Post tithing settlement thoughts...

[Clark Addison]

you guys are funny. Just don't sign up.

In many wards, you can't just not sign up. You either attend, or you directly tell the Exec Sec "No, I am not scheduling any time", which will probably then be followed up by a bishop's phone call.

[The_Douger]

I just don't sign up. They leave me alone.

[ERCougar]

We got cornered by the executive secretary and spluttered out that 5:00 would be fine before we even knew what we'd done. Our ward has boundary issues in general though.

In many wards, you can't just not sign up. You either attend, or you directly tell the Exec Sec "No, I am not scheduling any time", which will probably then be followed up by a bishop's phone call.

Funny. I haven't signed up since moving to Utah and no one ever days anything. maybe it's a mission field thing.

also, isn't that bishop phone call what we'd all rather have happen anyway?

[DrumNFeather]

I just created all our sign up sheets for my ward for 2012...sign up people!

[Clark Addison]

Funny. I haven't signed up since moving to Utah and no one ever days anything. maybe it's a mission field thing.

also, isn't that bishop phone call what we'd all rather have happen anyway?

The bishop's phone call isn't asking about your tithing, it is asking if you could come in for a visit.

I am just speculating on that part, by the way. We sometimes forget to sign up, but when the Exec Sec calls, we are always happy (or at least willing) to come in. Our bishop REALLY wants to talk to everyone, though.

[CardiacCoug]

Every ward where I have been it's pretty much required, not one of those things they just let slide.

ER your Bishop is just a slacker.

[ERCougar]

Every ward where I have been it's pretty much required, not one of those things they just let slide.

ER your Bishop is just a slacker.

Or progressive. Sounds like he's doing what everyone wishes their bishops would do. But it's not just him. I've had three bishops since I've moved here. I'm 99% sure I haven't been to a single tithing settlement, nor have I been bugged or called about it. I work a fair amount of Sunday's, so maybe they just think I'm busy.

The bishop makes himself available to anyone who wants to meet with him during a busy time of year. Are the ones being harassed really getting anything out of these meetings? The amount of extra work we create for ourselves in this church is really incredible.

[Moliere]

I may have posted this before, but my bishop once had me call ward members that hadn't signed up to see if I could get them to come in. I tried to talk him out of it but ultimately he won out but at least I got his list of people he wanted called to a very select few. Even those phone calls were awkward.

I don't mind attending tithing settlement but I do think its a silly ritual. It's a fun time for the kids to meet and talk with the bishop. It's also a good chance for him to encourage our family or tell us thanks.

[Clark Addison]

Went to tithing settlement today. On the way, my daughter said "Tithing settlement is my least favorite church meeting", so maybe she is ready for CUF. Or maybe she just doesn't like forking over $40 since she hasn't paid in months.

The same daughter raised yet another issue in the ageless net/gross debate. She is a big sushi fan, so it is very common for us to "pay" her for doing chores with a sushi dinner. She wondered if she should be bringing in an Eel Roll and can of Vanilla Coke for her tithing.

Lastly, during the small-talk portion of the meeting, we started talking about games our families liked to play. The bishop mentioned that their favorite game was a card game called "Pounce". Our bishop is VERY conservative, so I was somewhat surprised that he played cards. Maybe this showed on my face, as he clarified that the game can be played with different types of cards, but they use Rook cards. I believe it is generally recognized that Rook cards, along with "Uno" cards, are among the least evil types of cards.

[Moliere]

I believe it is generally recognized that Rook cards, along with "Uno" cards, are among the least evil types of cards.

I know someone that admitted to playing strip UNO. It was that day that I determined face cards weren't all that evil.

[Portland Ute]

As a result of tithing settlement, I had countless hours on my hands to think about church finances.

This was my second time around as the ward financial clerk.

I actually did pull off one night of what I would consider "ideal" tithing settlement.

My bishop had planned for a Thursday night but called me on Monday and said he had to go out of town and wondered if I though we could move it to Tuesday. I said I couldn't be there because of a prior commitment, but that we could print out the statements and give them to the families and then they could give donations they might be interested in giving the following Sunday.

It worked. I spent 5 minutes printing out the statements and gave them to him. People came in and declared a tithe, he gave them a statement and instructed them to contact me if there were any discrepancies. They then turned in any donations as they would any other time of the year...on a Sunday.

Worked perfectly. But, unfortunately, the following week we reverted to the "old", vestigial way of doing things where both the 2nd counselor and myself had to sit around the clerks office twiddling our thumbs and making small talk with ward members for the sole purpose of collecting and depositing money that could have been collected and deposited either the preceding or following Sunday in the 45 minute stretch following Church.

Aside from that singular success, I started thinking about donations.

Our ward, in a year, probably does around 1 million in collections. I'd have to run a report, but it's right around there. For the purpose of my point, it really doesn't matter.

Our ward, in a year, has a $14K budget. Of that a

Difference? Conservatively, $800+K.



Yet, we are continually squeezing water out of a rock for youth and primary activities. When people ask for more in the budge for youth and kids, they are given the standard "Widow's mite" answers.

Now, I know that there are expenditures not in the budget. Welfare, building related costs, mission costs, etc.

I also realize that it costs money for a temple to attend and a for administration of the corporation of the president.

But $800K+?

We hear talk all of the time about how the youth are the single most important resource in the Church.

Yet we "compete" for their time with basically nothing.

Yeah, I've heard the nonsensical argument: "We aren't competing with sports and movies and clubs."

Except you are. Church and "the gospel" are just one of many things competing for a child or teenager's time.

And the Church at large throws basically NOTHING towards these kids in terms of week to week activities or really ANY activities on a local level.

Hell, the budget for the youth in our ward should be over $30K ALONE to have great activities on a weekly and quarterly basis. Do that, and we'd still be sending over $700K to HQ every year.

The Church wonders why it's losing youth and young adults? It's really no surprise, IMO.

I've heard people say you can tell a lot about what is important to an individual by how and where they spend their money. I'd say it's fairly clear that the Church draws near to the Youth with its lips but its purse strings are FAR from them.

Lastly, given the absolute pittance of a budget, I am sickened by the amount of absolute JUNK "gifts" bought (mostly by women's auxiliary presidencies) for teachers, birthdays, parting gifts for activities, Christmas, graduation, outgoing pupils or incoming pupils (Sunday School kids/youth), etc.

I started adding it up, and the RS, YW and Primary have spent close to $1000 dollars on such idiotic "gifts" as soap dispensers, bookmarks, and other assorted nicknacks for just such things.

IMO, if these presidencies and teachers want to "gift" people they work with things, then they ought to be out of their own pockets. The Church shouldn't be paying for the Primary Presidency to give a thank you gift to a teacher that has been released.

That money, IMO, ought to be going to activities, preferably to YM/YW or primary activities.

*whew*

When you are only given

[Northwestcoug]

Hey, those 'gender is an essential characteristic' videos cost a lot of money, you know.

[pellegrino]

As a result of tithing settlement, I had countless hours on my hands to think about church finances.

This was my second time around as the ward financial clerk.

I actually did pull off one night of what I would consider "ideal" tithing settlement.

My bishop had planned for a Thursday night but called me on Monday and said he had to go out of town and wondered if I though we could move it to Tuesday. I said I couldn't be there because of a prior commitment, but that we could print out the statements and give them to the families and then they could give donations they might be interested in giving the following Sunday.

It worked. I spent 5 minutes printing out the statements and gave them to him. People came in and declared a tithe, he gave them a statement and instructed them to contact me if there were any discrepancies. They then turned in any donations as they would any other time of the year...on a Sunday.

Worked perfectly. But, unfortunately, the following week we reverted to the "old", vestigial way of doing things where both the 2nd counselor and myself had to sit around the clerks office twiddling our thumbs and making small talk with ward members for the sole purpose of collecting and depositing money that could have been collected and deposited either the preceding or following Sunday in the 45 minute stretch following Church.

Aside from that singular success, I started thinking about donations.

Our ward, in a year, probably does around 1 million in collections. I'd have to run a report, but it's right around there. For the purpose of my point, it really doesn't matter.

Our ward, in a year, has a $14K budget. Of that a

Difference? Conservatively, $800+K.



Yet, we are continually squeezing water out of a rock for youth and primary activities. When people ask for more in the budge for youth and kids, they are given the standard "Widow's mite" answers.

Now, I know that there are expenditures not in the budget. Welfare, building related costs, mission costs, etc.

I also realize that it costs money for a temple to attend and a for administration of the corporation of the president.

But $800K+?

We hear talk all of the time about how the youth are the single most important resource in the Church.

Yet we "compete" for their time with basically nothing.

Yeah, I've heard the nonsensical argument: "We aren't competing with sports and movies and clubs."

Except you are. Church and "the gospel" are just one of many things competing for a child or teenager's time.

And the Church at large throws basically NOTHING towards these kids in terms of week to week activities or really ANY activities on a local level.

Hell, the budget for the youth in our ward should be over $30K ALONE to have great activities on a weekly and quarterly basis. Do that, and we'd still be sending over $700K to HQ every year.

The Church wonders why it's losing youth and young adults? It's really no surprise, IMO.

I've heard people say you can tell a lot about what is important to an individual by how and where they spend their money. I'd say it's fairly clear that the Church draws near to the Youth with its lips but its purse strings are FAR from them.

Lastly, given the absolute pittance of a budget, I am sickened by the amount of absolute JUNK "gifts" bought (mostly by women's auxiliary presidencies) for teachers, birthdays, parting gifts for activities, Christmas, graduation, outgoing pupils or incoming pupils (Sunday School kids/youth), etc.

I started adding it up, and the RS, YW and Primary have spent close to $1000 dollars on such idiotic "gifts" as soap dispensers, bookmarks, and other assorted nicknacks for just such things.

IMO, if these presidencies and teachers want to "gift" people they work with things, then they ought to be out of their own pockets. The Church shouldn't be paying for the Primary Presidency to give a thank you gift to a teacher that has been released.

That money, IMO, ought to be going to activities, preferably to YM/YW or primary activities.

*whew*

When you are only given

I have it on good authority that the average maintenance costs for a church building is around $40k per year. If wards share the building (don't they have 3 or 4 to a building in some cases?) then obviously they don't foot the full bill for that. The average American ward brings in a lot of cash for the church.

[Bo Diddley]

As a result of tithing settlement, I had countless hours on my hands to think about church finances.

This was my second time around as the ward financial clerk.

I actually did pull off one night of what I would consider "ideal" tithing settlement.

My bishop had planned for a Thursday night but called me on Monday and said he had to go out of town and wondered if I though we could move it to Tuesday. I said I couldn't be there because of a prior commitment, but that we could print out the statements and give them to the families and then they could give donations they might be interested in giving the following Sunday.

It worked. I spent 5 minutes printing out the statements and gave them to him. People came in and declared a tithe, he gave them a statement and instructed them to contact me if there were any discrepancies. They then turned in any donations as they would any other time of the year...on a Sunday.

Worked perfectly. But, unfortunately, the following week we reverted to the "old", vestigial way of doing things where both the 2nd counselor and myself had to sit around the clerks office twiddling our thumbs and making small talk with ward members for the sole purpose of collecting and depositing money that could have been collected and deposited either the preceding or following Sunday in the 45 minute stretch following Church.

Aside from that singular success, I started thinking about donations.

Our ward, in a year, probably does around 1 million in collections. I'd have to run a report, but it's right around there. For the purpose of my point, it really doesn't matter.

Our ward, in a year, has a $14K budget. Of that a

Difference? Conservatively, $800+K.



Yet, we are continually squeezing water out of a rock for youth and primary activities. When people ask for more in the budge for youth and kids, they are given the standard "Widow's mite" answers.

Now, I know that there are expenditures not in the budget. Welfare, building related costs, mission costs, etc.

I also realize that it costs money for a temple to attend and a for administration of the corporation of the president.

But $800K+?

We hear talk all of the time about how the youth are the single most important resource in the Church.

Yet we "compete" for their time with basically nothing.

Yeah, I've heard the nonsensical argument: "We aren't competing with sports and movies and clubs."

Except you are. Church and "the gospel" are just one of many things competing for a child or teenager's time.

And the Church at large throws basically NOTHING towards these kids in terms of week to week activities or really ANY activities on a local level.

Hell, the budget for the youth in our ward should be over $30K ALONE to have great activities on a weekly and quarterly basis. Do that, and we'd still be sending over $700K to HQ every year.

The Church wonders why it's losing youth and young adults? It's really no surprise, IMO.

I've heard people say you can tell a lot about what is important to an individual by how and where they spend their money. I'd say it's fairly clear that the Church draws near to the Youth with its lips but its purse strings are FAR from them.

Lastly, given the absolute pittance of a budget, I am sickened by the amount of absolute JUNK "gifts" bought (mostly by women's auxiliary presidencies) for teachers, birthdays, parting gifts for activities, Christmas, graduation, outgoing pupils or incoming pupils (Sunday School kids/youth), etc.

I started adding it up, and the RS, YW and Primary have spent close to $1000 dollars on such idiotic "gifts" as soap dispensers, bookmarks, and other assorted nicknacks for just such things.

IMO, if these presidencies and teachers want to "gift" people they work with things, then they ought to be out of their own pockets. The Church shouldn't be paying for the Primary Presidency to give a thank you gift to a teacher that has been released.

That money, IMO, ought to be going to activities, preferably to YM/YW or primary activities.

*whew*

When you are only given

Interesting.

I don't think that throwing more money at the youth will change retention though. What would you suggest spending it on that would make a difference?

I don't think that those gifts in the auxillaries are a good use of funds. If I'm ever the Bishop, that's gonna change!

[Moliere]

Interesting.

I don't think that throwing more money at the youth will change retention though. What would you suggest spending it on that would make a difference?

I don't think that those gifts in the auxillaries are a good use of funds. If I'm ever the Bishop, that's gonna change!

We could start with building buildings that are conducive to holding youth type activities. Cramming 3 wards into one building for Wednesday mutual is no fun if there aren't even enough rooms to house the youth.

I've got a whole list of other things but I won't share it now.