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Originally posted by MarkGrace
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He needs to get out of Texas.One of the grandest benefits of the enlightenment was the realization that our moral sense must be based on the welfare of living individuals, not on their immortal souls. Honest and passionate folks can strongly disagree regarding spiritual matters, so it's imperative that we not allow such considerations to infringe on the real happiness of real people.
Woot
I believe religion has much inherent good and has born many good fruits.
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I think there's a range, possibly a wide range, of beliefs within the Mormon tradition of how we view God. On one end, you have the Evangelical God the Father, who is a big God, all powerful, etc. He makes the rules, and he is the ultimate powerful being. This God would not be surprised by anything. On the opposite side of spectrum you have a God who is an exalted man, who lived a life of mortality and sin and weakness prior to being God, who exists in a larger world of rules, systems, and other Gods who he is subservient to. This God is a smaller God, who often is hamstrung by the rules and system others have created for him and the decisions his children make. This smaller God, I can see being surprised.
These are the two opposite sides of a spectrum, and I don't know how many would be at or close to this "smaller God" concept, but I believe it's at least a significant portion.Comment
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There's way too much data out there past and present, and when combined with an infinite amount of dimensions, there is little mathematical chance that God would be surprise about anything. However, I think he would weep at the opportunity.Comment
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Think about it. I can see God reading Sooner's posts and thinking to himself. Wow, I gave that kid talent and a really great mind and look at the bull crap he keeps coming up with. He then turns to Mother in Heaven and says, "that kid suprises me".Originally posted by clackamascoug View PostComment
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He was making a funny about your favorite author.Originally posted by jay santos View Post"There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
"It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
"Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creeksterComment
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http://www.amazon.com/The-God-Who-We.../dp/1609071883Originally posted by jay santos View Post"There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
"It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
"Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creeksterComment
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Originally posted by Moliere View Post
I don't think that God deals with time the way we do. So as far as my God goes, past, present, and future is kind of irrelevant.Comment
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Does this mean any surprise B-Day party festivities aren't really a surprise.. Man, what a bummer way to live..Comment
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Ah, OK. I know he's a strange person to not like. He's very likable. His approach is large tent. His style is non-confrontational. I should like him. I just have a really hard time with the New Agey view of faith and doctrine he presents. ie faith is the act of choosing to affiliate with believers not actually believing. Plus I'm not big on his Michael Ballam-like dramatic flair. And his wife is super annoying.Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View PostComment
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I don't know if I can but I'll try. I assume that if God knows everything (past, present and future) or like someone later on said that his time is different than ours, that he could be stripped of emotion or at least emotions at a specific point of time. He would basically be in an eternal state of emotion based on the whole of everything that has happened and will happen. So if little Johnny pays his tithing, it doesn't make God happy because that act was already factored into God's eternal state of emotion. If little Johnny starts up his little factory, then it doesn't make God sad because that event was already factored into God's state of emotion, which is eternal and unchanging.Originally posted by jay santos View Post
If God doesn't know everything (but he still knows a lot) then his emotions can change or flux from one act to another similar to what a person experiences when something good or bad happens that was unexpected or at least not fully anticipated.
Some may say that God could know everything and still have differing emotions, such as when a parent sees their child walk for the first time. Even though the parent knows the child will walk it's still a sight to behold for the first time and obviously causes emotion. I'd argue though that if God knows everything then he'd already have experienced the child walking and that would already be set in his current state of emotions.
The Mormon God is one that changes emotions. Sometimes he weeps and sometimes He's happy, which is why I think the Mormon God is much less omniscient than we make him out to be. Granted I've thought about this much more than the average Mormon (or so I assume) but an emotional and omniscient God doesn't really work for me."Discipleship is not a spectator sport. We cannot expect to experience the blessing of faith by standing inactive on the sidelines any more than we can experience the benefits of health by sitting on a sofa watching sporting events on television and giving advice to the athletes. And yet for some, “spectator discipleship” is a preferred if not primary way of worshipping." -Pres. UchtdorfComment
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Yes, I was playing on that theme but intended it to be seriously as well.Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post"Discipleship is not a spectator sport. We cannot expect to experience the blessing of faith by standing inactive on the sidelines any more than we can experience the benefits of health by sitting on a sofa watching sporting events on television and giving advice to the athletes. And yet for some, “spectator discipleship” is a preferred if not primary way of worshipping." -Pres. UchtdorfComment
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He is infinitely more intelligent, has infinitely more experience, has infinitely more power, has infinitely more wisdom, but still I don't think he knows everything and I believe he is still learning and progressing.
Compared to me he is infinitely further along and thus to me he is omniscient.
Can anyone tell me why I would care whether I am right or someone who thinks he has learned everything is right?Comment
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