President Trump: Making America Great Again...

[Moliere]

I’m not sure I understand why the citizenship question hasn’t always been asked on the census. Aren’t the House of Representatives divided up based on citizens, not number of people, per state? How can that be done if an accurate count of citizens isn’t obtained?

[Uncle Ted]

Trump actually said we took over the airports in the revolutionary war? what a moron. Yes, it matters. He doesn't have the mental capacity for the job he holds.

https://time.com/5620936/donald-trum...-war-airports/

Drumpf is the master game theory player. He said airports to make sure you all were listening to his 4th of July speech and so all the news networks would all talk about for days or even weeks after (even though half of them refused to cover it live). I didn't watch it myself because I was too busy celebrating Brexit 1776.

Or maybe he said "their ports"?

[Uncle Ted]

Cue UT’s post about Obama’s 57 states reference in 3...2....1...

I don't have to... thanks for playing.

[Goatnapper'96]

Trump actually said we took over the airports in the revolutionary war? what a moron. Yes, it matters. He doesn't have the mental capacity for the job he holds.

https://time.com/5620936/donald-trum...-war-airports/

I know Trump really ruins a great deal of some of y'all's days but in the end my biggest beef and reason to reject him is because his Candidacy and Presidency is entrenching identity politics. Part of his appeal that resulted in him being elected is him being a reaction to liberal identity politics where he is solidifying traditional Americana as an identity. I don't think it is racist (although racists might find themselves jumping on board) to do this even if it is mostly white folks identifying with that identity but I think it is every bit as damaging to the future of our Republic as racism. Our digression to tribalism is far more threatening to our country than an ill-informed or stupid Chief Executive. We can live through stupid Presidents but I am not sure we can live through a situation where out of the many we have well uh many. In my perspective the strength of the US has been in a commitment to an overarching culture or identity that supersedes all other communities. What we are becoming is far more alarming to me than Donald Trump and personally I think his election was only made possible by what we are becoming.

That is my post 4th of July thoughts so now you and Frank and Commando can go back to your cyber communal marginal circle jerking about all things Trump while Uncle Ted reminds us all that the left might be even dumber.

[Uncle Ted]

I’m not sure I understand why the citizenship question hasn’t always been asked on the census. Aren’t the House of Representatives divided up based on citizens, not number of people, per state? How can that be done if an accurate count of citizens isn’t obtained?

Yeah, Texas will most likely get another couple more representatives or so...

IllegalsPerState.jpg
https://www.pewhispanic.org/interact...ants-by-state/

Sucks for Utah, etc.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I know Trump really ruins a great deal of some of y'all's days but in the end my biggest beef and reason to reject him is because his Candidacy and Presidency is entrenching identity politics. Part of his appeal that resulted in him being elected is him being a reaction to liberal identity politics where he is solidifying traditional Americana as an identity. I don't think it is racist (although racists might find themselves jumping on board) to do this even if it is mostly white folks identifying with that identity but I think it is every bit as damaging to the future of our Republic as racism. Our digression to tribalism is far more threatening to our country than an ill-informed or stupid Chief Executive. We can live through stupid Presidents but I am not sure we can live through a situation where out of the many we have well uh many. In my perspective the strength of the US has been in a commitment to an overarching culture or identity that supersedes all other communities. What we are becoming is far more alarming to me than Donald Trump and personally I think his election was only made possible by what we are becoming.

That is my post 4th of July thoughts so now you and Frank and Commando can go back to your cyber communal marginal circle jerking about all things Trump while Uncle Ted reminds us all that the left might be even dumber.

[BlueK]

I’m not sure I understand why the citizenship question hasn’t always been asked on the census. Aren’t the House of Representatives divided up based on citizens, not number of people, per state? How can that be done if an accurate count of citizens isn’t obtained?

Nope. The Constitution says "persons" not citizens. Historically, everyone living in the US has been counted. This goes way back into history when there were slaves who were not citizens who had to be counted so the 3/5ths rule could be applied. Representatives to congress for the slave states were based on it even though they weren't citizens and couldn't vote. Representation is based on how many live there, but only citizens can vote. Also, federal funds are allocated based on population, so since non-citizens also use things like roads, it makes sense to know they live there. And by non-citizens I mean not just illegal aliens. There are millions who are here legally but are not citizens.

[Jarid in Cedar]

I know Trump really ruins a great deal of some of y'all's days but in the end my biggest beef and reason to reject him is because his Candidacy and Presidency is entrenching identity politics. Part of his appeal that resulted in him being elected is him being a reaction to liberal identity politics where he is solidifying traditional Americana as an identity. I don't think it is racist (although racists might find themselves jumping on board) to do this even if it is mostly white folks identifying with that identity but I think it is every bit as damaging to the future of our Republic as racism. Our digression to tribalism is far more threatening to our country than an ill-informed or stupid Chief Executive. We can live through stupid Presidents but I am not sure we can live through a situation where out of the many we have well uh many. In my perspective the strength of the US has been in a commitment to an overarching culture or identity that supersedes all other communities. What we are becoming is far more alarming to me than Donald Trump and personally I think his election was only made possible by what we are becoming.

That is my post 4th of July thoughts so now you and Frank and Commando can go back to your cyber communal marginal circle jerking about all things Trump while Uncle Ted reminds us all that the left might be even dumber.

I have said multiple times that Trump is the president that we deserve. He is a caricature of some if the worst traits of America.

[Uncle Ted]

Nope. The Constitution says "persons" not citizens. Historically, everyone living in the US has been counted. This goes way back into history when there were slaves who were not citizens who had to be counted so the 3/5ths rule could be applied. Representatives to congress for the slave states were based on it even though they weren't citizens and couldn't vote. Representation is based on how many live there, but only citizens can vote. Also, federal funds are allocated based on population, so since non-citizens also use things like roads, it makes sense to know they live there. And by non-citizens it's not just illegal aliens. There are millions who are here legally but are not citizens.

Maybe the feds can hold off on emptying the Texas "concentration camps" and sending them back until after the census has been taken. They can just focus their efforts in California for now.

[BlueK]

I have said multiple times that Trump is the president that we deserve. He is a caricature of some if the worst traits of America.

I want one that is better than we deserve

[frank ryan]

Nope. The Constitution says "persons" not citizens. Historically, everyone living in the US has been counted. This goes way back into history when there were slaves who were not citizens who had to be counted so the 3/5ths rule could be applied. Representatives to congress for the slave states were based on it even though they weren't citizens and couldn't vote. Representation is based on how many live there, but only citizens can vote. Also, federal funds are allocated based on population, so since non-citizens also use things like roads, it makes sense to know they live there. And by non-citizens I mean not just illegal aliens. There are millions who are here legally but are not citizens.

It’s never been considered controversial. It’s another Stephen Miller wet dream.

[Eddie]

Personally - I'm just curious about the numbers because I'm curious about the numbers. We hear both sides throwing out stats that are no where near each other - and I wonder who's more accurate. If you want to talk about immigrants having anywhere from no impact to a huge impact - how can you know that without knowing who and where they are?

I get why it's controversial. And I get that undocumented immigrants in particular have no motivation to tell the truth about their status, and every reason to fear government representatives if they do. So I get why it's an impossible question to ask.

But that doesn't mean I'm not curious. How many are here? What are they doing? How many are employed? How many are with their families and how many are working and sending money home to family? What services do they utilize? What services to they not utilize? A more qualitative census might even tell us what helps they need to get to a place where those who aren't self-sufficient could become that way.

I'm also curious about who's here from other countries and what the make up of our citizenry is. How are the minorities growing within the US. Sure - we'll get a snapshot that will give us more information than we get by just looking around. But it's still error prone.

[SeattleUte]

I know Trump really ruins a great deal of some of y'all's days but in the end my biggest beef and reason to reject him is because his Candidacy and Presidency is entrenching identity politics. Part of his appeal that resulted in him being elected is him being a reaction to liberal identity politics where he is solidifying traditional Americana as an identity. I don't think it is racist (although racists might find themselves jumping on board) to do this even if it is mostly white folks identifying with that identity but I think it is every bit as damaging to the future of our Republic as racism. Our digression to tribalism is far more threatening to our country than an ill-informed or stupid Chief Executive. We can live through stupid Presidents but I am not sure we can live through a situation where out of the many we have well uh many. In my perspective the strength of the US has been in a commitment to an overarching culture or identity that supersedes all other communities. What we are becoming is far more alarming to me than Donald Trump and personally I think his election was only made possible by what we are becoming.

That is my post 4th of July thoughts so now you and Frank and Commando can go back to your cyber communal marginal circle jerking about all things Trump while Uncle Ted reminds us all that the left might be even dumber.

I'm most of the way through volume I of Richard J. Evans's non-fiction trilogy on the history of Nazi Germany, treating the rise of Nazi Germany. It's a good thing to read right now, with all the loose talk about fascism. It's actually put me at ease about all this identity politics. It seems clear to me that a pre-condition to fascism is a critical mass of the population--an overwhelming majority--who share a racial identity and connection to the soil. The shared Volk (blood) and soil were critical to success of the Nazi movement. Much the same, for that matter, was true of bolshevism (recently I read a great book on that movement). (The left uses Hitler as precedent to raise the specter that Trump could dismantle democracy and force us all into fascism against our will. This mis-understands Nazi history. Nazis overall followed Hitler willingly; in fact, as a practical matter, democracy was all but dead when Hindenburg appointed him Chancellor and Germans had had limited history with successful democracy. The Weimar Republic was blamed for taking a dive in WWI; for the Versailles treaty; and for the ensuing economic hell.)

The allure of the collective, to the extent that you are agreeable to sacrificing your separate identity, is that the commune has this shared history and blood. (I'm sure LDS can relate to this.) I continue to believe that capitalism's success is the strongest bulwark possible against totalitarianism, a pre-condition to which seems to be truly dire economic conditions that affects everyone. Hunger, homelessness, joblessness, on a mass scale, that sort of thing. We need to satisfy basic needs including education before liberty is attainable, history seems to teach. But I also think that our country's multiple sharply defined identities as well helps. Probably any one of these factions might try to establish fascism, but together it seems structurally impossible. Fascism could be possible in Utah, but not in the United States. There's so much diversity, and even its toxicity helps to defeat any successful movement toward a totalitarian collective.

I have always been a lot more concerned about creeping totalitarianism because of the left's political success than the right's.

[Northwestcoug]

I have said multiple times that Trump is the president that we deserve. He is a caricature of some if the worst traits of America.

Indeed. A lot of a president’s power is symbolic. At the very least, he should elevate the national political discourse. Trump always plays to the lowest common denominator.

[SeattleUte]

Indeed. A lot of a president’s power is symbolic. At the very least, he should elevate the national political discourse. Trump always plays to the lowest common denominator.

You mean like the ultra focus on the airport gaffe?