The Big 12 expansion groundswell

[tooblue]

Yeah, it sucks that they get the ten year head start and will be able to keep their lead. Oh well. If BYU is good at anything, it's winning the long race even when it stumbles out the gate.

Seems inevitable. Oh well, welcome to the Utes. If I remember correctly, in the last match up BYU ended the game in the victory formation. So much for that head start.

[tooblue]

Hey Applejack and SeattleUte ... Welcome to the truck stop conference. Leave the Bree and baguettes at home. Pepperettes, Funyuns, Snickers and pop are on me if y'all pay for the gas.

[MartyFunkhouser]

I'm glad the Utes avoided extinction for now. Condolences to all here that had their hopes and dreams of Utah's death shattered.

It will be fun to have the holy war restored in its full glory.

[Bo Diddley]

I'm glad the Utes avoided extinction for now. Condolences to all here that had their hopes and dreams of Utah's death shattered.

It will be fun to have the holy war restored in its full glory.

I think it just has to get nastier, tbh.

[Uncle Ted]

Someone recently shared internal rankings by the B1G and Stanford was in the third tier. With Utah. It’s time to abandon this dumb pretext that academics are the driver in this stuff. They added Oregon for heavens sake.

Yeah, from an academic prospective Oregon is almost as bad as Nebraska.

[All-American]

I think it just has to get nastier, tbh.

And I’m here for it.

[Northwestcoug]

My daughter just texted us that she’s sad her favorite ‘Ute/Rose Bowl’ sweatshirts won’t be sold in the bookstore anymore.

[falafel]

My daughter just texted us that she’s sad her favorite ‘Ute/Rose Bowl’ sweatshirts won’t be sold in the bookstore anymore.

Lol @ NWC’s kid!

[Paperback Writer]

The discussion regarding the haves vs the have nots is flawed in that there's an implication that the Big 10 is somehow on equal footing with the SEC. While this may be true with regard to money and the big media markets in the upper midwest + Philly and now LA, it's not true with the regard to the product on the field. Even with adding LA, the Big 10 is at an enormous disadvantage vs the SEC where virtually its entirely footprint is loaded with talent. Outside of Ohio State, there are six SEC programs with more success than every other Big 10 team in the past 15 years -- Alabama, Georgia, LSU, Auburn, Florida and Oklahoma.

From the 2000s on, the Big 10 has a losing record against the Pac 12, Big 12 and SEC, combined and separately. They're 133-170. While these numbers may shift with USC moving, I don't think they'll shift as much as people think. For example, Nebraksa's record against the Big 10 while they were in the Big 12 was 1- 7.

I would argue that the SEC taking on Texas is a bigger deal competitively than the Big 10 taking on USC, even given the fact they already had aTm in the conference. I don't think the Big 10 is going to be that much better than the Big 12 competitively, they still lack access to recruiting. Ohio State will continue to be able to recruit nationally and Oregon and USC will continue loading up on SoCal recruits. Other than Oregon and USC, everything else stays the same. Losing Texas and Oklahoma is huge, of course, but that's more of a benefit to the SEC. Not every 4 star kid in Texas can, or wants to start for Oklahoma and Texas. Either the programs will be down or more commonly these kids will want to go where they can play. I don't know if the kids who decided to go to TCU wouldn't have gone there had Oklahoma and Texas already been in the SEC, I suspect they would have gone to TCU regardless. But they were good enough to get TCU to the playoffs, beat Michigan and then get their asses kicked against Georgia.

I just don't know how much this shifts things competitively -- there's a much, much wider gap between the old WAC/MWC vs the BCS conference than there is between the Big 12 and Big 10. Perhaps the gap is growing wider between the Big 12 and SEC, but I suspect there is enough talent in Texas not going to Texas, Oklahoma or aTm and in the other Big 12 states to produce some decent teams.

Minor correction: While in the Big 12, Nebraska was 7-1 (not 1-7) against B1G teams losing only to Penn State, a disastrous road game for the Huskers. Not that it changes your argument that the B1G has struggled in OOC games. Nebraska's struggles of the past two decades certainly has not helped the B1G's national profile.

As far as recruiting in Texas, most B1G teams have been doing that for decades. As you point out, there is only so much talent that UT, OU, and aTm can sign and not every prep player wants to go to those schools. But one of the reasons the SEC embraced aTm was to gain better access to Texas recruits and now they have UT in their conference. In other words, the Big12 faces an uphill battle with singing Texas recruits because the SEC now has a greater presence and teams like Michgan and Nebraska have always recruited in Texas. I think the Big12 schools will continue to get their fair share since there is a lot of prep talent in Texas (I've got a front row seat to it).

Lastly, I have a different view of the gap between the B12 and B1G but there have been so many changes it is hard to predict. Time will tell. I do think the talent gap is closing between "name" schools and "underdogs". The transfer portal is huge and a leveler since players can go where they can play and are needed.

[myboynoah]

Nice that BYU played its part.

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[Pelado]

In other words, the Big12 faces an uphill battle with singing Texas recruits because the SEC now has a greater presence and teams like Michgan and Nebraska have always recruited in Texas.

Wouldn't BYU have an advantage with these musically-inclined players? Tunnel singing could finally help bring in some Texas talent!

[old_gregg]

I have litigated many deals gone bad. The deal process is often the heart of the case, the facts I must master. Settlements often involve a new deal.

seattleute, master of the deal! a regular marty lipton.

[BlueK]

Nice that BYU played its part.

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Interesting because a few years ago it was popular to say someday there would be the 16 x 4. Suddenly it just happened and BYU made the cut.

[SeattleUte]

BYU fans' misery at Utah's seamless transition is funny. JL: "Utah faces extinction." Haha.

Two good things. Utah is in the best basketball conference in the country. And Basketball is the best sport. The Big 12 looks a lot better in every way with the Four Corner schools.

BYU fans hard wired to believe what they want to believe.

[Uncle Ted]

BYU fans' misery at Utah's seamless transition is funny. JL: "Utah faces extinction." Haha.

Two good things. Utah is in the best basketball conference in the country. And Basketball is the best sport. The Big 12 looks a lot better in every way with the Four Corner schools.

BYU fans hard wired to believe what they want to believe.

I actually feel bad for Ute fans…. It’s going to cost them a fortune to have all those PAC 12 tattoos removed.