden of Eden? As I have loved you, Love one another, seems less important than who gets to pray what, and when can they do it. No this is MY duty, and that's Your duty. How many steps can I take on the Sabbath? Oh, Clack's an idiot and we should make fun of him because he thinks that multiple dimensions are real, and he thinks sexual modesty in marriage is a good thing. Oh Brother!

FYI, I didn't make up the theories on multiple dimensions. In fact, in 2013 scientist's say that MD's are a fact. If indeed MD's exist, a good question to ask might be "how do they fit into the eternal equation?" MD's fit quite well into the LDS theology actually, and as a starting point for all you math geniuses the most essential question question in the big picture is "why earth?" If the Lord's creations are more numerous than the grains of sand on all the beaches of the world, why Earth? Why did the Savior end up being crucified on this particular planet? I'll defer to Indy for the actual odds on infinity to one. Personally, I don't believe in chance. LDS theology points us towards multiple dimensions, but people seem to be so invested in this particular dimension that they totally disregard the possibility that there is more to it than meets the eye.

Multiple Dimensions solve several quandry's within the LDS community. If the Savior created just one Earth, and it existed in infinite multiple dimensions, then he would have only been crucified on one Earth infinitely. Perhaps you could call it an Infinite Atonement. We come to Earth to learn Good from Evil. Learn is the key word. The best way to learn in life is to learn by experience. What if you had the opportunity to live the consequences out of every good/bad decision. Perhaps by the end of your life you would have lived out millions of different scenarios. Each scenario would give billions of data points to learn and be judged from. If we lived long enough and knew the result of every possible decision that could be before use - because we had - perhaps would we could be omniscient because there would be nothing left to learn because we learned it all. Perhaps we would even be omnipresent because we would be "everywhere" at the same time. If God wants us to become as smart as he is, perhaps setting us up in a awesome MD universe and sending us to school is how He's doing it. We're already in training, don't you know?

Polyandry and Polygamy are hot topics in our LDS Community. Why? Are they God given principles or not? Do we really believe that God has millions of wives or not? Did Joseph Smith catch a vision of the eternities and see that the folks there had multiple wives and thought that was the pattern to follow. I can see the wisdom of having only one wife in this dimension, but if we really are living out decision choices in other dimensions, and when the dimensions collapse into a new eternal singular reality, what do we do with all of the wives that we were sealed to, and what do our wives do with all of the husbands they were sealed to. We become an "Eternal Family," so tightly woven that we are bound/sealed all of us to Jesus Christ for eternity.

As for me, all I'm doing is sticking out my head and looking around and saying "how does that idea fit in." In case you're asleep at the wheel, multiple dimensions are picking up steam quicker than any other theory that considers the Universe as a whole. It's not just me.

I guess that makes me a science nut and a mormon nut. But you guys already know that.

[scottie]

Christofferson's The Moral Force of Women talk was edited:

Original: "Some feminist thinkers view homemaking with outright contempt..."
Edited: "Some view homemaking with outright contempt..."

[jay santos]

I am consistently befuddled by the willingness of adults with perfectly functioning brains to subjugate their own thoughts to the opinion of others simply because they have been told that the other persons' opinion is better.

I'm not. Obedience, worship, discipleship, loyalty, trust. These are beautiful human characteristics. The problem is who do we put our trust in? It's easy to say "God!" The hard part is determining exactly what God wants. Is God's wisdom best described by the Old Testament? The Koran? The teachings of Jesus? Paul? Joseph Smith? The current LDS church? Or is it only known on a personal basis? Or does it exist at all?

[jay santos]

Christofferson's The Moral Force of Women talk was edited:

Original: "Some feminist thinkers view homemaking with outright contempt..."
Edited: "Some view homemaking with outright contempt..."

lol, I wonder what this does to his last talk on doctrine. It seems like it throws it all out the window. A junior apostle defining how LDS doctrine is established and then in the next conference he gets his GC talk edited with no explanation.