2010-11 BYU Basketball Thread

[SeattleUte]

What do you think about BYU 's roster? Utah's roster?

Utah's roster:

A hope and a prayer. I'm told a couple of those JUCO recruits are hotshots. I'm waiting to be convinced. They didn't seem to be heavily recruited by great schools, except maybe Watkins, and that came late. Watkins and Clyburn need to step right in and make an impact, like some of those New Mexico JUCOS over the years. A hope and a prayer.

I'm still very upset about the mass exodus last year. Panic JUCO pick ups is no way to build a program. At least Kupits and Demaria were obviously panic pick ups. But I'm still hopeful that Hines, Washburn, Glover, O'Brien, Giuot, Olson and Lee can become good if not all-conference caliber players. It's possible that Boylen just got caught with a bad mix last year, and too much youth due to past recruiting debacles by his predecessor. I hope and pray. (The original Watkins would be a solid role player on a Majerus team.)

As for BYU, I think BYU will continue to be a slightly better version of Air Force in its best years. As we saw the past year, the BYU culture and HC really put a glass ceiling on the program. This situation is compounded now that BYU's basketball program is in a little league. Jimmer will continue to be the class of the league. But absent Loyd, last year would have been materially worse for BYU (for one thing it wouldn't have beaten Florida), and he's gone now. I wonder how much the rest of the players, including Jimmer, can improve, and BYU lost another key player to a mission. It seems BYU will still be soft inside. I'm not really expecting any championships or NCAA wins from this team. But Coach Rose keeps making silk purses out of sow's ears. That kid he signed from Virginia is his first true national recruit, and some kids who have contributed including Jimmer and Loyd were largely ignored when recruited.

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

drewjay
Perhaps biggest news from BYU hoops media day is that freshman guard Anson Winder had knee surgery recently, won't be 100 percent

[MarkGrace]

Bring on Martineau!

[cougjunkie]

Quest for Perfection in basketball!!!!!

Jackson Emery said their goal is to go undefeated and win all of their games.

Ute fans please put some spin on this. So I can tell you why your team sucks because unlike BYU they do not expect to win every game.

[KillerDog]

Utah's roster:

But I'm still hopeful that Hines, Washburn, Glover, O'Brien, Giuot, Olson and Lee can become good if not all-conference caliber players.

As for BYU, I think BYU will continue to be a slightly better version of Air Force in its best years.

I'm not really expecting any championships or NCAA wins from this team. But Coach Rose keeps making silk purses out of sow's ears.

That kid he signed from Virginia is his first true national recruit, and some kids who have contributed including Jimmer and Loyd were largely ignored when recruited.

I like Glover and Washburn. Both can really play. Hines has potential. I can't tell on Guiot, depends on development.

BYU will be a slightly better version of Air Force? That's a stupid comment and you know it. There is nothing similar about the teams or programs unless you are referring to their racial mix in which case, you should be ashamed. You're better than that.

I don't know what to expect from BYU's team. Teams with legitimate NBA guards tend to win a lot of games, particularly crucial games. Teams with good coaching also tend to win a lot of games. BYU has both this year. They lack some components from last year but have added some interesting pieces. I think it depends on the development of the two Collinsworths and the ability of Rogers to contribute.

I assume you are referring to Harrison who is from South Carolina. He is not the first "national recruit" Rose has landed but I can see why you would discount a local product that had national offers. I too am excited by Harrison. I think he is an unusual player to be at BYU.

All in all, as much as I love Boylen, I think he has taken a huge gamble by cleaning house. I hope it works for him. I really like his coaching style. I think the U will probably be in the bottom half of a 4 bid league this year. They could be the first of the non NCAA teams out of the MWC. They could also be last but I think Boylen is too good of a coach and their talent level is too high for that to happen.

I think BYU is looking at anywhere from 1-3 in the league. Most likely first or second in the regular season. I also expect they will win another NCAA game. Now that they have gotten the mental block removed, they will win more easily. They've been beating themselves for years.

[Blueintheface]

Quest for Perfection in basketball!!!!!

Jackson Emery said their goal is to go undefeated and win all of their games.

Ute fans please put some spin on this. So I can tell you why your team sucks because unlike BYU they do not expect to win every game.

Hey, not just Jackson. Sounded like Rose said or at least insinuated the same thing or at the very least acknowledged that the team had it as an goal.

The burning question I have is will this statement and the statute of limitations on his health be reason enough for Classy Ute fans everywhere to start referring to him as Porky Pig again?

[SeattleUte]

I like Glover and Washburn. Both can really play. Hines has potential. I can't tell on Guiot, depends on development.

BYU will be a slightly better version of Air Force? That's a stupid comment and you know it. There is nothing similar about the teams or programs unless you are referring to their racial mix in which case, you should be ashamed. You're better than that.

I don't know what to expect from BYU's team. Teams with legitimate NBA guards tend to win a lot of games, particularly crucial games. Teams with good coaching also tend to win a lot of games. BYU has both this year. They lack some components from last year but have added some interesting pieces. I think it depends on the development of the two Collinsworths and the ability of Rogers to contribute.

I assume you are referring to Harrison who is from South Carolina. He is not the first "national recruit" Rose has landed but I can see why you would discount a local product that had national offers. I too am excited by Harrison. I think he is an unusual player to be at BYU.

All in all, as much as I love Boylen, I think he has taken a huge gamble by cleaning house. I hope it works for him. I really like his coaching style. I think the U will probably be in the bottom half of a 4 bid league this year. They could be the first of the non NCAA teams out of the MWC. They could also be last but I think Boylen is too good of a coach and their talent level is too high for that to happen.

I think BYU is looking at anywhere from 1-3 in the league. Most likely first or second in the regular season. I also expect they will win another NCAA game. Now that they have gotten the mental block removed, they will win more easily. They've been beating themselves for years.

Of course I meant Air Force at its best, as I explicitly stated. Demonstrably, BYU has not accomplished any more than those good Air Force taems, so I don't know why you should take umbrudge. I don't pay attention to racial compositions. I understand BYU has had AA's though. I would be surprised if AF has none.

I liken the two schools because they both are constrained by peculariar missions and attendant commitments extracted from players. This both generates a natural recruiting base and erects barriers to recruitment around the natrual basae. The programs both live and die by the quality of the grape crop in any given year. Both programs for whatever reason tend to lose some steam late in the year after setting the world on fire early on.

[Goatnapper'96]

I liken the two schools because they both are constrained by peculariar missions and attendant commitments extracted from players. This both generates a natural recruiting base and erects barriers to recruitment around the natrual basae. The programs both live and die by the quality of the grape crop in any given year. Both programs for whatever reason tend to lose some steam late in the year after setting the world on fire early on.

I think you offer very balanced and informed opinions. I know I am probably in the minority, but I appreciate it when you feel inspired to spout off!

[Jacob]

BYU will be a slightly better version of Air Force? That's a stupid comment and you know it. There is nothing similar about the teams or programs unless you are referring to their racial mix in which case, you should be ashamed. You're better than that.

I thought you were pretty familiar with this forum. Guess not.

[Goatnapper'96]

I like Glover and Washburn. Both can really play. Hines has potential. I can't tell on Guiot, depends on development.

BYU will be a slightly better version of Air Force? That's a stupid comment and you know it. There is nothing similar about the teams or programs unless you are referring to their racial mix in which case, you should be ashamed. You're better than that.

I don't know what to expect from BYU's team. Teams with legitimate NBA guards tend to win a lot of games, particularly crucial games. Teams with good coaching also tend to win a lot of games. BYU has both this year. They lack some components from last year but have added some interesting pieces. I think it depends on the development of the two Collinsworths and the ability of Rogers to contribute.

I assume you are referring to Harrison who is from South Carolina. He is not the first "national recruit" Rose has landed but I can see why you would discount a local product that had national offers. I too am excited by Harrison. I think he is an unusual player to be at BYU.

All in all, as much as I love Boylen, I think he has taken a huge gamble by cleaning house. I hope it works for him. I really like his coaching style. I think the U will probably be in the bottom half of a 4 bid league this year. They could be the first of the non NCAA teams out of the MWC. They could also be last but I think Boylen is too good of a coach and their talent level is too high for that to happen.

I think BYU is looking at anywhere from 1-3 in the league. Most likely first or second in the regular season. I also expect they will win another NCAA game. Now that they have gotten the mental block removed, they will win more easily. They've been beating themselves for years.

Whether or not BYU improves significantly is driven by one factor, IMO: Brandon Davies. I think BYU knows what it will get from Noah. He will improve incrementally, but he will be pretty much what he was last year.

Now, I for one thought BYU was pretty damn good last year and if not for an unfortunate sickness would have made the second week of the tournament. I think the loss of Lloyd will hurt, but a 100% Jimmer Fredette all year makes for a better team IMO.

If Brandon Davies improves offensively and is a reliable post scorer, BYU will kill teams. Kill them. If BD does not improve offensively to that point, BYU will play a lot of Collinsworth and Hartsock and while the post defense won't be as good as last year the rebounding will improve.

I am not expecting much from Rodgers but a spot up role player off the bench.

[KillerDog]

Demonstrably, BYU has not accomplished any more than those good Air Force taems, so I don't know why you should take umbrudge.

The reason I take umbrage is this:

AFA NCAA tournament appearances -- 1960, 1962, 2004, 2006
AFA NIT Tournament appearances -- 2007
AFA Conference Championships -- 2004 Regular Season
AFA NCAA Tournament Victories -- 0

BYU NCAA Tournament appearances -- 1950, 1951, 1957, 1965, 1969, 1971, 1972, 1979, 1980, 1981, 1984, 1987, 1988, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1995, 2001, 2003, 2004, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010
BYU NIT Championships (not appearances) -- 1951 and 1966
BYU Conference Championships -- 1919, 1922, 1924, 1925, 1932, 1933, 1934, 1943, 1948, 1950, 1951, 1957, 1965, 1967, 1969, 1971, 1972, 1979, 1980, 1983, 1988, 1990, 1992, 1993, 2001, 2003, 2007, 2008, 2009
BYU NCAA Tournament Victories -- 12

I agree with you that BYU and AFA have some similar difficulties but the scales are different enough to make your statement idiotic. We might as well compare Utah's and BYU's basketball histories and act like they are the same because both schools have recruiting difficulties because of their locations in Utah.

The best of the AFA teams never won an NCAA victory. The best of the BYU teams went to the elite eight or won an NIT championship in the NIT glory years. Slightly above is a touch inaccurate.

[KillerDog]

Whether or not BYU improves significantly is driven by one factor, IMO: Brandon Davies. I think BYU knows what it will get from Noah. He will improve incrementally, but he will be pretty much what he was last year.

If Brandon Davies improves offensively and is a reliable post scorer, BYU will kill teams. Kill them. If BD does not improve offensively to that point, BYU will play a lot of Collinsworth and Hartsock and while the post defense won't be as good as last year the rebounding will improve.

I am not expecting much from Rodgers but a spot up role player off the bench.

While I agree that Noah will be about the same guy, I think Davies ability to guard is more important to the team's development than his ability to score. I think he can score and showed last year that given touches he could put the ball in the hoop. He didn't show he could consistently guard. If he has learned to guard, we could improve considerably.

Collinsworth is big and active but didn't post up well in either his freshman year of in high school. I think he will defend at the 5 and play offense at the 4. His offensive rebounding should be helpful. His length and activity could also help us to play more zone defensively which would help Jimmer and Davies.

Rogers can shoot. I agree with your take on his role. The key to him helping the team is that he is a 6'7" guy who can shoot on a spread team. He lets us stretch the floor offensively with defensive size.

I think K. Collinsworth will be a critical player. We know that Abuou was only slightly behind Haws last year so we shouldn't have a drop off there. If K. Collinsworth can truly provide back-up minutes at 1-3 we should be talented and deep at all 5 spots with size and speed mixes that create good matchups.

[SeattleUte]

The reason I take umbrage is this:

AFA NCAA tournament appearances -- 1960, 1962, 2004, 2006
AFA NIT Tournament appearances -- 2007
AFA Conference Championships -- 2004 Regular Season
AFA NCAA Tournament Victories -- 0

BYU NCAA Tournament appearances -- 1950, 1951, 1957, 1965, 1969, 1971, 1972, 1979, 1980, 1981, 1984, 1987, 1988, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1995, 2001, 2003, 2004, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010
BYU NIT Championships (not appearances) -- 1951 and 1966
BYU Conference Championships -- 1919, 1922, 1924, 1925, 1932, 1933, 1934, 1943, 1948, 1950, 1951, 1957, 1965, 1967, 1969, 1971, 1972, 1979, 1980, 1983, 1988, 1990, 1992, 1993, 2001, 2003, 2007, 2008, 2009
BYU NCAA Tournament Victories -- 12

I agree with you that BYU and AFA have some similar difficulties but the scales are different enough to make your statement idiotic. We might as well compare Utah's and BYU's basketball histories and act like they are the same because both schools have recruiting difficulties because of their locations in Utah.

The best of the AFA teams never won an NCAA victory. The best of the BYU teams went to the elite eight or won an NIT championship in the NIT glory years. Slightly above is a touch inaccurate.

I wasn't thinking about ancient history. You know, it's possible to draw striking comparisons between Athens and New York City, if you go back far enough in time.

[Surfah]

I wasn't thinking about ancient history. You know, it's possible to draw striking comparisons between Athens and New York City, if you go back far enough in time.

Then look at the recent history and your comparison is still stupid.

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

Here is the Official Reading Way Too Much Into One Practice Post. My thoughts from observing the open practice for a little over 2 hours.

Jimmer - nothing new to say.

Emery - I think it might be easier to appreciate what an incredible athlete he is in a setting like that. I wish he was a little more effective getting lift off one leg, but when he really explodes off two it is fun to watch. I can verify that the team does in fact practice with all perimeter players on a pump fake at the three line, one dribble with the off hand, and then pulling up from 17 feet. We'll see if Emery can incorporate that with any increased frequency this year.

Davies - upper body looks noticeably bigger. Appreciated how hard he worked on defense on the 1on1 low post drills. Didn't really get a chance to show much else.

Hartsock - body looks unchanged. Is in love with a fadeaway jumper from the post. Seeing him go to that over and over again during practice kind of made me ill. With his high release point on his shot, why not reverse pivot and just shoot over the top of a guy? Going to be far better than fading away from the hoop when you are already starting 8 feet away. Couldn't tell if his lower body has gotten stronger so he can hold individual post position better on defense...to me that was the key to the off-season for him.

Abouo - looked strong and athletic. Needs to get to the rim a lot.

Rogers - the best practice shooter out there. His form looks identical on each jumper. Could earn himself huge minutes if he can prove adequate on the glass. Also showed some nice instincts blocking shots on defense. If he plays against 6'3" scout team players all year I think that'd matter. Was the only player that had a coach really get after him...Rice let him have it when he screwed up and didn't know what play was being run.

C. Collinsworth - maybe the most impressive player of the day. Was the only big that stood out at all. Looks to have put on significant weight from his freshman season. It was very good to see how well he was getting up and down the court. Wouldn't be surprised in the least to see him lead the team in rebounding, and he'll be the best individual defender on the block. I would assume that he'll also show the most improvement from this point through the season, both in conditioning and skill. Free throw shooting was rough. His shots looked soft, but it seemed like he was just trying to get a soft shot up on the rim in hopes it'd bounce in.

K. Collinsworth - looked just like he did at PHS...always in control, makes you think he's playing way too slow, but then he makes plays. The way he plays maybe also makes you discount his athleticism, but he'll make a play here or there that reminds you. The three is just too long for him to be consistent right now. His FT shooting was atrocious. I fully expected to show up and see he had worked on that all summer. I'm really hoping now that he didn't work on that all summer. Winder didn't get a single look at PG, so it will be KC or Martineau.

Martineau - handles the ball well, can shoot, will really struggle to make plays against decent D-I defensive talent. I came away more impressed with him than I thought I would.

Anderson - another big that didn't change his body at all during the off-season. Still looks like a 14 year old who just had a huge growth spurt and isn't quite sure how to make his body work yet. Is very deliberate on the block. I think it is clear that he decides what he is going to do with the ball instead of feeling/reading the defense.

Winder - seemed a bit overwhelmed early on, but settled down and got aggressive. I wish he was taller than Martineau than he really is...he's clearly not 6'3". But he does have really long arms. Jump shot was all over the place. It's early, but he really stood off to himself a lot when not in on the drills. Contrast that with KC who knows so many of the players already, and Rogers that was talking strategy with Jimmer or Emery on the side.

Magnusson - he is who we thought he was.

Zylstra - noticed more mistakes from him than anyone else, whether it was losing his guy on defense, messing up a drill, or not transitioning from defense to offense quickly enough. Pressing because he thinks he might be able to earn time? Or just not focused enough?

Overall - really surprised at how quiet the practice was. I expected more pushing and chatter from the players, trying to motivate one another during drills, especially when the drills were done in a team-type situation. I haven't been to a Rose-coached practice before, and maybe they are always just very workmanlike.