"Reports of my death have been greatly exaggerated" - The Rivalry Thread

[Jeff Lebowski]

He's a petty little man.

Very appropriate.

In case anyone wonders why ute fans on twitter behave the way they do and are so universally loathed, here is your answer. It starts right at the top.

[USUC]

Ute fans have been complaining this has been taken out of context of his full statement. But this whole thing was in response to a simple question about how he feels about the rivalry being back on again. He is so childish, petty, and vapid, that was the response to a simple straightforward question.

[Shaka]

I thought the response was just as straightforward as the question. He merely stated that he expects realignment to rear its ugly head in the next few years and it's possible BYU and Utah will be separated. I happen to agree with him. I also think it's possible that BYU could advance while Utah gets left behind. It's also possible they both end up in one of the big two conferences.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I thought the response was just as straightforward as the question. He merely stated that he expects realignment to rear its ugly head in the next few years and it's possible BYU and Utah will be separated. I happen to agree with him. I also think it's possible that BYU could advance while Utah gets left behind. It's also possible they both end up in one of the big two conferences.

Come on. The realignment part could be 100% true but that was still a really dumb way to answer the question. And he clearly implied that he sees the B12 as an unfortunate detour on to what they truly deserve.

[Applejack]

I thought the response was just as straightforward as the question. He merely stated that he expects realignment to rear its ugly head in the next few years and it's possible BYU and Utah will be separated. I happen to agree with him. I also think it's possible that BYU could advance while Utah gets left behind. It's also possible they both end up in one of the big two conferences.

You pious and petty little man!

[falafel]

Come on. The realignment part could be 100% true but that was still a really dumb way to answer the question. And he clearly implied that he sees the B12 as an unfortunate detour on to what they truly deserve.

The funny thing is, if significant realignment does happen again in the next 5 years, BYU and Utah are likely to both be left on the sidelines. Whether we'll be in the same shitty conference or different shitty conferences is the question. There's no BYU or Utah to the SEC/B1G.

[Pelado]

The funny thing is, if significant realignment does happen again in the next 5 years, BYU and Utah are likely to both be left on the sidelines. Whether we'll be in the same shitty conference or different shitty conferences is the question. There's no BYU or Utah to the SEC/B1G.

Pretty much.

[MartyFunkhouser]

I thought the response was just as straightforward as the question. He merely stated that he expects realignment to rear its ugly head in the next few years and it's possible BYU and Utah will be separated. I happen to agree with him. I also think it's possible that BYU could advance while Utah gets left behind. It's also possible they both end up in one of the big two conferences.

I don't think BYU advances. BYU's best chance to move on when it becomes the P2 is to stop the institutions discrimination against LGBTQ people. I don't see that happening. BYU was held back from the P5, while being financially viable, for more than a decade because of their discrimination. They got in because the Big-12 was desperate at the time. If there wasn't that level of desperation, they wouldn't have been willing to take on BYU's baggage. I don't see BYU offering enough financial advantages to either the B1G or the SEC to accept them.

By the way, I don't expect Utah to advance either.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I don't think BYU advances. BYU's best chance to move on when it becomes the P2 is to stop the institutions discrimination against LGBTQ people. I don't see that happening. BYU was held back from the P5, while being financially viable, for more than a decade because of their discrimination. They got in because the Big-12 was desperate at the time. If there wasn't that level of desperation, they wouldn't have been willing to take on BYU's baggage. I don't see BYU offering enough financial advantages to either the B1G or the SEC to accept them.

By the way, I don't expect Utah to advance either.

How is that woke-centric realignment logic working out for you P12 folks?

[MartyFunkhouser]

How is that woke-centric realignment logic working out for you P12 folks?

I notice that you didn't address BYU's discrimination. Can we go ahead and agree that BYU discriminates?

The Pac-12 died because of horrible leadership and a series of terrible choices. Standing against BYU's discrimination is not one of those decisions that led to the concern dying. I also wouldn't call it being "woke" to be against discrimination.

[Shaka]

I don't think BYU advances. BYU's best chance to move on when it becomes the P2 is to stop the institutions discrimination against LGBTQ people. I don't see that happening. BYU was held back from the P5, while being financially viable, for more than a decade because of their discrimination. They got in because the Big-12 was desperate at the time. If there wasn't that level of desperation, they wouldn't have been willing to take on BYU's baggage. I don't see BYU offering enough financial advantages to either the B1G or the SEC to accept them.

By the way, I don't expect Utah to advance either.

I actually lean towards neither advancing. I don't think the LGBTQ stuff is going to matter that much.

[Shaka]

You pious and petty little man!

Petty yes. Pious? The jury is out.

Definitely not little except my small mind.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I notice that you didn't address BYU's discrimination. Can we go ahead and agree that BYU discriminates?

The Pac-12 died because of horrible leadership and a series of terrible choices. Standing against BYU's discrimination is not one of those decisions that led to the concern dying. I also wouldn't call it being "woke" to be against discrimination.

Labeling BYU's policies as "discrimination" and saying it should have impact on athletic programs is as woke as it gets. And stop kidding yourself, it is exactly this kind of decision-making that led to the demise of the P12.

[MartyFunkhouser]

Labeling BYU's policies as "discrimination" and saying it should have impact on athletic programs is as woke as it gets. And stop kidding yourself, it is exactly this kind of decision-making that led to the demise of the P12.

BYU has stated policies that treat LGBTQ people differently than heterosexual people. A married gay student is violating the honor code. A gay student that is in a romantic relationship is violating the honor code. The same is not true on either of these for heterosexual students. How exactly is that not discrimination? I didn't say it should have an impact, I said it will have an impact.

How was it "woke thinking" that led to Larry Scott not partnering on the Pac-12 network?
How was it "woke thinking" that led to turning down a $30 million dollar offer from ESPN and countering with $50 million.

Because those are the types of things that killed the Pac-12, not choosing to not invite BYU because they believe that BYU's discrimination is morally wrong.

[Omaha 680]

I notice that you didn't address BYU's discrimination. Can we go ahead and agree that BYU discriminates?

The Pac-12 died because of horrible leadership and a series of terrible choices. Standing against BYU's discrimination is not one of those decisions that led to the concern dying. I also wouldn't call it being "woke" to be against discrimination.

You're kidding right? You can say excluding BYU was a principled stand and that's fine. But to say it wasn't significant contributor to the conditions that led to extinction is crazy. If the PAC 12 would have invited BYU at any time before Oklahoma and Texas left the Big 12, the Big 12 would have folded and the PAC would have absorbed their pick of the remnants. But because they didn't invite the opposite happened.