Rate the newly discovered locket photo purporting to be Joseph Smith.

[All-American]

Mrs. Santos said if he called me to a foreign mission, she would encourage me to go.

This is an underrated post.

[Jeff Lebowski]

The church issues a statement:

https://www.thechurchnews.com/history-revisited/2022-07-22/church-statement-photo-of-joseph-smith-found-in-locket-262534

Interested but cautious. Probably the right approach.

[Pelado]

Not sure why you are suspicious. It says right on the bottom that it is him.

[Color Me Badd Fan]

The death mask and the photo don't totally match. In particular, the painting from 1842 and the death mask match re the cheek bones and lips/mouth, they don't appear as prominent in the photo.

[Uncle Ted]

The death mask and the photo don't totally match. In particular, the painting from 1842 and the death mask match re the cheek bones and lips/mouth, they don't appear as prominent in the photo.

They hired facial recognition experts to compare the daguerreotype to Smith’s death mask. The company reported back that 19 of 21 measured features matched, within a 95% confidence interval.
Another expert compared the daguerreotype’s facial features with those seen in the most famous oil painting of Joseph Smith, noting that the hairline and other features were a match and that both images showed the same “distinctive frown line near the left eyebrow,” the article states.

https://religionnews.com/2022/07/21/...rly-180-years/

Yeah, only 19 of 21 measured features matched and there is a 5% possible that these 19 measured features don't match.

[USUC]

The death mask and the photo don't totally match. In particular, the painting from 1842 and the death mask match re the cheek bones and lips/mouth, they don't appear as prominent in the photo.

To me the mouth is the biggest difference between the two images. The official church paintings certainly have a softer, more boyish(?) appearance. This is what all of us grew up with and any inconsistencies, however small, will seem much greater than they really are. The scene in my mind of JS in Carthage jail as the grizzled guy in the photo is now strange to me.

[tooblue]

To me the mouth is the biggest difference between the two images. The official church paintings certainly have a softer, more boyish(?) appearance. This is what all of us grew up with and any inconsistencies, however small, will seem much greater than they really are. The scene in my mind of JS in Carthage jail as the grizzled guy in the photo is now strange to me.

Portraiture is challenging and it is important to note every portrait regardless the sincerity of artistic intent is a caricature. Every time I see the painted portrait of Joseph Smith I smile. It is lovely, but the aspect of the image that intrigues me most is the mouth and narrowness of the cheeks.

The painted portrait of Joseph is a classic example of how every aspiring artist first learns to draw, let alone paint, the human mouth. No human being truly has that shape of mouth. But perhaps its oddly feminine presentation is by design to soften the image of the Prophet?

The biggest challenge for a portrait artist is first learning to not make every portrait look like themselves, the artist. This happens because our own faces are the faces we know best and that we have seen the most. A contemporary example of portraiture that is meant to be sincere in its intent but fails to convey an accurate likeness of others can be seen in the works by this message boards favorite artist/propagandist: McNaughton.

Every image McNaughton paints of Trump is more a self-portrait than true likeness of the former president and I can’t be sure that isn’t done on purpose. McNaughton’s lack of skill in portraiture is particularly acute when he attempts to paint women and the non-white characters depicted in his paintings. He is quite good at composition and stylistic colour and texture. But the faces he paints are often too cartoonish.

Artist, when they start learning to draw the face almost universally first focus on and learn to draw eyes, and by extension the nose. The mouth is tackled last because it can be very difficult to visually comprehend and in turn render. If the daguerreotype is a true image of Joseph Smith, I can readily see why the individual who painted the portrait ended up defaulting to the novice artist mouth.

The man in the daguerreotype is handsome and masculine. But there is also a gentleness in his gaze. The easiest way to render that gentleness in a painting is to soften and make the mouth narrower. There is a science or math to portraiture. Adept artists understand the measurements but allow for human uniqueness to show through:

portraitmeasurements.jpg

Rembrandt: https://www.nga.gov/collection/art-object-page.79.html

Rockwell: http://www.nrm.org/MT/graphics/TripleSelf.jpg

And for a modern example of more pronounced and wonderfully accurate exaggerations, C. F. Payne: https://www.cfpayne.com/work-1/people

[All-American]

rxdjuxxcr0d91.jpg

Let the photoshopping begin!

Hey Brother Joseph, did you know Utah hasn’t beaten BYU in over 1000 days?

[Northwestcoug]

https://religionnews.com/2022/07/21/...rly-180-years/

Yeah, only 19 of 21 measured features matched and there is a 5% possible that these 19 measured features don't match.

we would all do well to have a very healthy dose of skepticism with any forensic discipline. Most forensics fields tend to have many cheerleaders in the field. It is a constant challenge to stay objective. And the lay press can also place too much faith in it. It’s a bad cycle.

[Jeff Lebowski]

we would all do well to have a very healthy dose of skepticism with any forensic discipline. Most forensics fields tend to have many cheerleaders in the field. It is a constant challenge to stay objective. And the lay press can also place too much faith in it. It’s a bad cycle.

[Northwestcoug]

I’ll remember all you gullible people when it turns out to be a pick of Hyrum.

[Bo Diddley]

I’ll remember all you gullible people when it turns out to be a pick of Hyrum.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I’ll remember all you gullible people when it turns out to be a pick of Hyrum.

Funny you think we needed that lecture, given the context.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Portraiture is challenging and it is important to note every portrait regardless the sincerity of artistic intent is a caricature. Every time I see the painted portrait of Joseph Smith I smile. It is lovely, but the aspect of the image that intrigues me most is the mouth and narrowness of the cheeks.

The painted portrait of Joseph is a classic example of how every aspiring artist first learns to draw, let alone paint, the human mouth. No human being truly has that shape of mouth. But perhaps its oddly feminine presentation is by design to soften the image of the Prophet?

The biggest challenge for a portrait artist is first learning to not make every portrait look like themselves, the artist. This happens because our own faces are the faces we know best and that we have seen the most. A contemporary example of portraiture that is meant to be sincere in its intent but fails to convey an accurate likeness of others can be seen in the works by this message boards favorite artist/propagandist: McNaughton.

Every image McNaughton paints of Trump is more a self-portrait than true likeness of the former president and I can’t be sure that isn’t done on purpose. McNaughton’s lack of skill in portraiture is particularly acute when he attempts to paint women and the non-white characters depicted in his paintings. He is quite good at composition and stylistic colour and texture. But the faces he paints are often too cartoonish.

Artist, when they start learning to draw the face almost universally first focus on and learn to draw eyes, and by extension the nose. The mouth is tackled last because it can be very difficult to visually comprehend and in turn render. If the daguerreotype is a true image of Joseph Smith, I can readily see why the individual who painted the portrait ended up defaulting to the novice artist mouth.

The man in the daguerreotype is handsome and masculine. But there is also a gentleness in his gaze. The easiest way to render that gentleness in a painting is to soften and make the mouth narrower. There is a science or math to portraiture. Adept artists understand the measurements but allow for human uniqueness to show through:

portraitmeasurements.jpg

Rembrandt: https://www.nga.gov/collection/art-object-page.79.html

Rockwell: http://www.nrm.org/MT/graphics/TripleSelf.jpg

And for a modern example of more pronounced and wonderfully accurate exaggerations, C. F. Payne: https://www.cfpayne.com/work-1/people

Excellent post, tooblue.

I have read that experts have been critical of the painting due to anatomical issues, etc. Thank you for articulating why.

[PaloAltoCougar]

Excellent post, tooblue.

I have read that experts have been critical of the painting due to anatomical issues, etc. Thank you for articulating why.

Agreed, that was very interesting.