To take a break here and discuss Utah hoops...

[SeattleUte]

I have never seen Ute fans defend a tied regular seasonMWC championship, MWC tourney championship and a first round beatdown in the NCAA tourney with such gusto!

When did Steve Cleveland become successful in the eyes of Utenation? I thought most Ute fans enjoyed getting their asses handed to them in the regular season because it ensured not getting beat in the first round of the NCAA tourney.

The difference between what BYU accomplished this year and Utah accomplished last year is debatable, at most wafer thin each way. You're the one who's deluded. In fact, you're an idiot.

[PaloAltoCougar]

This guy cracks me up. I wish he posted here. He's a total Ute coach gad fly, and very knowledgeable and witty. He started posting on Utefans after Giacoletti was hired over Kerry Rupp. We used to think he was Rupp.

http://www.utefans.net/message.php?i...#message978298

Is there some Utefan who knows him and can invite him here?

I think he and Comrade Crimson are pretty close; perhaps Mr. C can fellowship him here.

[Goatnapper'96]

The difference between what BYU accomplished this year and Utah accomplished last year is debatable, at most wafer thin each way. You're the one who's deluded. In fact, you're an idiot.

I don't think you answered the question, when did Steve Cleveland suddenly become so successful in the eyes of Utenation?

[Mr. Crimson]

I think he and Comrade Crimson are pretty close; perhaps Mr. C can fellowship him here.

That's not even funny. In fact I may hate you now.

[Mr. Crimson]

I don't think you answered the question, when did Steve Cleveland suddenly become so successful in the eyes of Utenation?

We he was successful in a Ron McBride kind of way.

[MartyFunkhouser]

The difference between what BYU accomplished this year and Utah accomplished last year is debatable, at most wafer thin each way. You're the one who's deluded. In fact, you're an idiot.

BYU got an NCAA victory this year. What BYU accomplished this year is certainly better than what Utah accomplished last year.

[Flattop]

I have never seen Ute fans defend a tied regular seasonMWC championship, MWC tourney championship and a first round beatdown in the NCAA tourney with such gusto!

When did Steve Cleveland become successful in the eyes of Utenation? I thought most Ute fans enjoyed getting their asses handed to them in the regular season because it ensured not getting beat in the first round of the NCAA tourney.

It's ironic in a way. I remember when Utah beat BYU in the conference tournament in Giacoletti's second season and a Coug fan suggested the win made it a great season in spite of the 14-15 record. I responded with a litany that claimed a good season was advancing to the second round of the NCAA and that a conference championship with a first round exit was only "pretty good."

Maybe that's why so many Ute fans turned on Boylen after the loss to Arizona last year.

So why have I been defending Boylen if he hasn't measured up to what I once considered to be a good season? It was my impression, at least, that Utah basketball was in a very big hole when Boylen was hired. I figured that it would take more than three years to get the Runnin' Utes back to where it had been before it's decline began under Majerus and accelerated under Giacoletti.

I didn't expect to win a conference title last year, much less make it to the NCAA. I thought the next step would be an NIT bid. But Boylen exceeded my expectations by winning a share of the regular season title and the conference tournament. While by the old standard this was only "pretty good," it was a big step in the right direction. Silly me, I thought that should have earned a boatload of goodwill for Boylen from Ute fans.

While some Ute fans were already fantasizing about hiring Tommy Connor as the next coach, I was arguing for low expectations coming into this season. With the loss of four key players, who scored 70% of the points, I figured that we should have known this was going to be a tough season, and that we should have known that Boylen still had a lot of hard work to do.

Boylen was basically starting over, after turning the players he inherited into conference champions, and Utah basketball still wasn't out of that big hole. This season proved to be tougher than I expected, but I think we've got to stick with Boylen for at least another year, maybe two.

[Flattop]

Pretty good = NCAA 1st round
Good = NCAA 2nd round
Very good = Sweet 16
Great = Elite 8
Fantastic = Final Four

[Flattop]

BYU got an NCAA victory this year. What BYU accomplished this year is certainly better than what Utah accomplished last year.

Congrats to BYU, you finally had a good season.

[MartyFunkhouser]

So why have I been defending Boylen if he hasn't measured up to what I once considered to be a good season? It was my impression, at least, that Utah basketball was in a very big hole when Boylen was hired. I figured that it would take more than three years to get the Runnin' Utes back to where it had been before it's decline began under Majerus and accelerated under Giacoletti.

I didn't expect to win a conference title last year, much less make it to the NCAA. I thought the next step would be an NIT bid. But Boylen exceeded my expectations by winning a share of the regular season title and the conference tournament. While by the old standard this was only "pretty good," it was a big step in the right direction. Silly me, I thought that should have earned a boatload of goodwill for Boylen from Ute fans.

While some Ute fans were already fantasizing about hiring Tommy Connor as the next coach, I was arguing for low expectations coming into this season. With the loss of four key players, who scored 70% of the points, I figured that we should have known this was going to be a tough season, and that we should have known that Boylen still had a lot of hard work to do.

Boylen was basically starting over, after turning the players he inherited into conference champions, and Utah basketball still wasn't out of that big hole. This season proved to be tougher than I expected, but I think we've got to stick with Boylen for at least another year, maybe two.

I agree that we have to stick with Boylen for at least another year and that he had a lot of problems when he came to Utah. I agree that low expectations were to be expected this year because of the number of young players that were being relied on. However, he has one more year to fix the mess that he inherited. One or two impact players is all it really takes to turn things around in college hoops and it is Boylen's job to make that happen. He doesn't need more than 4 years to turn Utah around he needs 3-4 years.

I'm skeptical of Boylen's ability to turn things around because of the huge misses in his recruiting. He hasn't really brought in a single player to be excited about. Plus, his development of wing players is extremely suspect, although he does do a great job developing post players. I hope that Boylen is the coach for Utah, but I'm still in the wait and see mode.

[SeattleUte]

BYU got an NCAA victory this year. What BYU accomplished this year is certainly better than what Utah accomplished last year.

BYU didn't win the conference anything. I think it's close. The conference counts for a lot. BYU only beat a team that was one of the last in.

[Flattop]

BYU didn't win the conference anything. I think it's close. The conference counts for a lot. BYU only beat a team that was one of the last in.

Winning the conference means definitly getting an NCAA bid.

[MartyFunkhouser]

BYU didn't win the conference anything. I think it's close. The conference counts for a lot. BYU only beat a team that was one of the last in.

Winning in the tournament is more important than a conference championship. Conference championships are nice, but the NCAA tournament success is most important. Give me a 2nd or 3rd place conference finish with a tournament win any day over a 1 and done with a conference championship.

[Flattop]

I'm skeptical of Boylen's ability to turn things around because of the huge misses in his recruiting. He hasn't really brought in a single player to be excited about. Plus, his development of wing players is extremely suspect, although he does do a great job developing post players. I hope that Boylen is the coach for Utah, but I'm still in the wait and see mode.

I'm not saying there aren't questions or areas of concern.

I also think a lot is going to depend on the development of Foster and Washburn.

[SeattleUte]

Winning in the tournament is more important than a conference championship. Conference championships are nice, but the NCAA tournament success is most important. Give me a 2nd or 3rd place conference finish with a tournament win any day over a 1 and done with a conference championship.

So Kansas State has aleady had a bigger year than Kansas?