Is the LDS Church now resigned to its history?

[UtahDan]

Bednar is going to be prophet for a LONG time, so you should start getting used to the idea. But imma glad you're gonna stay in the tent and worship according to the dictates of your mind.

Nik lasting until Bednar might be the most wildly optimistic thing that has ever been uttered on this board, and that is saying something given this is a place where people talk about BYU sports

[Surfah]

Fantastic article.

[Pheidippides]

Nik lasting until Bednar might be the most wildly optimistic thing that has ever been uttered on this board, and that is saying something given this is a place where people talk about BYU sports

Lol.

Actually, it depends on my temper. As long as I can bitch in the background to my wife, I'm okay.

Unless, of course, the Strengthening the Members Committee manages to tie together my real name with my CUF moniker. You know they already have files on all of us.

[UtahDan]

Lol.

Actually, it depends on my temper. As long as I can bitch in the background to my wife, I'm okay.

Unless, of course, the Strengthening the Members Committee manages to tie together my real name with my CUF moniker. You know they already have files on all of us.

They probably do. But I always laugh when I hear people talking about them as though they are a menacing crew of some kind. I would love to see what they look like. I heard a rumor that they are promoted almost exclusively from within CES.

[Moliere]

I maintain that the trifecta of JFieldingS, HBL and BRM were the worst thing to happen to the church in the past century. Add ETB the apostle in there too.

I think BKP is not spry enough to do much damage in the event he outlives TSM, which I don't think he will. But as I told my wife last night I am at a loss when trying to come up with his positive contributions. Maybe opening Japan so I could serve there. I can come up with a laundry list of negatives.

The one that scares me is Bednar. I frankly don't like him at all. I'm past caring too much about what he says, though - Imma worship according to the dictates of my own conscience, let him preach how, where or what he may.

Quinn is actually much less complementary of DOM than his other biographers were. Presents an interesting contrast.

DOM got ran over by ETB for the most part so that's why Quinn paints him that way. DOM didn't ever want to confront anyone. That's why he did stuff without telling the Q12 and that's why he never told anyone no...at least with an audience.

HBL gets negative points obviously for his correlation program, but it's striking how much he reined in ETB. Same with JFS. I'll give them positives for that, although I'll likely not forgive JFS for his ultra-literal doctrinal teachings.

I do love how Quinn shows these people and their struggles. They are men with their own agendas, for the most part, and that knowledge makes it much more easy to listen to them.

[Levin]

Nik lasting until Bednar might be the most wildly optimistic thing that has ever been uttered on this board, and that is saying something given this is a place where people talk about BYU sports

Just because you left doesn't mean all others are equally faint of heart, mind, and spirit.

[Levin]

Lol.

Actually, it depends on my temper. As long as I can bitch in the background to my wife, I'm okay.

Unless, of course, the Strengthening the Members Committee manages to tie together my real name with my CUF moniker. You know they already have files on all of us.

I don't get why you lol'ed at that pathetic pandering and lulling you out of the Church. He would be so pleased, and he does it through flattery and suggestion. The typical tools.

[Pheidippides]

I do love how Quinn shows these people and their struggles. They are men with their own agendas, for the most part, and that knowledge makes it much more easy to listen to them.

I love this too. They are no longer deified ivory tower denizens. They are human with human struggles and understanding. I can relate to that.

I forgot about HBL's countering to ETB. He does get major props for that. I think JFS was not an honest individual given his tenure as church historian, but, then again, we have a long and proud tradition of fabricating the truth to protect the church. Lying for The Lord, as it were.

[Pheidippides]

I don't get why you lol'ed at that pathetic pandering and lulling you out of the Church. He would be so pleased, and he does it through flattery and suggestion. The typical tools.

Because UD and I are friends and we've already discussed this privately. Also, because I'm marginally more self-aware than you might think.

He can start celebrating when I start tipping back cold ones.

[Solon]

Unless, of course, the Strengthening the Members Committee manages to tie together my real name with my CUF moniker. You know they already have files on all of us.

We shouldn't flatter ourselves. Church leadership doesn't give a crap about what any of us writes, whether on internet message boards or in obscure academic journals, whether faithful or not.

We're not on the radar of what they're trying to accomplish.

(I consider this to be be both a good thing and a bad thing.)

[Northwestcoug]

Yes, great article (thanks for the link, Solon).

Definitely agree with your last paragraph. History has vindicated Quinn. If you haven't read his essay "On Being a Mormon Historian", you should definitely check it out. Brilliant analysis and a very courageous statement at the time.

I've heard about that essay, but I can't remember if I've read it. Thanks.

Bednar is going to be prophet for a LONG time, so you should start getting used to the idea. But imma glad you're gonna stay in the tent and worship according to the dictates of your mind.

Funny, my mom used to say the exact same thing about Packer. And they used to say the same thing about Lee.

My recollection is that Packer was very well-liked in the 70's. It was probably his hardling personna that was comforting in light of all the commies and hippies at the time.

[UtahDan]

Just because you left doesn't mean all others are equally faint of heart, mind, and spirit.

You could use a little leavening, Levin.

[UtahDan]

Because UD and I are friends and we've already discussed this privately. Also, because I'm marginally more self-aware than you might think.

He can start celebrating when I start tipping back cold ones.

[Pheidippides]

We shouldn't flatter ourselves. Church leadership doesn't give a crap about what any of us writes, whether on internet message boards or in obscure academic journals, whether faithful or not.

We're not on the radar of what they're trying to accomplish.

(I consider this to be be both a good thing and a bad thing.)

Unfortunately, you are exactly right. Good for me, bad for us.

[pellegrino]

We shouldn't flatter ourselves. Church leadership doesn't give a crap about what any of us writes, whether on internet message boards or in obscure academic journals, whether faithful or not.

We're not on the radar of what they're trying to accomplish.

(I consider this to be be both a good thing and a bad thing.)

what do you think they're trying to accomplish then? Is it more about amassing wealth?