"You Gotta Love It Baby" Official Jazz thread

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

Leave it to SMR to pick apart the top prospects as opposed to break down how they would fit in. Glass half empty guy.

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This whole thread is a cluster F. We Jazz fans are supposed to cheer for them to lose, then also complain about the coach for losing. Rapidly becoming the Clippers from their beginning until about last year.

[smokymountainrain]

Leave it to SMR to pick apart the top prospects as opposed to break down how they would fit in. Glass half empty guy.

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I'll make up for it by raving about these guys all season long. What they did against good competition last night, is ridiculously impressive. Exceeded what seemed like unrealistic expectations to begin with. I absolutely love their games.

[smokymountainrain]

This whole thread is a cluster F. We Jazz fans are supposed to cheer for them to lose, then also complain about the coach for losing. Rapidly becoming the Clippers from their beginning until about last year.

Then we have HFN's contributions to the thread which are always a beacon of positivity.

[Maximus]

This whole thread is a cluster F. We Jazz fans are supposed to cheer for them to lose, then also complain about the coach for losing. Rapidly becoming the Clippers from their beginning until about last year.

im glad we are losing, but our young players are missing out on learning from a real coach.

[MarkGrace]

Wiggins had that nice step back near the end of the game but maybe that was more midrange than perimeter. But yeah, just about everything came on slashes, transition, etc. His fluidity and explosion are ridiculous though. Cj was making fun of vitale for hyping his dunk on that break, but to have a 6'8" guy right on your heels and trying to come up over the top on you near and still be able glide through the dunk is not nearly as easy as he made it look.

Parker's skills are way ahead of wiggins but obviously not the athlete. I do think he has more athleticism in him if he can lean up his body some. He's 30 pounds heavier than wiggins at the same height and age, and while wiggins needs more weight I still think jabari could stand to shed some. At 18 he should be more in the 215-220 range. He needs an nba nutritionist and trainer.

Randle is a friggin beast. He's got glimpses of so many people in his game. In addition to all the guys mentioned, he's got a little z-bo in him with the really nice touch for a big frame. But he also has some serious nasty and aggression to him, much more so than either parker or wiggins. I like that. And speaking of that, I'm not counting out smart yet in the top 3 discussion. Kid has much of the same mentality at the guard spot. He's got a lot of dwade in him and is probably already a better shooter.

[MarkGrace]

Utah's veterans make Pelton's biggest disappointments so far.

Utah's veterans

Granted, expectations weren't high for the likes of Richard Jefferson, John Lucas III and Jamaal Tinsley, but they've been unable to meet them. As Per Diem colleague Tom Haberstroh noted on Twitter, as of Tuesday, all three players were at the very bottom of the NBA leaderboard in estimated wins added, the win-based version of PER. WARP is slightly kinder, though not by much: They've combined for minus-1.1 WARP, undermining the decent play of the Jazz's young core.

Utah waived Tinsley on Tuesday and might replace him with Diante Garrett, according to Marc Stein. Still, things won't really get better until the Jazz get healthy. The return of rookie Trey Burke will ultimately push Lucas to a more appropriate reserve role, and Brandon Rush and Marvin Williams should eat into Jefferson's 25 minutes per game once they're back at full strength.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/story...isappointments

[MarkGrace]

btw, Wiggins looks like a baby compared to the other two. I know he reclassified and jumped a year, but he's still 18 and most of these top prospects are usually of the man-child variety. That kid still looks young.

[smokymountainrain]

Randle is a friggin beast. He's got glimpses of so many people in his game. In addition to all the guys mentioned, he's got a little z-bo in him with the really nice touch for a big frame. But he also has some serious nasty and aggression to him, much more so than either parker or wiggins. I like that. And speaking of that, I'm not counting out smart yet in the top 3 discussion. Kid has much of the same mentality at the guard spot. He's got a lot of dwade in him and is probably already a better shooter.

In my comments, I was nitpicky on all three guys, but to play the size card on Randle was a stretch, even for a negative nelly like me. Randle just doesn't have much to pick at - his demeanor on the court was particularly impressive in addition to his God-given talent. In the first half, he had every reason to get flustered, but never let it happen. Then he came out in the 2nd half and absolutely demanded the basketball, decided he was better than everybody else and it was over from there - he wasn't going to be denied. Guys that have elite physical skills and ability and elite mental toughness just don't come along every year. By the end of the year, riggin for Wiggins may just turn in to scandal for Randle - or something like that.

[Applejack]

Leave it to SMR to pick apart the top prospects as opposed to break down how they would fit in. Glass half empty guy.

He's hoping to tank for Doug McDermott.

[smokymountainrain]

He's hoping to tank for Doug McDermott.

BGR mentioned the idea of a Webber/Penny type trade where the Jazz get #1 and trade Wiggins, for say, Randle at #3 and pick up another 1st along the way. I'd sprout wood if they could pull something like that off and get McDermott in the middle of the first round.

[MarkGrace]

And now the moment Eddie has been waiting for, a look at assist opportunities. G-Time currently third among non-PG's behind Bron and Ellis.
http://stats.nba.com/playerTrackingP...&sortOrder=DES

This stuff is pretty great and I like some of the new categories. Not to be a dork, but I've always sat around during certain games and wondered what assist totals would look like on nights when teammates weren't making shots, or on plays when a guy sets up an open teammate only to have that guy get fouled and not register an assist (assuming he doesn't make the basket of course). I also really love the "secondary assist" category. I remember watching Ridnour a lot when I first got to Seattle and he was the master of this. He'd break a defense down with his quickness, kick out to the perimeter, the ball would move one time, and then someone would knock down a shot. Rid wouldn't get the assist, the guy in between would, but he did the major work and deserved some credit. So secondary assists picks this up. All in all there's a very comprehensive look at passing on that page.

[MarkGrace]

BGR mentioned the idea of a Webber/Penny type trade where the Jazz get #1 and trade Wiggins, for say, Randle at #3 and pick up another 1st along the way. I'd sprout wood if they could pull something like that off and get McDermott in the middle of the first round.

They'll be able to get him with the GSW pick. That's who Ford projected in his first mock.

[Donuthole]

And now the moment Eddie has been waiting for, a look at assist opportunities. G-Time currently third among non-PG's behind Bron and Ellis.
http://stats.nba.com/playerTrackingP...&sortOrder=DES

This stuff is pretty great and I like some of the new categories. Not to be a dork, but I've always sat around at wondered what assist totals would look like on nights when teammates weren't making shots, or on plays when a guy sets up an open teammate only to have that guy get fouled and not register an assist (assuming he doesn't make the basket of course). I also really love the "secondary assist" category. I remember watching Ridnour a lot when I first got to Seattle and he was the master of this. He'd break a defense down with his quickness, kick out to the perimeter, the ball would move one time, and then someone would knock down a shot. Rid wouldn't get the assist, the guy in between would, but he did the major work and deserved some credit. So secondary assists picks this up. All in all there's a very comprehensive look at passing on that page.

I remember as a young stat-tracking kid wishing Stock got credit for every time he passed to Malone and Malone then got fouled while shooting. At the time I thought he should get a half-assist for each FT made by Malone.

[smokymountainrain]

I remember as a young stat-tracking kid wishing Stock got credit for every time he passed to Malone and Malone then got fouled while shooting. At the time I thought he should get a half-assist for each FT made by Malone.

Similarly, I think a guy should get maybe .5 of a block when a shot is blocked on a shooting foul, just for ending any possibility of a three point play.

[Applejack]

BGR mentioned the idea of a Webber/Penny type trade where the Jazz get #1 and trade Wiggins, for say, Randle at #3 and pick up another 1st along the way. I'd sprout wood if they could pull something like that off and get McDermott in the middle of the first round.

I don't think Randle is going to be around at 3. Jabari seems like a #3 pick to me. Refined game, NBA body, good but not elite athleticism. If you are drafting 1 or 2, you want the homerun, franchise changer. Randle and Wiggins (to a lesser extent) have those upsides.