BYU vs Utah hoops game...........

[Indy Coug]

I'm mystified by the level of reaction to this whole Emery/Henderson thing. It was a very minor incident and didn't have any effect on the outcome of the game and there were no postgame comments that I saw from players or coaches to feed the fire.

Yawn.

[Art Vandelay]

• I love Marshall Henderson's intensity and talent. He is going to be the player BYU fans hate for the next three years.

I have missed having a Ute I really, really, really dislike. Henderson meets all the criteria for my irrational hatred- swarmy looking, constantly smirking, runs his mouth, a good player, and he assaulted and almost permanently maimed an innocent Elder of Israel.

I'm having a tough time remembering who the last player for the Utes who was so universally despised was.

[Goatnapper'96]

I missed the whole thing - couldn't watch the game, and was sick all day Sunday. So I am seeing the video here the first time today.

• I love Marshall Henderson's intensity and talent. He is going to be the player BYU fans hate for the next three years.

• Marshall should have kept his cool. Dumb mistake.

• Emery either flopped or has the glassiest glass jaw ever seen in this rivlarly. It's kinda comical to watch.

• I am very disappointed in the otherwise intelligent, mature BYU fans here who are making such a big deal of this. It's kind of like the lesson you all taught me after Max Hall's rant last fall: It's not what Max or Henderson did that is important, it's the opposing fans' overreaction to it that matters. Why can't you guys practice what you preach?

The whole thing is much ado about nothing. Henderson is what he is. A marginally average college basketball player whose mental state is likely to neutralize his marginal skills, thus making him a poor player. On this rational Ute fans and Cougar fans alike can agree. Despite his personality concerns, I am convinced someone somewhere will have a positive experience with him and thus assuage all negative opinions others might have of his questionable mental state. Often kids not very good and overwhelmed by a superior opponent will do what the young man did - it really isn't a big deal. It was frustration of knowing his best would just not be good enough.

I believe that if the Utes are going to be a good team, Henderson is a role player. If he continues to start, that is not good for the U IMO.

[byu71]

I have missed having a Ute I really, really, really dislike. Henderson meets all the criteria for my irrational hatred- swarmy looking, constantly smirking, runs his mouth, a good player, and he assaulted and almost permanently maimed an innocent Elder of Israel.

I'm having a tough time remembering who the last player for the Utes who was so universally despised was.

I agree with your sentiments, but to rise to the level of irrational hatred for me he will have to become a much better player rather than an afterthought.

It is kind of like JJ Diluigi uttering the "ute hate" comments vs Hall. Irrationally hating Henderson right now is a yawner for me.

[LA Ute]

I believe that if the Utes are going to be a good team, Henderson is a role player.

I am going to have to hang on to this one, it could be useful in the future. There is some evidence that this fine young man has some potential. But you never know. Time will tell.

[cougjunkie]

I am going to have to hang on to this one.

I echo what Napper said. Henderson is an absolute defensive liability, and he is a marginal scorer at best. His best role would be as a spot up shooter coming off the bench if he is hot (which this year except against AF he has not been) then you give him extended minutes, if not you sit him back down.

[PaloAltoCougar]

I am going to have to hang on to this one.

As Junkie said, Henderson is going to have to learn defense and pick up a lot of quickness if he's going to be significantly more than a pre-pubescent Mike Rose. Watching Emery jet past him in the first half made me think Henderson's game name ought to be El Matador.

[Art Vandelay]

The whole thing is much ado about nothing. Henderson is what he is. A marginally average college basketball player whose mental state is likely to neutralize his marginal skills, thus making him a poor player. On this rational Ute fans and Cougar fans alike can agree. Despite his personality concerns, I am convinced someone somewhere will have a positive experience with him and thus assuage all negative opinions others might have of his questionable mental state. Often kids not very good and overwhelmed by a superior opponent will do what the young man did - it really isn't a big deal. It was frustration of knowing his best would just not be good enough.

I believe that if the Utes are going to be a good team, Henderson is a role player. If he continues to start, that is not good for the U IMO.

Thank you Goat for helping my realize who Henderson is like...Kendall Wallace for UNLV (thought I don't think Marshall has his pick of coeds on campus like Wallace allegedly does). As a freshman he hit lots of big shots and there were huge expectations for his future. However it was quickly learned by the fans and slowly learned by the coaching staff, Wallace can't defend, can't beat anyone off the dribble, and is just as likely to go 2/10 behind the arc as 7/10. A good buddy of mine is a UNLV season ticket holder and use to love Wallace, now there is an above average chance he may be appearing on an episode of CSI involving the disappearance of Kendall.

I don't watch any Utah basketball except at the MWC tournament and the 2 times they play BYU every year, but if I was a fan I would be concerned if I heard Boylen talking about using Marshall as one of his primary weapons in next season.

[jay santos]

I was actually a little more impressed with Henderson's game than some of you. He's a better ball handle than I thought he was. He has a nice floating running as part of his repertoire. He's not athletic, he's skinny/weak, and he's a bit of a liability on D, but his offense is a little bit more than just a spot up shooter, which is what I thought he was based on watching just bits and pieces of a few Ute games prior to Saturday. The good thing about his game (from an opponent perspective) is that he has no concept of what his proper role is, and therefore is going to take a lot of bad shots and do a lot of dumb things. I doubt there is an easy fix to that.

[Senioritis]

I just want to make sure I've got this right.

Utah has one guy that deserves a D1 scholarship - Jay Watkins.

Other than him, they've got a 7'3" stiff who is horribly disappointing because he can't guard all five of the opponent's players, a pre-pubescent Mike Rose who is, to coin a phrase of glorious redundancy, a marginally average scorer, a 6'10" frenchman who averages more fouls than points, an athletic scorer who can't score, an entire team who couldn't collectively guard Andrea Lloyd if she only shot with her left hand, and a coach who is legally insane, inept, unwittingly causes his players to swing at opponents, and is generally a notch or two below Cleve Steveland.

And yet, this laughable collection of humanity went into the most difficult environment in the country, got down by 10 right out of the gate and 18 in the second half, and then mounted an impossible comeback with FOUR guys on the floor who didn't play D1 ball last year, cut the lead to 4, actually made a game of it, and ended up losing because BYU has a once in a generation scorer at the point.

Have I got that right?

If so, all I can say is heaven help BYU in the post season. Either Utah ain't as bad as all you homers think, or BYU ain't as good. Hell I don't know, maybe a bit of both.

[cougjunkie]

Thank you Goat for helping my realize who Henderson is like...Kendall Wallace for UNLV (thought I don't think Marshall has his pick of coeds on campus like Wallace allegedly does). As a freshman he hit lots of big shots and there were huge expectations for his future. However it was quickly learned by the fans and slowly learned by the coaching staff, Wallace can't defend, can't beat anyone off the dribble, and is just as likely to go 2/10 behind the arc as 7/10. A good buddy of mine is a UNLV season ticket holder and use to love Wallace, now there is an above average chance he may be appearing on an episode of CSI involving the disappearance of Kendall.

I don't watch any Utah basketball except at the MWC tournament and the 2 times they play BYU every year, but if I was a fan I would be concerned if I heard Boylen talking about using Marshall as one of his primary weapons in next season.

Good comparison, they are similar one dimensional players that lack defensive skills. The big difference as a freshman Wallace played 11 minutes per game, Henderson is at 27. Also Wallace shoots a higher percentage from 3 than Henderson and as a jr is only playing 18 minutes per game which is about right for a one dimensional shooter off the bench.

[LA Ute]

As Junkie said, Henderson is going to have to learn defense and pick up a lot of quickness if he's going to be significantly more than a pre-pubescent Mike Rose. Watching Emery jet past him in the first half made me think Henderson's game name ought to be El Matador.

As much as I deeply respect the concerned comments of BYU fans, who have only Marshall's best interests at heart, especially junkie, who compares a raw unproven freshman to an upperclassman and concludes they are the same one-dimensional player, I must point out that your collective concerns about that fine young man are shared by just about everyone, including Coach Boylen and young Marshall himself:

"I expect him to make shots. I expect him to score the ball," Boylen said. "What I want him to do is become a complete player. I want him to be able to handle the ball, make decisions. I want him to be able to guard. I want him to be able to communicate."

Henderson, he continued, needs to be more than just a scorer.

While his scoring is beneficial, Boylen said he looks at other aspects. Is Henderson guarding, handling it and making good decisions?

"He's growing in all those things and he's becoming a complete player," Boylen said. "I'm proud of his performance today."

. . .

Henderson, by his own admission, is a work in progress. Boylen knows he can shoot the ball and is smart, but everything else about his game can be better.

"Coming in I was like the worst defender like in the world," Henderson said. "Now I'm the second worst."

So, I thank you all for your concern, but hope you will not worry. My crystal ball is every bit as good as everyone else's, and I can predict with complete confidence that either (a) Marshall will improve and drive you all nuts for 3.5 seasons or (b) he will be a bust.

No one can accuse me of not going out on a limb.

[cougjunkie]

I just want to make sure I've got this right.

Utah has one guy that deserves a D1 scholarship - Jay Watkins.

Other than him, they've got a 7'3" stiff who is horribly disappointing because he can't guard all five of the opponent's players, a pre-pubescent Mike Rose who is, to coin a phrase of glorious redundancy, a marginally average scorer, a 6'10" frenchman who averages more fouls than points, an athletic scorer who can't score, an entire team who couldn't collectively guard Andrea Lloyd if she only shot with her left hand, and a coach who is legally insane, inept, unwittingly causes his players to swing at opponents, and is generally a notch or two below Cleve Steveland.

And yet, this laughable collection of humanity went into the most difficult environment in the country, got down by 10 right out of the gate and 18 in the second half, and then mounted an impossible comeback with FOUR guys on the floor who didn't play D1 ball last year, cut the lead to 4, actually made a game of it, and ended up losing because BYU has a once in a generation scorer at the point.

Have I got that right?

If so, all I can say is heaven help BYU in the post season. Either Utah ain't as bad as all you homers think, or BYU ain't as good. Hell I don't know, maybe a bit of both.

Foster- 7'3 player that blocks shots due to his height but does have decent timing, is awful offensively and needs to get on the Jordan Wynn HGH diet. If he does that he could have a nice future. Worth a schollie? Absolutely.

Watkins- Undersized post player, plays with a ton of energy and is a good offensive rebounder. Has zero range but does not need as he is quicker than most guys that will be guarding him. Worth a schollie: By far the best player on the team.

Drca and Tillie: Tillie is french, Drca has mastered the jump pass turnover. Tillie does a nice job at lulling his defender to sleep and taking 3-4 minute stretches off and then out of the blue cutting to the hoop for an easy dunk once his defender forgets that he is on the court. Drca I have nothing good to say about. Worth a schollie? Tille possibly, Drca not a chance.

Henderson: Shoots a lot. He has taken 60 more shots than anyone else on the team and is shooting a paltry 35.8% from the floor and 32% from three. He averages more turnovers per game than assists and has no idea what his role is on this team. The fact that he is relied on to be their primary scorer tells me all I need to know about Utahs basketball team this year. Worthy of a schollie? Maybe as a 9 or 10th option off the bench that gives you limited minutes.

Brown: Carlon Brown can dunk, and dunk well. But in 3 years he has yet to develop any sort of jump shot and really can not create his own shot because his only move is to go hard to the basket and try and throw it down. If he had any sort of midrange game he could be dangerous and has the athleticism to be a very good player. Worth of a schollie: yes

Glover: has a nice future, good size and a decent stroke. However he is one ugly SOB in fact his eyes look like they are on the side of his head, he could be the bastard child of Sam Cassell. Worthy of schollie: sure

Tavita: Good size for a PG, Utahs offense runs its best with him in the game. Mediocre defender, but horrible shooter. Which allows the opposing teams guard to sag off of him and help out on other players. If Tavita could develop a jump shot he would be serviceable and utah would be a lot better. Worthy of a schollie? yes due to his potential.

Washburn, Cyphers, Read: The jury is still out

Shoff- he better not be on schollie he was not good in high school and is not good now.

So why is Utah below .500 this year? How about the following players having more turnovers than assists:

Marshall Henderson, Carlon Brown, David Foster, Jay Watkins, Shawn Glover, Kim Tillie, Jordan Cyphers and Jason Washburn.

Tavita has a respectable 1.5/1 Assist to Turnover ratio.

[Goatnapper'96]

As Junkie said, Henderson is going to have to learn defense and pick up a lot of quickness if he's going to be significantly more than a pre-pubescent Mike Rose. Watching Emery jet past him in the first half made me think Henderson's game name ought to be El Matador.

When I look at him my thought goes to the column in that once damn fine monthly periodical "The SugarBeet," which I believe as called "Ask a Beehive."

How could anyone hate that face?

[jay santos]

I just want to make sure I've got this right.

Utah has one guy that deserves a D1 scholarship - Jay Watkins.

Other than him, they've got a 7'3" stiff who is horribly disappointing because he can't guard all five of the opponent's players, a pre-pubescent Mike Rose who is, to coin a phrase of glorious redundancy, a marginally average scorer, a 6'10" frenchman who averages more fouls than points, an athletic scorer who can't score, an entire team who couldn't collectively guard Andrea Lloyd if she only shot with her left hand, and a coach who is legally insane, inept, unwittingly causes his players to swing at opponents, and is generally a notch or two below Cleve Steveland.

And yet, this laughable collection of humanity went into the most difficult environment in the country, got down by 10 right out of the gate and 18 in the second half, and then mounted an impossible comeback with FOUR guys on the floor who didn't play D1 ball last year, cut the lead to 4, actually made a game of it, and ended up losing because BYU has a once in a generation scorer at the point.

Have I got that right?

If so, all I can say is heaven help BYU in the post season. Either Utah ain't as bad as all you homers think, or BYU ain't as good. Hell I don't know, maybe a bit of both.

Boylen's first sentence in the post game: "I'm proud of this team." He's right. You should be proud of this team. 13 point loss in the Marriott Center is a good result for your program, just three years into a new head coach's tenure.