Voter ID Question

[frank ryan]

Yes, it is a losing position. When you are on the minority side of an issue with 83% support, including >70% of democrats, it is time to swallow your pride and stop making arguments about homeless people getting birth certificates, "it won't make a difference", yada yada.

You can accept something without agreeing with it.

[bluegoose]

Almost every democracy on earth requires some form of ID for voting. I guess I’d put the onus back on the folks that don’t think voter ID should be required as to why our democracy is different than the rest of the developed world.

Because in-person voting sucks and mail-in ballots are better.

[myboynoah]

I'm curious what an implementation of that law looks like. Can you pass a federal law without having it overturned by the courts? Or do we see a push for states to make the change?

Great question. Does anyone have insights?

[dabrockster]

It's all those undocumented immigrants that came into the country, voted for Biden, and then for some reason voted for Trump.

Per counting mail-in ballots, it sounds like Ohio doesn't count until after the polls close (like Pennsylvania). But I believe Florida (and likely some other states) do count mail-ins in the weeks leading up to election day. Don't know how they reconcile for the issue of possible double voting, but Florida is well-known for being able to report its results very early election night. After the hanging chad fiasco, it cleaned up its act.

I think it is the mail-in ballots. Much easier access to register and vote. Illegal or undocumented are not voting. Hell.. They could care less. They care more about not getting caught and that seems like a place they would rather avoid. lol

[dabrockster]

So there's a process to make sure those who are registered to vote get those counted, as well as preventing fraud. Sounds like it's doing it's intended job.

This isn't just directed to you, but I seriously want to understand how those who support some change in voter ID laws will affect mail-in voting. Because the popularity and ease of it are not going away.

Truthfully, registering for mail-in ballots allows for better control to ensure there is no fraud. It is vetted with a bit more scrutiny.. and truthfully. Those votes are never counted the night of election when most polls are closed and called. Yes, it is ink Ed’s in the official tally and final count but we already know who won. Based on percentages and projections.

[dabrockster]

No matter how loud maga republicans shout that there is rampant voter fraud, the fact remains that there is zero evidence that it exists in any meaningful way. This stuff has been litigated ad nauseum and decided. Placing an additional hurdle to vote will result in fewer people voting either because of inconvenience or inability to overcome the hurdle. You have to ask yourself, which political party desires fewer people casting their vote? This is about finding ways to hold on to power and not actual risks that undocumented immigrants are tipping elections.

That being said, if I had to choose between voter ID and Trump placing ICE agents at polling locations, I would obviously choose voter ID as ICE showing up in force at polling locations will result in an even greater deterrent to voting. Neither are necessary. If you are going to require ID for the mid-terms, the law would already need to be in place to give plenty of time to comply. The longer they wait the more disenfranchising the result will be.

If he puts ICE agents in ANY state this coming election. I will post in the MAGA thread how much of a POS he is and deserves to be impeached every single day until he is gone.

JL; Do you have auto-post capability? lol

[dabrockster]

I believe you, DH, and I are of one mind on this. I don’t strongly oppose voter id, although I suspect any increase in election integrity will be minimal and other issues will arise. I also think or nation has suppressed far more eligible voters than it has permitted ineligible voters.

The biggest election integrity issue, by far, is the loss of confidence in our institutions caused by lies propagated by losers. For example, Trump, Lindell, Giuliani, Powell, and other convicts have done immeasurable damage to that confidence which is one reason support for voter i.d. Is so high.

I just finished visiting the General Patton Museum where the following familiar quote from another authoritarian leader uttered nearly a century ago is displayed: “If you tell a big enough lie and repeat it frequently, it will be believed.”

You forgot Hilary, Pelosi, Schumer, and others who though she should’ve won and was robbed the first Trump presidency.

[dabrockster]

Because in-person voting sucks and mail-in ballots are better.

to register for my mail-in ballot, I am pretty sure I had to include my SSN or DL#.

IMG_7659.png

[frank ryan]

The risk of non-citizens voting. Just because it hasn’t been a material problem in the past doesn’t mean the risk isn’t higher now than ever before. We have over 10 million new non-citizens in the country over the past five years, so clearly the risk is much higher than it’s ever been. Every good risk management person knows that a good preventive control is better than a great detective control.

Source for it being "higher" than before?

[PaloAltoCougar]

You forgot Hilary, Pelosi, Schumer, and others who thought she should’ve won and was robbed the first Trump presidency.

The people I named were mere examples of complaining losers.. Unfortunately, there are people so stupid or intellectually dishonest (not you, of course) that they see equivalence between the statements and actions of the people you named and those I named.

[Moliere]

Source for it being "higher" than before?

The increase in the number of undocumented people in the United States is pretty well documented over the past 20 or so years. Here’s an article that talks about it and has a chart.

https://www.pewresearch.org/short-re...ing-in-the-us/

[frank ryan]

The increase in the number of undocumented people in the United States is pretty well documented over the past 20 or so years. Here’s an article that talks about it and has a chart.

https://www.pewresearch.org/short-re...ing-in-the-us/

I mean the likelihood that undocumented folks were more likely to commit fraud. I'm not aware of any genuinely concerning trends.

[Bo Diddley]

Great question. Does anyone have insights?

Maybe a non binding resolution of some sort. The states are best prepared to address any special circumstances for their citizens.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Apparently Somalia just started issuing voter ID cards that are mandatory for voting.

[frank ryan]

No matter how loud maga republicans shout that there is rampant voter fraud, the fact remains that there is zero evidence that it exists in any meaningful way. This stuff has been litigated ad nauseum and decided. Placing an additional hurdle to vote will result in fewer people voting either because of inconvenience or inability to overcome the hurdle. You have to ask yourself, which political party desires fewer people casting their vote? This is about finding ways to hold on to power and not actual risks that undocumented immigrants are tipping elections.

That being said, if I had to choose between voter ID and Trump placing ICE agents at polling locations, I would obviously choose voter ID as ICE showing up in force at polling locations will result in an even greater deterrent to voting. Neither are necessary. If you are going to require ID for the mid-terms, the law would already need to be in place to give plenty of time to comply. The longer they wait the more disenfranchising the result will be.

There just hasn't been much fraud at all. I think Utah found one undocumented person on their rolls and they never voted.

The fewer people vote the better it is for Trump. These shenanigans aren't new. There's the usual having lots of polling stations in suburban white areas and very few in the inner-city that has been a red state tactics for a minute.

ICE will be deployed regardless, unless there is enough outrage on the front end to curtail Stephen Miller and Steven Bannon informed racist bs.