The Big 12 expansion groundswell

[TripletDaddy]

Does BYU want to be part of a conference that tolerates this type of anti-social behavior?

http://msn.foxsports.com/collegefoot...atorade-051012

Two West Virginia football players were arrested for stealing Doritos, pretzels and Gatorade from a gas station near the Morgantown campus.

Also, judging by their wish list, it seems that WVU has instituted Oregon's off-season herbal training regimen.

[Flystripper]

Will fan interest hold up when BYU goes .500 in conference play? And its worth mentioning that Baylor just went on 3-years probabtion for recruiting violations while trying to compete in the Big 12.

Will fan interest hold up while beating the left over dregs of the WAC while playing for nothing?

Will fan interest hold up while playing around .500 with a big 12 schedule?

Fans won't like either but which do you think they would prefer? A win over Idaho at home every year or a chance to beat Texas at home every other year?

[Pelado]

Will fan interest hold up while beating the left over dregs of the WAC while playing for nothing?

Will fan interest hold up while playing around .500 with a big 12 schedule?

Fans won't like either but which do you think they would prefer? A win over Idaho at home every year or a chance to beat Texas at home every other year?

...

[Flystripper]

...

yeah yeah it would depend on division alignments so it might be every few years. I would still take an old Big 12 north schedule (which I think is very winnable for BYU) over beating Idaho ever year and playing for nothing

[Flystripper]

...

My post above assumes to understand your ellipse but why don't you explain?

[Pelado]

My post above assumes to understand your ellipse but why don't you explain?

I have no desire to play/beat a schedule of Idahos every year. Where's the fun in that? The most exciting game for me in the recent past was when we faced Oklahoma. I was not expecting a win, which made the victory that much better. I don't want to think about what would have to happen before I'd have similar excitement over a game against Idaho.

I want to have a good mix on the schedule every year. Big 12 membership would provide that mix since there would usually be a combination of top and middling teams in conference. Independence can theoretically also provide that mix, though the application of the theory to practice seems to be disproving the theory so far.

[Flystripper]

I have no desire to play/beat a schedule of Idahos every year. Where's the fun in that? The most exciting game for me in the recent past was when we faced Oklahoma. I was not expecting a win, which made the victory that much better. I don't want to think about what would have to happen before I'd have similar excitement over a game against Idaho.

I want to have a good mix on the schedule every year. Big 12 membership would provide that mix since there would usually be a combination of top and middling teams in conference. Independence can theoretically also provide that mix, though the application of the theory to practice seems to be disproving the theory so far.

I think we agree. I don't understand the notion that PW was referring to in his post where he wonders if fan interest interest could be sustained while struggling in the Big 12. Everything I have heard suggests that fan interest is waning while independent and we have only been at it for one year. What will years 2-5 bring?

[TripletDaddy]

Just in case anyone wanted an update, as of about an hour ago, Florida State and Clemson are back in the driver's seat.

http://www.operationsports.com/MMChr...f-the-big-xii/

So now, with all of that logic aside...is something afoot?

Personally, I say yes. The pressure to keep up with the Joneses (aka their neighbors in the SEC) for schools like Clemson and FSU is going to very possibly push them into a move just to keep up with facilities and recruiting appeal of their SEC neighbors.

Right now the Big XII has five schools on their radar if you believe the rumor mill (and really, it's been right approximately half of the time it wasn't wrong). Those schools are Florida State, Clemson, Georgia Tech, Maryland, and Notre Dame.

From everything you can read, Florida State and Clemson are going to make the move this summer, fan sentiment (at least online) can be described as rather warm to such an idea...of course I also read dinosaurs are still alive in America today so the internet seems dubious as a place to trust at times.

[YOhio]

Just in case anyone wanted an update, as of about an hour ago, Florida State and Clemson are back in the driver's seat.

http://www.operationsports.com/MMChr...f-the-big-xii/

Good info. Thank you for posting.

[Pelado]

I think we agree. I don't understand the notion that PW was referring to in his post where he wonders if fan interest interest could be sustained while struggling in the Big 12. Everything I have heard suggests that fan interest is waning while independent and we have only been at it for one year. What will years 2-5 bring?

If anything, struggling in the Big 12 would make the occasional conference championship more enjoyable.

[BYUMizzou]

I think we agree. I don't understand the notion that PW was referring to in his post where he wonders if fan interest interest could be sustained while struggling in the Big 12. Everything I have heard suggests that fan interest is waning while independent and we have only been at it for one year. What will years 2-5 bring?

I can't believe people are STILL debating whether or not the B12 is better than Independence. By all standards, unless having the easiest possible schedule is a rational standard, the B12 beats independence hands down. I don't recall ever seeing anyone claim that independence would be better long term than the B12.

You would have to believe that the people charged with running a major university have cognitive skills that are at least equal to or greater than random internet message board posters, particularly when it comes to evaluating the sports program of that university.

Based on that assumption, you have to believe that if there was a reasonable way to get into the B12, we would be in it already, or, if a reasonable way to get invited becomes available, the BYU administration will pursue it.

Then again, there are those people who you find on the interwebs who believe we were offered a spot in the B12, but also believe TH/Samuelson or the BOT have zero capacity to evaluate things rationally and turned the B12 down.

[lambdacoug]

Just in case anyone wanted an update, as of about an hour ago, Florida State and Clemson are back in the driver's seat.

http://www.operationsports.com/MMChr...f-the-big-xii/

I particularly liked:

if you believe the rumor mill (and really, it's been right approximately half of the time it wasn't wrong

So, if it's right 1/2 the time it isn't wrong, what about the other 1/2 the time it isn't wrong?

[TripletDaddy]

I particularly liked:

So, if it's right 1/2 the time it isn't wrong, what about the other 1/2 the time it isn't wrong?

What about this one

One lesson we've learned when it comes to conference realignment in the past two summers is simple: when there's smoke there's fire, just don't believe everything you hear until you do.

[DapperDan]

What about this one

I'm listening for the smoke.

[Paperback Writer]

I think we agree. I don't understand the notion that PW was referring to in his post where he wonders if fan interest interest could be sustained while struggling in the Big 12. Everything I have heard suggests that fan interest is waning while independent and we have only been at it for one year. What will years 2-5 bring?

Allow me to explain. Since Lavell Edwards, BYU has never been in a conference where it was not one of the better programs. Fan expectations are that the Cougars will win 10 games. I suspect (but could be wrong) that many fans view double-digit wins and a Bowl game as a successful season.

So what happens when BYU joins the Big 12 and starts posting records like in 2003-04 when it had a greater number of quality games on the schedule (GT, Notre Dame, Stanford, USC, Boise St)? Will fans be content with 4-8 and 5-6 seasons? Will they be saying to themselves that it was great to see an eventual national champion USC play despite losing by four touchdowns? Or will they pine for those easy wins against Idaho and New Mexico St.?

I'm not sure which scenario would be worse: beating up patsies or losing to quality teams. Neither is particulary good for fan interest but fans generally like winning as opposed to losing.