No Porn and Corn

[LA Ute]

That's cause he still had all the power; they weren't married yet.

Frankly, if a red blooded american male swore to me that he had never looked at or thought about porn, I would seriously wonder about the level of his libido.

And you would be right to wonder. I'd also wonder if he is just blind.

[Color Me Badd Fan]

I'd say that my experience is fairly unique on this board regarding porn. I hate it and I think the Church talks about it way too damned much, so much so that I wonder how many kids go check it out because of all the attention it gets.

Robin and woot will roll their eyes, but I think that it creates unreal expectations in men, and the constant mentioning creates unreal expectations in women about men. Also, the definition of porn varies among people. My mom thinks that the SI Swimsuit issue is porn. Some people think this photo is porn:

Spoiler for Safe for work, unless you work somewhere pruddish:

Porn is also very instructional, but for me it's kind of like watching MLB or the NFL. I can play baseball, but it doesn't look like that when I get to third base. But, it's still fun to play...way more fun than watching someone else.

Hopefully that really is a spoiler to more provocative photos. Holy mackerel.

[ERCougar]

No one here has anything but anecdotal evidence about this anyway. The stories I have heard (and about which church leaders have spoken at general conference) involve serious problems, not "once in while" porn -- for example, men, married and unmarried, who can't go more than a few waking hours without viewing hard-core pornography; missionaries who sneak away from their companions to go on-line and view the stuff, and so forth.

But those are the more sensational stories. As I understand what we're being taught, I think the bigger problem is spiritual. Porn is very habit-forming, if not addictive, and spiritually deadening. How can the missionary who's never gotten over his porn habit be effective? Isn't that a terrible, avoidable loss for him?

LOL...I provide you with a study (not unique) showing a much higher per-capita paid porn consumption (more than twice the national average) in Utah along with another study suggesting that overstating the problems with pornography actually leads to increased use, and then make the enormous leap to say that maybe the Church's treatment of porn problems is counterproductive. Your response is "no, it isn't" and I'm the one being anecdotal? Cmon LA, you really are too smart for this.

No, there are no controlled studies infallibly demonstrating that membership/activity in the LDS Church leads to increased use of pornography, but I'm just not sure how much closer we can get.

Let's turn the tables. Is there anything suggesting that the "No Porn and Corn" approach works? I wonder how many people went to the meeting and thought "Hmm...Porn is a bad idea? Who knew?"

[LA Ute]

LOL...I provide you with a study (not unique) showing a much higher per-capita paid porn consumption (more than twice the national average) in Utah along with another study suggesting that overstating the problems with pornography actually leads to increased use, and then make the enormous leap to say that maybe the Church's treatment of porn problems is counterproductive. Your response is "no, it isn't" and I'm the one being anecdotal? Cmon LA, you really are too smart for this.

No, there are no controlled studies infallibly demonstrating that membership/activity in the LDS Church leads to increased use of pornography, but I'm just not sure how much closer we can get.

Let's turn the tables. Is there anything suggesting that the "No Porn and Corn" approach works? I wonder how many people went to the meeting and thought "Hmm...Porn is a bad idea? Who knew?"

Sorry, I saw the words "Well, I don't have any studies" in your post and stopped reading your post. You are probably talking about another post? And I think you are pretty smart too.

UPDATE: I dug down and saw your other post about a study that you summarize with, "Sure there are problems with this study...." You want me to take that study seriously?

[Pheidippides]

And you would be right to wonder. I'd also wonder if he is just blind.

I thought that was an indirect side-effect of looking at porn? Now you have me confused - did my mom lie to me?

[ERCougar]

Sorry, I saw the words "Well, I don't have any studies" in your post and stopped reading your post. You are probably talking about another post? And I think you are pretty smart too.

I'll assume you're not being deliberately obtuse here:

http://www.cougaruteforum.com/showpost.php?p=433774&postcount=51

http://www.cougaruteforum.com/showpost.php?p=433879&postcount=72

The point of the anecdotes is to point out that people are actually getting divorced over pornography. Neither of these cases appeared to me to be the extreme use that you're discussing, as they both indicated shock at the discovery. I knew both of these girls fairly well and neither were in any way atypical Mormons; in fact, I'd say one of them was a bit on the liberal side of things. The other comments would suggest these two cases are hardly unusual.

[LA Ute]

I'll assume you're not being deliberately obtuse here:

http://www.cougaruteforum.com/showpost.php?p=433774&postcount=51

http://www.cougaruteforum.com/showpost.php?p=433879&postcount=72

The point of the anecdotes is to point out that people are actually getting divorced over pornography. Neither of these cases appeared to me to be the extreme use that you're discussing, as they both indicated shock at the discovery. I knew both of these girls fairly well and neither were in any way atypical Mormons; in fact, I'd say one of them was a bit on the liberal side of things. The other comments would suggest these two cases are hardly unusual.

I'm kind of done with this thread, but no, I assure you I am not being deliberately obtuse. You are welcome to your point of view that the church is making the problem worse by talking too much about it. I just don't share it and find it pretty sad. I'll try to get to the Univ. of Nevada guy's article later.

[ERCougar]

I'm kind of done with this thread, but no, I assure you I am not being deliberately obtuse. You are welcome to your point of view that the church is making the problem worse by talking too much about it. I just don't share it and find it pretty sad. I'll try to get to the Univ. of Nevada guy's article later.

Me too (done with the thread).

Don't take this the wrong way. I'm only arguing with you because I respect your opinion, which tends to be wise from your many, many years and well thought-out.

[Portland Ute]

Hopefully that really is a spoiler to more provocative photos. Holy mackerel.

I had forgotten about that girl.

She still might be one of the most visually stunning women I have ever seen.

[statman]

statman, was it you that once related that some LDS counselors with Family Services actually prescribed what you essentially described as "tasteful, erotica" to some women to help increase "drive" within married couples?

If it wasn't you, I apologize.

It was me.

Not my marriage, but a friend's.

It didn't help much. They're still technically married, but haven't lived together for about a decade. "For the children" or somesuch...

[PaloAltoCougar]

Our ward bulletin contains an announcement each week about the Pornography Addiction Support Group which meets in room whatever at 7:30 pm each Wednesday. Do you see similar announcements in your locales? Why point out to everyone who happens to be in the building that night as to what's going on in room X?

[statman]

Our ward bulletin contains an announcement each week about the Pornography Addiction Support Group which meets in room whatever at 7:30 pm each Wednesday. Do you see similar announcements in your locales? Why point out to everyone who happens to be in the building that night as to what's going on in room X?

LOL - we had the exact same thing happen in our ward. It appeared one time in our bulletin. The next Sunday in PEC the Bishop commented that maybe he ought to share that information a bit more privately.

[YOhio]

Our ward bulletin contains an announcement each week about the Pornography Addiction Support Group which meets in room whatever at 7:30 pm each Wednesday. Do you see similar announcements in your locales? Why point out to everyone who happens to be in the building that night as to what's going on in room X?

Let the haters hate, PAC. You're bravely addressing a problem and I'm proud of you for it!

[UtahDan]

Me too (done with the thread).

Don't take this the wrong way. I'm only arguing with you because I respect your opinion, which tends to be wise from your many, many years and well thought-out.

Let me pick up a thread of this, just for fun. If repression causes an increase in use, would we also expect Utah to disproportionately consume coffee, tea, alcohol and tobacco? It seems like those would be harder to hide both from a spouse as well as others (can't do it out of the home because someone will see you, can't do it at home because your spouse will know). Maybe there is no good analogy. Can you think of any others?

[BigFatMeanie]

Let me pick up a thread of this, just for fun. If repression causes an increase in use, would we also expect Utah to disproportionately consume coffee, tea, alcohol and tobacco? It seems like those would be harder to hide both from a spouse as well as others (can't do it out of the home because someone will see you, can't do it at home because your spouse will know). Maybe there is no good analogy. Can you think of any others?

A reverse analogy:

Just like we don't expect a family/marriage to be destroyed when a Mormon spouse has an occasional beer, but we do see destroyed families/marriages when said spouse becomes a hardcore alcoholic; we also don't expect a family/marriage to be destroyed when a Mormon spouse looks at pr0n every once in a while, but we do see destroyed families/marriages when said spouse becomes a hardcore pr0naholic.