The Big 12 expansion groundswell

[Paperback Writer]

BYU's board would never approve Sunday play. Never. They would give women the priesthood and let gays marry in the temple before they allowed Sunday play by BYU.

I would expect no less from BFM. I bet you gave the same answer my Dad replied with those many years ago when I stated that it was OK for me to play Pop Warner football on Sundays because Merlin Olsen was playing for the Rams on the Sabbath.

[SeattleUte]

No joke. Memphis is a freaking mess. They have a shorter history of winning games than any team in the country, have zero facilities, and could quickly become a lead anchor for a conference. UConn's football sucks but their b-ball makes up for it in spades.

Come on. UConn in the Big 12 is the joke. Geography and culture still matters. If UConn is going to the Big 12, UT might as well go to the Pac 12. UConn will never be in the Big 12. That's as unlikely as BYU in the Big 12.

[Commando]

Come on. UConn in the Big 12 is the joke. Geography and culture still matters. If UConn is going to the Big 12, UT might as well go to the Pac 12. UConn will never be in the Big 12. That's as unlikely as BYU in the Big 12.

Dunno bout that. They put WVU in the Big 12.

[SeattleUte]

Dunno bout that. They put WVU in the Big 12.

Worlds apart from Connecticut.

[BigFatMeanie]

I would expect no less from BFM. I bet you gave the same answer my Dad replied with those many years ago when I stated that it was OK for me to play Pop Warner football on Sundays because Merlin Olsen was playing for the Rams on the Sabbath.

LOL. If my son had the chance to play in the NFL I would tell him to pray about it and if he felt it was right, to go for it.

What I think and do on behalf of me and my family, and what the BYU BOTs think and do on behalf of BYU, are two different things.

[All-American]

Worlds apart from Connecticut.

And the rest of the conference.

[outlier]

Despite living in Norman, I don't have any big insider information, just a lot of impressions of David Boren, the OU community, and the OU fan base. Given that, and given his particularly great political skills, it's not hard for me to imagine that Boren's statements have been intended as a way to eventually scapegoat Texas when OU bolts for the SEC. I've only been here two years and I'm in a relatively research-strong department at OU, but I don't get the impression that the university is trying super hard to increase its research standing. Further, I've been surprised while living here just how southern Oklahoma feels culturally. Everyone's polite, no one says what they're thinking, etc. Further, OU has, in the past, had good relationships with Texas A&M (Boren and Robert Gates were apparently pretty close when Boren was on the Senate Intelligence Committee). Arkansas is a team that, regionally, makes a lot of sense for OU as a potential rival.

Anyway. Boren's a very honorable guy, excellent speaker (for what it's worth), but he's looking out for Oklahoma (as opposed to trying to make the college football world a fairer, better place) and will make pragmatic decisions that furthers the OU cause. Given that, it's hard to imagine Oklahoma is in a better position in an expanded Big XII that includes two more schools that no one else is exactly fighting over. Therefore, I don't necessarily believe that he's pro-expansion because he wants OU in an expanded (potentially watered-down) Big XII. It's also not unreasonable that he wants to expand the conference, see what the lay of the land looks like post-expansion, and bolt (to the SEC) from there.

WRT BYU, then, I still think folks should probably be a little more circumspect about whether Big XII membership is necessarily in our best interest. Sans OU (and maybe sans OSU and/or Texas), the Big XII is still an interesting conference, but if you take OU/OSU out and replace them with Memphis/UConn -- eh.

o

PS, It would kill me to be working at an SEC school. That happens, I'm back on the job market.

[San Juan Sun]

Dunno bout that. They put WVU in the Big 12.

And they put Utah in the Pac.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Despite living in Norman, I don't have any big insider information, just a lot of impressions of David Boren, the OU community, and the OU fan base. Given that, and given his particularly great political skills, it's not hard for me to imagine that Boren's statements have been intended as a way to eventually scapegoat Texas when OU bolts for the SEC. I've only been here two years and I'm in a relatively research-strong department at OU, but I don't get the impression that the university is trying super hard to increase its research standing. Further, I've been surprised while living here just how southern Oklahoma feels culturally. Everyone's polite, no one says what they're thinking, etc. Further, OU has, in the past, had good relationships with Texas A&M (Boren and Robert Gates were apparently pretty close when Boren was on the Senate Intelligence Committee). Arkansas is a team that, regionally, makes a lot of sense for OU as a potential rival.

Anyway. Boren's a very honorable guy, excellent speaker (for what it's worth), but he's looking out for Oklahoma (as opposed to trying to make the college football world a fairer, better place) and will make pragmatic decisions that furthers the OU cause. Given that, it's hard to imagine Oklahoma is in a better position in an expanded Big XII that includes two more schools that no one else is exactly fighting over. Therefore, I don't necessarily believe that he's pro-expansion because he wants OU in an expanded (potentially watered-down) Big XII. It's also not unreasonable that he wants to expand the conference, see what the lay of the land looks like post-expansion, and bolt (to the SEC) from there.

WRT BYU, then, I still think folks should probably be a little more circumspect about whether Big XII membership is necessarily in our best interest. Sans OU (and maybe sans OSU and/or Texas), the Big XII is still an interesting conference, but if you take OU/OSU out and replace them with Memphis/UConn -- eh.

o

PS, It would kill me to be working at an SEC school. That happens, I'm back on the job market.

Not following your logic. OU is pushing for expansion in order to bolt to the SEC? Huh?

[New Mexican Disaster]

Not following your logic. OU is pushing for expansion in order to bolt to the SEC? Huh?

I think he means to cover thir bases.

[Paperback Writer]

Despite living in Norman, I don't have any big insider information, just a lot of impressions of David Boren, the OU community, and the OU fan base. Given that, and given his particularly great political skills, it's not hard for me to imagine that Boren's statements have been intended as a way to eventually scapegoat Texas when OU bolts for the SEC. I've only been here two years and I'm in a relatively research-strong department at OU, but I don't get the impression that the university is trying super hard to increase its research standing. Further, I've been surprised while living here just how southern Oklahoma feels culturally. Everyone's polite, no one says what they're thinking, etc. Further, OU has, in the past, had good relationships with Texas A&M (Boren and Robert Gates were apparently pretty close when Boren was on the Senate Intelligence Committee). Arkansas is a team that, regionally, makes a lot of sense for OU as a potential rival.

Anyway. Boren's a very honorable guy, excellent speaker (for what it's worth), but he's looking out for Oklahoma (as opposed to trying to make the college football world a fairer, better place) and will make pragmatic decisions that furthers the OU cause. Given that, it's hard to imagine Oklahoma is in a better position in an expanded Big XII that includes two more schools that no one else is exactly fighting over. Therefore, I don't necessarily believe that he's pro-expansion because he wants OU in an expanded (potentially watered-down) Big XII. It's also not unreasonable that he wants to expand the conference, see what the lay of the land looks like post-expansion, and bolt (to the SEC) from there.

WRT BYU, then, I still think folks should probably be a little more circumspect about whether Big XII membership is necessarily in our best interest. Sans OU (and maybe sans OSU and/or Texas), the Big XII is still an interesting conference, but if you take OU/OSU out and replace them with Memphis/UConn -- eh.

o

PS, It would kill me to be working at an SEC school. That happens, I'm back on the job market.

I would be very surprised if OU cut the cord with UT. However, I was somewhat surprised when A&M did so. I grew up in Lincoln in the glory days of the Big 8 when OU and Nebraska were winning national titles. From a Cornhusker fan standpoint, the Sooners were our rival. That October game in Dallas every year was just a regional thing - to win the Big 8 and be in position to win another national championship, the Sooners had to defeat the Cornhuskers in November and vice versa. Then with the formation of the Big 12, I began to realize that Texas, not Nebraska, was really OU's rival and probably always had been. I watched as Texas and OU consolidated power in the Big 12 and swung it's axis from Kansas City to Dallas. That shift made it much easier for Nebraska to bolt to the Big Ten when the Big 12 looked to be very shaky.

So I would be rather astonished if OU joined the SEC - it would mean the demise of the Big 12. UT would either join the PAC-12 or the Big Ten or go independent. But I do understand the point you are making. OU could very well be much better off in the SEC than the Big 12. I don't think A&M misses the Big 12 much and it would give the Sooners another game in Texas with A&M-OU. Nevertheless, I think Boren is sincere in wanting the Big 12 to expand and be more competitive in relation to other conferences. Boren should know that BYU would probably rank in the upper half of the Big 12 by almost any measure. The more difficult parts of expansion is finding another team along with BYU and establishing a Big 12 network. If Boren is not serious about making these changes in the Big 12, why doesn't he just shepherd OU into the SEC along with Okie St?

[Jeff Lebowski]

Yeah, they could go from being a big dog with an excellent chance of winning the conference every year to having to fight for their lives for relevance. Makes perfect sense!

[Paperback Writer]

Yeah, they could go from being a big dog with an excellent chance of winning the conference every year to having to fight for their lives for relevance. Makes perfect sense!

At present, I think Oklahoma would challenge Alabama in the SEC. A tougher road, for sure, in the SEC than the Big-12 but OU wouldn't be fighting for their lives in the SEC.

[Jeff Lebowski]

At present, I think Oklahoma would challenge Alabama in the SEC. A tougher road, for sure, in the SEC than the Big-12 but OU wouldn't be fighting for their lives in the SEC.

Figure of speech, creekster.

Whatever, they wouldn't be top dogs like they are now.

[BlueK]

I don't think A&M misses the Big 12 much and it would give the Sooners another game in Texas with A&M-OU.

I know a lot of A&M fans. They don't miss the Big 12 even a little. They hate the B12 and couldn't be happier to have gotten away from Texas. A good comparison would be that they think of the Big 12 the way BYU fans think of the MWC, and Texas to them is how we feel about Craig Thompson. I have to explain to some of them why BYU would even consider wanting to join the Big 12. They get it after I explain it, but their hatred means they have to work at trying to understand why anyone would want to have any part of what they consider to be a very dysfunctional league they couldn't wait to get away from.