A new Word of Wisdom

[NorthwestUteFan]

If a person is weary, worn out, cast down, fainting, or dying, a brandy sling, a little wine, or a cup of tea is good to revive them. Do not throw these things away, and say they must never be used; they are good to be used with judgment, prudence, and discretion.

I find this quote highly interesting. Enough said.

p.s. I had an interesting conversation a few years back with a returned Marine who went through some unbelievably difficult circumstances in Iraq. He returned with a wicked case of PTSD, and justifiably so.

He went to the VA hospital and the doc prescribed a bunch of meds for him. He looked into the side effects of said drugs and realized that 5 of them shared one BIG side effect: Suicide.

He decided to skip those meds and went straight to smoking a joint a day, and "Surprise!" his PTSD was cured. When I talked to him about a year later he took ~2-3 per week and seemed to be well adjusted.

[Portland Ute]

In some of my own research I found it interesting that BY got after members for being too strict about the WoW with other members and stated that green tea and brandy/wine are good medicine for the sick...


BY on the WoW in General Conference April 7th, 1867:



My mother will drink hot green tea when she is sick and has as long I have known her. She will also drink iced green tea with sugar when she is down and needs a little energy, like a lot people (members or not) drink a coke. Folks will argue there is a difference, however, if you look into the caffeine that is in a coke is a mostly a by-product of decaffeinated coffee. My daughter, who is a chemical engineer, once tried to explain to me the process of extracting caffeine from coffee. Given the chemicals I am surprised that drinking caffeinated coke doesn't kill people.

That is quite the conference talk. He rambles. He's all over the place. Wow. He also contradicts himself on the WOW. He says it's okay to take a little tea or brandy to pick someone up, but later he says that nobody has the right....

It makes me wonder if he prepared this talk or if he just got up and started talking...

[NorthwestUteFan]

To me he seems to paraphrase, "All things in moderation...".

To "indulge in liquor or other things to our own injury" would be against the spirit of the WoW, but taking a bit with prudence when "weary, worn out, cast down, fainting, or dying..." seems to be OK.

[pellegrino]

To me he seems to paraphrase, "All things in moderation...".

To "indulge in liquor or other things to our own injury" would be against the spirit of the WoW, but taking a bit with prudence when "weary, worn out, cast down, fainting, or dying..." seems to be OK.

but that has nothing to do with the WoW. The phrase isn't even in section 89, or anywhere else in the standard works.

[NorthwestUteFan]

but that has nothing to do with the WoW. The phrase isn't even in section 89, or anywhere else in the standard works.

I said he was paraphrasing, and I referred to the idea itself (and not to a particular scriptural quote). As I recall it is an Aristotelean thought. I would not recommend partaking of Hemlock or Arsenic or cyanide in moderation...

My point is, B.Y. seemed to state that these things are allowable under certain situations and when used with judgement, prudence, and discretion. Were they meant to be strictly verboten he would have stated as such. B.Y. certainly had input on the prairie-crossing rations list KillerDog posted above, and that list included Whisky, black coffee, and/or 'Brigham Tea'.

I am almost certain that you are not a Mullah on this issue. I'll believe it is time to change my sig line.

[Solon]

The other night, my newly-baptized 8 yr old comes up behind me and asks what I'm drinking.
"Dr. Pepper"
"Why are you drinking that?
"Uh...because I like it?"
"It has caffeine in it."
"Son...go to bed."

This one bugs me a little because we've never talked about caffeine in relation to the WOW. My caffeine intake is essentially limited to nightshifts and roadtrips where I'm getting tired, as I don't drink much soda at all. But my wife had bought a 12-pack for some friends who had come over to visit and they had left it untouched, so I treated myself to the wonderful goodness that is Dr. Pepper. So my first question is, where did he get this caffeine connection? And how does he know Dr. Pepper has caffeine in it? I'm suspicious that my MIL was involved, the same one who is 100 lbs overweight and has never walked the two blocks between her home and her work, yet won't touch or allow a drop of caffeine into her house.

But I digress...The deeper point that this has gotten me thinking about is how to teach the WOW to my kids. I feel like I grew up with an unhealthy obsession on rules, and as I'm raising my kids, I've tried to step back and teach them the principles behind the rules, and let them make their own. In relation to the WOW, I think the idea is clear--value and take care of the gift of your body that God has given you. Yet, the practical meaning of this seems to have warped into something entirely different--a sort of litmus test for the "active" Mormon.

So, I present to you my NIV of the WOW, or how I would set it up if (God forbid) I were in charge:
1) Make it a WOW, not by constraint.
2) Keep the ban on alcohol, or at least limit it to persons over say, 25. I know, there is a healthy way to drink alcohol. But there are so many unhealthy ways to do it and the havoc it can wreak on society is tremendous. It's as least as dangerous as MJ (and really, more so--I've NEVER seen anyone die from an overdose of MJ). Additionally, part of "valuing your body" is, in my mind, valuing the clarity of soberness, not just in relation to alcohol, but in relation to all substances whose chief purpose is to alter it. Hence the ban on people under 25--I think this is the age where most stop drinking for a buzz or to get drunk and transition over to a healthy sort of drinking.
3) Keep the ban on cigarettes/cigars/etc. A vile disgusting habit with no redeeming value.
4) Ban illicit drugs, including MJ (sorry Robin). See sobriety point above.
5) Change no coffee, tea, etc to "Eliminate excessive use of caffeine or stimulants". No coffee is just nutty and everyone around us thinks so. They're not admiring it, they're thinking "what the heck does coffee have to do with morality?"
6) Put sugar on the same level as caffeine--eliminate excessive use.
7) Maintain a healthy weight. I'm tempted to suggest in Sunday school some day that we require a BMI under 30 to attend the temple. Ridiculous? Yeah, so is the coffee ban.
8) Daily activity or exercise.
9) Eat plenty of fruits of vegetables.

Any other suggestions?

The Aaronic Priesthood manual claims that drinking tea & coffee can cause poor health and contribute to heart disease.

Is there any medical reason to believe this?

http://www.lds.org/manual/aaronic-priesthood-manual-1/lesson-18-the-word-of-wisdom?lang=eng

[check the table of Avoidances & Consequences]

[UtahDan]

The Aaronic Priesthood manual claims that drinking tea & coffee can cause poor health and contribute to heart disease.

Is there any medical reason to believe this?

http://www.lds.org/manual/aaronic-priesthood-manual-1/lesson-18-the-word-of-wisdom?lang=eng

[check the table of Avoidances & Consequences]

Interesting. Coffee and tea contain "dangerous drugs." If so, aren't people who are up tight about caffeinated soda taking a much more logical approach than the people who roll their eyes at them? God certainly is inscrutable when it comes to what ambiguities he thinks it is helpful to let people grapple with and which things he believes it is important people know what is expected.

[woot]

I think I've mentioned this before, but in the WoW when it says "hot drinks", it literally means drinks that are hot. That was the state of medicine back then. Since this is really embarrassing, the WoW was later "interpreted" to mean coffee and tea, since this allows them to hold to the text without admitting that it was originally intended in a literal sense.

This explains why the restrictions seem so arbitrary. It isn’t officially about the caffeine, but there’s nothing else in coffee and tea that are bad for you, and there are actually some things in both that are good for you. It would make a lot more sense if the church would just narrow it down to caffeinated drinks of any kind, rather than holding on to the current interpretation in which those two specific drinks are bad for some mysterious reason.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I think I've mentioned this before, but in the WoW when it says "hot drinks", it literally means drinks that are hot. That was the state of medicine back then. Since this is really embarrassing, the WoW was later "interpreted" to mean coffee and tea, since this allows them to hold to the text without admitting that it was originally intended in a literal sense.

This explains why the restrictions seem so arbitrary. It isn’t officially about the caffeine, but there’s nothing else in coffee and tea that are bad for you, and there are actually some things in both that are good for you. It would make a lot more sense if the church would just narrow it down to caffeinated drinks of any kind, rather than holding on to the current interpretation in which those two specific drinks are bad for some mysterious reason.

Ah geez, getting more specific is not the answer. Allowing people to approach in the spirit in which it was given is the right approach.

I always thought it was odd that we ignore the "eat meat sparingly" part and the "wheat for man, corn for the ox,..." part (which was clearly based on folklore).

[woot]

Ah geez, getting more specific is not the answer. Allowing people to approach in the spirit in which it was given is the right approach.

I always thought it was odd that we ignore the "eat meat sparingly" part and the "wheat for man, corn for the ox,..." part (which was clearly based on folklore).

Well I would certainly agree that moving it back to being just a word of wisdom and not an absolute commandment would be great, and might even encourage people to read the whole thing instead of just the little bits that have since been turned into commandments. My suggestion was based on the premise that the church is very unlikely to do that.

[Viking]

It amazes me that one of my family members would take her oxycontin through the entire prescription yet rails against my glass of wine every night. no, not haute.

[falafel]

I always thought it was odd that we ignore the "eat meat sparingly" part and the "wheat for man, corn for the ox,..." part (which was clearly based on folklore).

For the past three years or so, our one big EQ activity has been an event called "Meat Madness." We hold it during the second week of March Madness (its actually tonight). We gather at someone's house, watch basketball, and eat nothing but meat. Tri tip, pork loin, salmon, flank steak, buffalo wings, chicken tenders, hotdogs and anything else anyone wants to bring (as long as its meat).

It is be far the most popular event of the year. We get more non-members and inactives to this than any other event. Our Bishop is one hundred percent behind it. But he's going to be released this year and I'm really hoping the next Bishop doesn't see how blatantly we are flaunting the word of wisdom here.

[Donuthole]

For the past three years or so, our one big EQ activity has been an event called "Meat Madness." We hold it during the second week of March Madness (its actually tonight). We gather at someone's house, watch basketball, and eat nothing but meat. Tri tip, pork loin, salmon, flank steak, buffalo wings, chicken tenders, hotdogs and anything else anyone wants to bring (as long as its meat).

It is be far the most popular event of the year. We get more non-members and inactives to this than any other event. Our Bishop is one hundred percent behind it. But he's going to be released this year and I'm really hoping the next Bishop doesn't see how blatantly we are flaunting the word of wisdom here.

Sounds like a real sausage fest.

[Sleeping in EQ]

Ah geez, getting more specific is not the answer. Allowing people to approach in the spirit in which it was given is the right approach.

I always thought it was odd that we ignore the "eat meat sparingly" part and the "wheat for man, corn for the ox,..." part (which was clearly based on folklore).

If memory serves, Lorenzo Snow emphasized "eat meat sparingly." Subsequently, I don't believe that teaching has been emphasized on the general level.

[wuapinmon]

If memory serves, Lorenzo Snow emphasized "eat meat sparingly." Subsequently, I don't believe that teaching has been emphasized on the general level.

Buddhist monks will never buy meat to eat, but they won't refuse it if someone else gives them cooked food with meat in it. That seems more in line with the spirit of section 89 than anything I've ever heard from one of our pulpits.