Investing, finally some facts

[falafel]

Yes, this is true. However, you probably can only drive the Badger downhill since it sounds like it won't have an engine...

Right, it will have a battery! Or maybe a fuel cell.

[Copelius]

Nikola did sign a partnership deal with GM that's valued in the billions and GM has defended the deal. So maybe it isn't all just a house of cards? That said, if I owned Nikola stock I would sell now.

I may have taken a small flier on it and am debating with myself whether i take the loss or try to ride it into breaking back even.

[Flystripper]

I may have taken a small flier on it and am debating with myself whether i take the loss or try to ride it into breaking back even.

i didn't jump in but don't be too ashamed. Given their market cap institutional inventors who are typically much more sophisticated than the average Joe invested way more then what you are talking about. People are going to go to prison. (if it is smoke and mirrors)

[Moliere]

Yeah, I would almost be tempted to get one of those. Man, this thing looks good (on paper):

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/general-motors-nikola-badger-fuel-cell-semis/

Holy crap, the HP/torque is crazy. That beats the crap out of the Ford Hennessey VelociRaptor and its wimpy 750 HP. Yeah, with a truck like that...

yeah, looks good on paper...

[Jeff Lebowski]

Yeah, I would almost be tempted to get one of those. Man, this thing looks good (on paper):

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/general-motors-nikola-badger-fuel-cell-semis/

Holy crap, the HP/torque is crazy. That beats the crap out of the Ford Hennessey VelociRaptor and its wimpy 750 HP. Yeah, with a truck like that...

I love both the design and specs. I would buy one for sure if it were in fact a real product right now. But at this point, I can't believe any of these numbers.

Here is the article that blew everything up:

https://hindenburgresearch.com/nikola/

Fascinating reading.

[Now who’s the dean?]

Props to whoever decided to name their shorting firm Hindenburg [emoji106][emoji106]

[Uncle Ted]

I love both the design and specs. I would buy one for sure if it were in fact a real product right now. But at this point, I can't believe any of these numbers.

Here is the article that blew everything up:

https://hindenburgresearch.com/nikola/

Fascinating reading.

Wow... This dude is toast. The lawsuits are going to kill any chance of us getting these trucks.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[BigFatMeanie]

I've been following the Elizabeth Holmes trial pretty closely. This Yahoo article expresses surprise or perhaps bemusement that top executives and leaders could be gullible suckers:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/elizabeth-holmes-trial-another-sucker-122523926.html

First came James Mattis, the retired four-star general, who testified that he invested in the failed blood-testing startup even though Holmes was his "sole source" of information about the company. And now we have Steven Burd, the former CEO of the supermarket giant Safeway, who spent yesterday on the stand explaining how he - a celebrated titan of industry - fell hard for Holmes and her high-tech schtick.

But Burd, like Mattis before him, did come across as oddly gullible for a man who spent decades at the pinnacle of his chosen profession.

In my experience, high-up business leaders tend to be VERY credulous and willing to entertain all manner of snake-oil notions if they think there is even a small chance it could work. I think many top business leaders, especially those in huge well-established companies, are generally at a loss on how to increase market share or fundamentally change their business' established patterns and that makes them willing to grasp at straws in the hopes that something will work.

[Moliere]

I've been following the Elizabeth Holmes trial pretty closely. This Yahoo article expresses surprise or perhaps bemusement that top executives and leaders could be gullible suckers:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/elizabeth-holmes-trial-another-sucker-122523926.html

In my experience, high-up business leaders tend to be VERY credulous and willing to entertain all manner of snake-oil notions if they think there is even a small chance it could work. I think many top business leaders, especially those in huge well-established companies, are generally at a loss on how to increase market share or fundamentally change their business' established patterns and that makes them willing to grasp at straws in the hopes that something will work.

I haven’t followed it closely but I do read about it periodically. It is interesting. I think it’s more of a FOMO mentality where a small investment can lead to a huge gain but you have to get in early. Holmes was charismatic and knew how to play the part. It reminds me of the Nikola guy and the sham he’s pulled off. It’s all a big idea with a little bit of tech behind it and the hopes that they get lucky and figure it out before people figure them out.

my experience with high level executives is different. They are very conservative and often don’t do anything rash or I calculated. In fact, very few do much without consulting outside advisors, which always cracks me up. The companies I’ve worked for write fat checks to investment banks, lawyers and advisors. Some of that is necessary with due diligence and market making for transactions, but most of it is for consultants to tell them what they already know. In large corporations, the workforce is mainly made up of people that follow desk procedures and policies. Upper management is the same way. Eccentric ceos will eventually be wrong and then will get berated for not following conservative principles so they mostly just play it safe and keep the train going as long as possible.

[BigFatMeanie]

I haven’t followed it closely but I do read about it periodically. It is interesting. I think it’s more of a FOMO mentality where a small investment can lead to a huge gain but you have to get in early. Holmes was charismatic and knew how to play the part. It reminds me of the Nikola guy and the sham he’s pulled off. It’s all a big idea with a little bit of tech behind it and the hopes that they get lucky and figure it out before people figure them out.

my experience with high level executives is different. They are very conservative and often don’t do anything rash or I calculated. In fact, very few do much without consulting outside advisors, which always cracks me up. The companies I’ve worked for write fat checks to investment banks, lawyers and advisors. Some of that is necessary with due diligence and market making for transactions, but most of it is for consultants to tell them what they already know. In large corporations, the workforce is mainly made up of people that follow desk procedures and policies. Upper management is the same way. Eccentric ceos will eventually be wrong and then will get berated for not following conservative principles so they mostly just play it safe and keep the train going as long as possible.

Interesting. I should clarify that my experience with credulous execs is mainly based on internal snake-oil salespeople. Employees pitching executives to try and get funding for their snake-oil projects in an effort to increase turf/clout.

[Paperback Writer]

Interesting. I should clarify that my experience with credulous execs is mainly based on internal snake-oil salespeople. Employees pitching executives to try and get funding for their snake-oil projects in an effort to increase turf/clout.

My experience is closer to yours when it come to dubious investments and acquisitions while trying to increase market share or "expand" the business. It has made me even more cynical than I already was and more critical of the C-suites who earn millions annually and then resort to laying off long-time rank-and-file employees when those decisions backfire. Even my teenager knew that acquiring a satellite TV company in an era of cord cutting was a dumb idea.

[Jeff Lebowski]

My experience is closer to yours when it come to dubious investments and acquisitions while trying to increase market share or "expand" the business. It has made me even more cynical than I already was and more critical of the C-suites who earn millions annually and then resort to laying off long-time rank-and-file employees when those decisions backfire. Even my teenager knew that acquiring a satellite TV company in an era of cord cutting was a dumb idea.

What did your teenage kid think of investing in gamestop?

[Paperback Writer]

What did your teenage kid think of investing in gamestop?

He is no longer a teenager, now an engineering school graduate from an excellent Texas university that is not UT And I talked him out of investing in gamestop just as I had talked him out of not pursuing a career in gaming when a friend of his that he successfully competed with was going on to make some welders money in that pursuit. In hindsight, I probably should have encouraged that gamestop investment along with encouraging him to transfer to UT when he was thinking about it after changing majors within the engineering school (the main reason he did not attend UT out of high school was his chosen school was the higher ranked program before he switched majors).

[Jeff Lebowski]

He is no longer a teenager, now an engineering school graduate from an excellent Texas university that is not UT And I talked him out of investing in gamestop just as I had talked him out of not pursuing a career in gaming when a friend of his that he successfully competed with was going on to make some welders money in that pursuit. In hindsight, I probably should have encouraged that gamestop investment along with encouraging him to transfer to UT when he was thinking about it after changing majors within the engineering school (the main reason he did not attend UT out of high school was his chosen school was the higher ranked program before he switched majors).

Funny story: I was talking to my old PhD advisor from Texas on the phone this week. it was fun to catch up. During the conversation he told me that one of his grandsons is currently going to school at Texas A&M. Then he said “well it’s probably for the best. University of Texas has gotten too damn liberal. Everybody trying to be woke all the time.“ Haha.

[Paperback Writer]

Funny story: I was talking to my old PhD advisor from Texas on the phone this week. it was fun to catch up. During the conversation he told me that one of his grandsons is currently going to school at Texas A&M. Then he said “well it’s probably for the best. University of Texas has gotten too damn liberal. Everybody trying to be woke all the time.“ Haha.

Here is another one: we have set up and seeded a 529 for our grandson. Aggie son met his spouse at A&M (BYU undergrad+A&M masters). But they now live in Colorado. When talking about future college costs, there was debate between BYU costs and out-of-state A&M costs. I stated that if the 529 funds being saved and invested for our grandson were going to go to out-of-state tuition - why wouldn't I insist on the best school - UT? My son and daughter-in-law didn't find that remark funny.