The CES Letter

[ERCougar]

One thing came across on my FB feed this morning that maybe none of us are sensitive to:

Mayne said "the disdain and disgust" he felt from such comments made him "physically sick." To this San Francisco gay man, the words were personal.

"That was me they were talking about with such aversion," he said. "I'll never have the privilege of viewing it through heterosexual eyes, which would perhaps buffer me from noticing or being affected by their disgust."

As a believing Mormon, Mayne said he expected his religious higher-ups to "show more compassion and kindness and less open revulsion when speaking about another segment of God's children."

(Mitch Mayne was the openly gay bishopric member from the Bay Area--I don't think he's still in that calling)

To me, the wikileaks video was just a funny example of old guys being being old guys, but that's because I've just pretty much accepted who they are. To people who were hoping for better, those videos could be painful--those voices seem a lot more disdainful than compassionate, despite their claims to the contrary.

[lambdacoug]

Exmos think all 15 are dicks?

Crazy to think that people that leave something like the church might not like the people that lead it. It boggles the mind, really.

[Soccermom]

So anyone here an elite? As in not just a rank and file member? That reference kind of bugs me, I'll be honest. I thought we were all special.

[Omaha 680]

Crazy to think that people that leave something like the church might not like the people that lead it. It boggles the mind, really.

I would say an exmo who thinks all 15 are dicks is painting with the same broad brush he/she always complains is applied to exmos by members.

[creekster]

WHy was the church videotaping these sessions? And how is it they were leaked?

[YOhio]

So anyone here an elite? As in not just a rank and file member? That reference kind of bugs me, I'll be honest. I thought we were all special.

Let's just say this. I doubt PAC brags about knowing us when he's hanging out with all of his GA buddies.

[lambdacoug]

I would say an exmo who thinks all 15 are dicks is painting with the same broad brush he/she always complains is applied to exmos by members.

Right, thinking 15 men are dicks is clearly a very broad brush...

You're right though, it's just as broad a brush as exmos are painted with by members...

[Omaha 680]

Right, thinking 15 men are dicks is clearly a very broad brush...

You're right though, it's just as broad a brush as exmos are painted with by members...

Yes. That is a broad brush. It is unreasonable and unfortunate. It's also not a good way to find peace on your journey.

Not all members are the same. Not all exmos are the same. Not even all apostles are the same. I guess one of us recognizes that and one of us doesn't.

[smokymountainrain]

WHy was the church videotaping these sessions? And how is it they were leaked?

somebody said they were taped for certain GAs who couldn't be there.

[smokymountainrain]

Yes. That is a broad brush. It is unreasonable and unfortunate. It's also not a good way to find peace on your journey.

Not all members are the same. Not all exmos are the same. Not even all apostles are the same. I guess one of us recognizes that and one of us doesn't.

[Moliere]

Yes. That is a broad brush. It is unreasonable and unfortunate. It's also not a good way to find peace on your journey.

Not all members are the same. Not all exmos are the same. Not even all apostles are the same. I guess one of us recognizes that and one of us doesn't.

Omaha 1
Lambda 0


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[Moliere]

Certainly I can't be the only Mormon that finds these videos not at all shocking, right? They would be shocking if we didn't already know that Oaks is preoccupied with the gays and that old people that spend 95% of their awake time dealing with church administrative matters might be a bit out of touch with world events. It makes send that they'd be briefed on stuff.

Even when I was a TBM I didn't think that Christ himself told GBH about raves. I figured he heard it from his grandkids and decided he should speak about such parties.

That being said, I haven't watched the videos. I go to enough church meetings every week that I don't want to have endure anymore monotonous doldrumming than I already have to.


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[smokymountainrain]

Omaha 1
Lambda 0


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ac may have thrown in the towel. if so, wise choice.

[lambdacoug]

Yes. That is a broad brush. It is unreasonable and unfortunate. It's also not a good way to find peace on your journey.

Not all members are the same. Not all exmos are the same. Not even all apostles are the same. I guess one of us recognizes that and one of us doesn't.

My point isn't that they are all the same. They are high profile leaders and many things they do and say are well publicized. Just as many people in the church look up to and even revere these men as leaders of the church, many exmos look at them as leaders of the church that has caused them personal pain. That is significantly different than members painting relatively anonymous exmos with broad brush strokes.

[Commando]

My point isn't that they are all the same. They are high profile leaders and many things they do and say are well publicized. Just as many people in the church look up to and even revere these men as leaders of the church, many exmos look at them as leaders of the church that has caused them personal pain. That is significantly different than members painting relatively anonymous exmos with broad brush strokes.

Isn't that an inherently biased position, though? How could you expect any objective commentary about their character coming from that position?