Adam and Steve can now get married in NY...

[Maximus]

Let gay people get married and there will probably be less gay sex.

Win win.

The thing that just kills me about this is that the anti-gay marriage crowd thinks they are somehow deterring homosexuality or decreasing the amount of homosexual sex by being against gay marriage. Totally irrational.

How could it possibly lead to less gay sex? they are going to have less when they are married?

Anyways, personally the only reason I worry is because the church leaders say it is important. How do I believe that they are prophets of God and speak in the name of the Lord and then say they are wrong when they come out and speak so much against this? There have been some wrong doctrines int he pass, but who am I to pick and choose when I think they are inspired and when they are not? I dont know how to reconcile that.

[CardiacCoug]

How could it possibly lead to less gay sex? they are going to have less when they are married?

Yep. Married people are too busy.

Let gay people adopt a whole bunch of kids and then the sinful gay sex would become almost nonexistent.

[ERCougar]

How could it possibly lead to less gay sex? they are going to have less when they are married?

Anyways, personally the only reason I worry is because the church leaders say it is important. How do I believe that they are prophets of God and speak in the name of the Lord and then say they are wrong when they come out and speak so much against this? There have been some wrong doctrines int he pass, but who am I to pick and choose when I think they are inspired and when they are not? I dont know how to reconcile that.

You're not one to pick and choose. There is no wiggle room on interpretations of the declarations of the prophets of God. I'm making a mental note not to business with any of the people who go to the temple, yet are not fully in support of the Church's fight against the legalization of gay marriage.

[BoylenOver]

Only 17 more states to go until the number of states that allow gay marriage match the number of states that allow first cousins to marry!

[Levin]

One huge benefit of the continual march forward for gay rights is that it becomes less and less necessary to explain the obvious to folks like Maximus.

I'm sure there were holdouts against the Civil Rights movement, too. People that vehemently wanted separate but equal and couldn't or wouldn't see why things couldn't stay that way. Some folks never get it or refuse to get it or whatever. But everyone else marches on with or without them.

Within the next 10 years, another core element of this anti gay right movement will begin to crumble....the fear mongering/we just don't know what will happen/my kids are being indoctrinated at school/society will crumble argument. One day people in Mass and NY and Vermont are going to wake up and wonder what all the doom and gloom was about. Life and society didn't wind up coming to a grinding halt.

Sloppy.

Rome didn't fall over the course of a decade. But over the course of centuries.

[BlueHair]

Sloppy.

Rome didn't fall over the course of a decade. But over the course of centuries.

Then we have nothing to worry about.

[Babs]

Have you guys heard anything about how the prop8 thing has affected stateside missionaries? I was curious because I was at a party today where a girl was telling a haha story about how she ran off a couple of elders who came by her house yesterday, by asking if they wanted to contribute to her let's-sabotage-mormon-marriages fund. I take it she's a little, uh, bitter.

[Levin]

Then we have nothing to worry about.

Exactly. You don't. But that doesn't mean the second century Romans didn't lay the foundation.

[Moliere]

Exactly. You don't. But that doesn't mean the second century Romans didn't lay the foundation.

Rome fell because men were packing fudge?

[Colly Wolly]

Rome fell because men were packing fudge?

Among other things.

[Levin]

Rome fell because men were packing fudge?

Moliere wasn't an ignorant literalist. You shouldn't be either.

[taekwondave]

Exactly. You don't. But that doesn't mean the second century Romans didn't lay the foundation.

This has got to be my all-time favorite argument about keeping gay marriage illegal: that there were gay people in Rome.

You know, I was in Rome a couple of summers ago. You know what else they had? Water fountains. Water fountains EVERYWHERE. We better get on that. I was walking around downtown Provo just the other day and RIGHT there on the corner I saw one. Just sittin out there...like it was NORMAL!!! I'm telling you, guys, if we don't act fast, MORE of these...."water fountains" are going to pop up around us, and then boom; it's all over.

[Uncle Ted]

This has got to be my all-time favorite argument about keeping gay marriage illegal: that there were gay people in Rome.

You know, I was in Rome a couple of summers ago. You know what else they had? Water fountains. Water fountains EVERYWHERE. We better get on that. I was walking around downtown Provo just the other day and RIGHT there on the corner I saw one. Just sittin out there...like it was NORMAL!!! I'm telling you, guys, if we don't act fast, MORE of these...."water fountains" are going to pop up around us, and then boom; it's all over.

It may not be the water fountains but the lead pipes that were used to deliver the water that was the problem. And lead poisoning can cause all kinds of problems for an empire. Personally, I like to think that the excessive government was a major contributor.

This discussion reminds me of an American Heritage TA lecture I recall back in my college days at BYU. There was concept that was taught called "the good" and the civil war was used an example. According to the American Heritage book and the TA in his lecture the real reason the south lost the war wasn't that the north had more resources but it was the moral issues of slavery weigh heavily on the minds of the confederates. In other words, "the good" was on the side of the Union. I made the comment that "the good" must have sided with the communist north vietnamese in the vietnam war as well especially after the US pulled its troops out.

[wuapinmon]

It may not be the water fountains but the lead pipes that were used to deliver the water that was the problem. And lead poisoning can cause all kinds of problems for an empire. Personally, I like to think that the excessive government was a major contributor.

This discussion reminds me of an American Heritage TA lecture I recall back in my college days at BYU. There was concept that was taught called "the good" and the civil war was used an example. According to the American Heritage book and the TA in his lecture the real reason the south lost the war wasn't that the north had more resources but it was the moral issues of slavery weigh heavily on the minds of the confederates. In other words, "the good" was on the side of the Union. I made the comment that "the good" must have sided with the communist north vietnamese in the vietnam war as well especially after the US pulled its troops out.

Uncle Ted, I love your posts, man. You're a gem, and I'm glad you're part of CUF>

[scottie]

Interesting. I wonder if this signals a lessening of the grip that the Christian Right has on the Republican party.

And that LDS-Prop 8 will be an even bigger hurdle for Mitt??