Members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in the News

[Omaha 680]

Actually there are ranger battalions in the National Guard. So they could be called upon for action on US soil. I remember toting a gun on the streets of New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina as a guardsman. However, in the early days after the hurricane, there were also regular army soldiers doing the same. So they've already broken the Posse Comitatus Act before.

I believe the National Guard are allowed to operate in a state under Posse Comitatus if invited by the Governor.

Edit: I read your post wrong. You already said that essentially.

[SeattleUte]

Yeah, assuming Bundy's supporters are ranchers/cowboys is like assuming everyone who wears a cowboy hat can ride a horse. I'd bet that not one of the Bundy compound outside the family actually owns cows or could even trail a thirsty cow to water. These people are wannabe mercenaries. SU's characterization reinforces my fear, though, that every rancher with a grievance will henceforth be lumped together as a Bundyite .

To your question, I believe that the best way to solve the problem is to place a lien on the cattle and work with the state to not let cattle leave the property without a transfer of ownership to the BLM. Legally, cattle cannot change counties in the West without a brand inspection, and they cannot be sold without a brand inspection transferring title. Further, anything with Bundy's brand would have a lien, no matter where it came from or was sold, that would require sale proceeds to go to the lienholder. Banks do it all the time, and it's pretty effective. This is the nice thing about western states that have strictly enforced brand laws.


I figured someone would bust me on this. My point was that these guys are jokers when compared to any real tactical unit. They're out-manned, outgunned, and outclassed.

cowboy, you may think I'm an effete civil rights lawyer from Seattle clueless about your way of life, but my grandpa (who I knew well) owned a ranch in Utah that is still in the family, and as a boy he herded sheep and was very poor. He taught me to ride a horse and split logs with an ax. I get Bundy for better or worse. I'd invoke Godwin's rule to any comparisons of him to Hitler. I embrace Mormons as being a part of me just as I embrace the Franks, the Batavians, the Angles, and the Saxons as being a part of me. Bundy is what he is and a lot of cowboys are like him. I agree not all of them are.

EDIT: McCarthy's Border Trilogy is one of my favorite books. And strangely enough this Bundy standoff got me thinking of some of the themes in that great literary work.

[TripletDaddy]

He taught me to ride a horse and split logs with an ax.

lol @ goatnapper'96. SeattleUte is a more skilled rancher.

[RC Vikings]

http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/bundy-blm/rancher-s-son-describes-arrest-protest-federal-cattle-roundup

0.jpg

Bundy's son is a proud BYU supporter. This just looks bad.

[cowboy]

cowboy, you may think I'm an effete civil rights lawyer from Seattle clueless about your way of life, but my grandpa (who I knew well) owned a ranch in Utah that is still in the family, and as a boy he herded sheep and was very poor. He taught me to ride a horse and split logs with an ax. I get Bundy for better or worse. I'd invoke Godwin's rule to any comparisons of him to Hitler. I embrace Mormons as being a part of me just as I embrace the Franks, the Batavians, the Angles, and the Saxons as being a part of me. Bundy is what he is and a lot of cowboys are like him. I agree not all of them are.

EDIT: McCarthy's Border Trilogy is one of my favorite books. And strangely enough this Bundy standoff got me thinking of some of the themes in that great literary work.

Please expound. I'll not deny there is plenty of anti-government sentiment, racism and homophobia among cowboys, ranchers, and just rural white folks in general. But there are very few country folk who are willing to take up arms against a government agency; we're not all a bunch of Freemen. To the racism, etc., it has been my experience that rural folk say offensive and very politically incorrect things from time to time, but when push comes to shove, they are pretty accepting.

[RC Vikings]

To the racism, etc., it has been my experience that rural folk say offensive and very politically incorrect things from time to time, but when push comes to shove, they are pretty accepting.

:thumbsup:

[SeattleUte]

Please expound. I'll not deny there is plenty of anti-government sentiment, racism and homophobia among cowboys, ranchers, and just rural white folks in general. But there are very few country folk who are willing to take up arms against a government agency; we're not all a bunch of Freemen. To the racism, etc., it has been my experience that rural folk say offensive and very politically incorrect things from time to time, but when push comes to shove, they are pretty accepting.

I agree with this.

[Northwestcoug]

To your question, I believe that the best way to solve the problem is to place a lien on the cattle and work with the state to not let cattle leave the property without a transfer of ownership to the BLM. Legally, cattle cannot change counties in the West without a brand inspection, and they cannot be sold without a brand inspection transferring title. Further, anything with Bundy's brand would have a lien, no matter where it came from or was sold, that would require sale proceeds to go to the lienholder. Banks do it all the time, and it's pretty effective. This is the nice thing about western states that have strictly enforced brand laws.

Really not knowing anything about the cattle business, this sounds like a very reasonable solution.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Yeah, assuming Bundy's supporters are ranchers/cowboys is like assuming everyone who wears a cowboy hat can ride a horse. I'd bet that not one of the Bundy compound outside the family actually owns cows or could even trail a thirsty cow to water. These people are wannabe mercenaries. SU's characterization reinforces my fear, though, that every rancher with a grievance will henceforth be lumped together as a Bundyite .

Exactly.

To your question, I believe that the best way to solve the problem is to place a lien on the cattle and work with the state to not let cattle leave the property without a transfer of ownership to the BLM. Legally, cattle cannot change counties in the West without a brand inspection, and they cannot be sold without a brand inspection transferring title. Further, anything with Bundy's brand would have a lien, no matter where it came from or was sold, that would require sale proceeds to go to the lienholder. Banks do it all the time, and it's pretty effective. This is the nice thing about western states that have strictly enforced brand laws.

That sounds like a very sensible plan. I hope they do something like this.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Please expound. I'll not deny there is plenty of anti-government sentiment, racism and homophobia among cowboys, ranchers, and just rural white folks in general. But there are very few country folk who are willing to take up arms against a government agency; we're not all a bunch of Freemen. To the racism, etc., it has been my experience that rural folk say offensive and very politically incorrect things from time to time, but when push comes to shove, they are pretty accepting.

This is true. I have relatives that have said (and sometimes still say) some really dumb and offensive things. But most of it comes from culture and ignorance and they are good people.

That being said, Bundy's comments about picking cotton and blacks maybe being better off under slavery are among the most vile and offensive things one could say. That takes the concept of a brain fart/stupid comment to a whole new level.

[old_gregg]

lol @ goatnapper'96. SeattleUte is a more skilled rancher.

"split logs with an axe" is a euphemism in this context, hope that helps.

[Solon]

Bundy's comments about picking cotton and blacks maybe being better off under slavery are among the most vile and offensive things one could say.

This was a surprisingly common point-of-view 50 years ago. Historians now suggest that the movie Gone With The Wind has contributed as much to this misconception as anything because of how its slaves relate to their owners in that film. Gone With the Wind might be the most viewed movie ever made, making this misconception all the more pervasive.

(it's called the paternalism doctrine - that owners looked after their slaves as a kindly father looks after his children. This is indeed how slave-owners often claimed moral authority for engaging in slavery, claiming that wayward slaves needed a firm but loving hand, but it's patently ridiculous. Historian Eugene Genovese dismantled this ideology in the 1960s with his book Roll, Jordan Roll, but the damage had been done).

[cowboy]

That being said, Bundy's comments about picking cotton and blacks maybe being better off under slavery are among the most vile and offensive things one could say. That takes the concept of a brain fart/stupid comment to a whole new level.

I agree. My hell, I haven't heard anything that reprehensible for years. I was in town today and stopped to talk to a group of retired folks I know, and they all said they sympathized with him until he opined on the merits of slavery. Now they unanimously think he's a nut, and they are his same generation with the same culturally biased upbringing.

[YOhio]

One positive takeaway from all of this is that it's tons of fun to say,"let me tell you one thing I know about the [whatever]." Then you go on and same some batshit crazy nonsense about whatever and everyone laughs. I mean, at least at some point I think they'll laugh. They should.

[SeattleUte]

To your question, I believe that the best way to solve the problem is to place a lien on the cattle and work with the state to not let cattle leave the property without a transfer of ownership to the BLM. Legally, cattle cannot change counties in the West without a brand inspection, and they cannot be sold without a brand inspection transferring title. Further, anything with Bundy's brand would have a lien, no matter where it came from or was sold, that would require sale proceeds to go to the lienholder. Banks do it all the time, and it's pretty effective. This is the nice thing about western states that have strictly enforced brand laws.

This must be the way it's done already. The lien is what gives the government the right to arrest the cattle. They will then auction them in a sherriff's sale to satisfy the lien to the extent funds are availalbe. The Bundys will get what's left over if anything.

cowboy, you may be able to pick up some of Bundy's livestock at distressed prices.