Mormon WikiLeaks (MormonLeaks)

[Jeff Lebowski]

My 13 year old son watches these comedic YouTubes called “Adam Ruins Everything.” Sometimes here I feel like I’m that guy. But like Adam, I’m only ever trying to help. I’m glad you have all had a good discussin, but if I may, I think you’re asking the wrong question in even addressing the supernatural.

Harari, the author of Homo Deus and Sapiens, takes a very expansive view of what is a “religion”. In his view, any ideology or even abstraction that brings a group of humans together to cooperate toward a value system is a religion. So, Mormonism, Communism, Capitalism, human rights, liberal humanism, fascism, corporations, legal codes, environmentalism, “dataism,” and much more are all religions. Obviously, he’s totally non-judgmental in identifying what is a religion. I don’t have a problem with this, but if to you religion has to connote belief in god, I submit this construct still helps in a discussion such as this.

Harari in Homo Deus raises the question, why are some religions more successful than others at different times? It completely depends, he submits, on which religion is best answering the big questions of the day. Capitalism, he submits, is the most successful religion of all time (Harari is a vegan who believes that the agricultural revolution was a catastrophe for the planet overall including humans). Why? Capitalism is the only religion that has figured out how to create value (and value creation not value distribution is the real economic problem).

So, how well do LDS leaders answer the big questions of the day? About value creation, sex, LGBT rights, women (arguably the most oppressed of all time), data, technology, the environment? For all this power of “revelation” why are they almost always late to social progress?

You don't ruin anything. Knock it off.

Hey, I read Sapiens on your recommendation. Harari is great when he is recounting history and biology, but when he starts opining or getting philosophical, he is less interesting and sometimes just goofy. For example, his capitalism = religion was a huge stretch for me. And anything he said about animals was way over the top. As a result, I couldn't muster the energy to read Homo Deus.

Also, happy birthday!

[Jeff Lebowski]

I can recall the names of just about everyone in my MTC district, including 2 of our 3 instructors. I have zero recollection of even being organized in branches. Were we, back in the dark ages? If so, I have zero memory of any branch presidency. But I do recall the MTC president was Joe J. Christensen, who I liked very much, although I don't think he ever spoke to me or acknowledged me individually. But I never liked hanging around authority figures, so that may be why.

Same for me!

[Commando]

I've thought about this over the past week quite a bit. I believe I have a better-than-average memory, so I don't hold people to my standard when it comes to stuff like this (even though that is tempting--especially when my client is being deposed and I know the GeeDee answer and my client doesn't, and I didn't even go through whatever is being questioned. I digress.) I remember a lot of things about the MTC. Tons of things. Minute details, down to the names of the Elders in my District, my teachers and where they served their missions, my branch presidency members and what they did for a living, etc. But for the life of me, I can't remember who the MTC pres was. That said, how well someone remembers (or doesn't) remember the MTC pres is pretty irrelevant as it pertains to this discussion. And I'm certain I would remember his name if I had any sort of meaningful interactions with him during my stay there.

#metoo. He may have given the welcome address and opened the devotionals, but that isn't enough exposure to really be memorable. I remember which general authorities gave talks while I was there, but no way I'd remember the MTC president. That's just a bridge too far- especially when that place just has thousands of missionaries bustling around. Just a weird place and time, thinking back on it. I start to cringe too much if I think too hard about how I was or what I thought was cool, or even my preconceptions about how I'd be as a missionary and how I should be preparing (all of which I remember clear as day, but zero recall of the President)

[The_Tick]

Were you there for 3 or 8 weeks? For 8 weeks I heard Pinegar on the intercom daily saying he loved me. You don't forget service like that!

I was there for 10 days only. There was a snafu with the transfer schedule in my mission. So I got a bunch of the 1st discussion, two days of the 2nd discussion and that was it.

I don't remember the Branch President either. All I know is that it was a long 10 days.

[Pelado]

#metoo. He may have given the welcome address and opened the devotionals, but that isn't enough exposure to really be memorable. I remember which general authorities gave talks while I was there, but no way I'd remember the MTC president. That's just a bridge too far- especially when that place just has thousands of missionaries bustling around. Just a weird place and time, thinking back on it. I start to cringe too much if I think too hard about how I was or what I thought was cool, or even my preconceptions about how I'd be as a missionary and how I should be preparing (all of which I remember clear as day, but zero recall of the President)

The GA's that were most memorable to me were Neal A. Maxwell and pre-Q12 Dieter Uchtdorf. I've got a notebook somewhere of all the notes I took from all the GA addresses. Maybe I'll get that out one of these days.

[Pelado]

Just tried looking for a list of past presidents of the Provo MTC. My Google skills have failed me.

[The_Tick]

The GA's that were most memorable to me were Neal A. Maxwell and pre-Q12 Dieter Uchtdorf. I've got a notebook somewhere of all the notes I took from all the GA addresses. Maybe I'll get that out one of these days.

We had one member of the Q12 show up to speak on Thanksgiving Day. I don't remember which one it was though.

But I do remember that the teenager from "On our Way Home" was in the MTC the same time that I was. They played that video and had him stand up to recognize him. LDS famous and all.

[falafel]

We had one member of the Q12 show up to speak on Thanksgiving Day. I don't remember which one it was though.

But I do remember that the teenager from "On our Way Home" was in the MTC the same time that I was. They played that video and had him stand up to recognize him. LDS famous and all.

On The Way Home? I had a crush on the blonde sister missionary.

[Donuthole]

We had one member of the Q12 show up to speak on Thanksgiving Day. I don't remember which one it was though.

But I do remember that the teenager from "On our the Way Home" was in the MTC the same time that I was. They played that video and had him stand up to recognize him. LDS famous and all.

Scott. Real baller that Scott. The dad from that movie still pops up on TV now and then. And occasionally in a movie.

[Northwestcoug]

I know for certain DHO came to speak. And my memory is failing, but I think Maxwell came also. Steven Covey talked to us twice, and I think one time was a last-minute thing because of a cancellation. He had his wife come up and sing an impromptu piece, I think to instill upon our young minds the importance of always being prepared. I was not impressed with him, but I had a Covey day planner!

Other than those, there were a couple of 70s who came to talk to us. I just can't remember those.

[Eddie]

Am I the only one who has no idea who the President was of the MTC when they were there?

Shoot...I can only name one member of the district that I was in, and that's only because he was my comp.

Mine was George Durrant. I remember because both before and since I've heard him speak at a couple of firesides and read one or two of this books and I think he's great.

[The_Tick]

Anyone else there November 93?...besides DT that is. Lol.

[Northwestcoug]

Scott. Real baller that Scott. The dad from that movie still pops up on TV now and then. And occasionally in a movie.

Loved that show. The scene with the dad in the homeless shelter always got me right there in the feels...

[falafel]

Loved that show. The scene with the dad in the homeless shelter always got me right there in the feels...

What is it with these dogooders?!

[Donuthole]

Just watched the opening scene. I remember as an 8th grader thinking the basketball scenes were pretty bad, but I don't think I realized just how bad. Wow.